Gutted about NI rise

[CarryOnNurse20]

I know we need it and we have so much money to pay off. But we have been scrimping and saving after a hard couple of years. Every penny is accounted for from pay day to pay day. I’m a nurse and my pay has been capped/below inflation my whole career. And now the NI rise means any savings etc we have made will now be gone. I’m gutted.

There are valid arguments around NI vs IT etc., but I am really surprised how badly the idea of paying an extra 1.25% has gone down given that just a year ago many, many ordinary people were clamouring for a 1% tax to fund the NHS.

The generational war is really sad. I'm well aware that I buck the trend, but I'm in my 30s and vastly better off than my parents or grandparents. It is not as simple as saying that "boomers had it good".

Yanbu. It is really shafting workers, especially middle earners. It was worth noting that furlough, Afghanistan, lockdowns etc were always going to cost a fortune, someone has to pay.

I've worked throughout and objected to lockdowns, now I'm expected to pay a load of extra cash to fund mostly pensioners. It's hardly fair.

They are raising NI, do you understand why that's different to raising income tax?

Are you always so incredibly patronising?

I've said multiple times on this thread that in an ideal world I'd like the money to be raised through income tax on higher earners. BUT this solution is far better than not addressing the problem at all. I'm pleased it is finally being tackled.

@lllllllllll

Be careful what you wish for, you’ll all be old one day.

This. I'm really quite staggered at how short-sighted and selfish some people are.

Me too

It’s actually happened. They’ve done something which means I can’t even vote for them to keep out a worse bunch of mismanaging idiots. Sigh.

So Labour, the greens and the yellow ones can’t identify biological sex, have no policies and can barely speak coherently in debate. And now the Tories, who have the power if wanted right now to implement wide ranging reforms to fix multiple broken systems - decided to breach their own manifesto promises (calling it a separate levy doesn’t change reality) and make working people pay more to let boomers hang on the all the wealth.

Yay.

taxing super rich corporations (Amazon made £17.5 billion in sales in the UK in 2019 and paid £293 million in taxes)

Graystray obviously everyone apart from Amazon thinks it should pay more tax. This applies to every country which uses Amazon and presumably governments would tax them if they could.

The government always vote down any euthanasia legislation , I think the last vote was in 2015.
They don't want us to be in charge of our own destiny or open up any clinics here as they have in Switzerland.
I'm all for it personally , but no, our politicians know best apparently:(

@KindnessMyFriends

The national insurance rise should be restricted to 50 years and above including pensioners and be charged on a sliding scale. The more you earn (or the bigger your pension) the more you should pay. I'm 60 and I'll work another 6 years and 9 months and happily pay it on my pension income too. The younger generation have had a terrible deal on housing, unless they are subsidised by parents to get on the housing ladder. .

That wouldn’t be nearly enough money. When you look at age 50 plus, about half of the population is disabled. Disability % increases with age from around 5% under age 25 to 25% in your forties to just over 50% age 50 and up.

What I would like to see is higher immigration into this country, particularly from countries like Afghanistan. More younger people working and paying tax would be a good way to address the social care issue.

But I’m sick to death of young (and not so young) people saying that everything’s the fault of the “boomer” generation, we’ve caused climate change, we’ve caused the NHS/ social care problems, we’ve caused the financial crisis, we had it all - when all we’ve bloody done is not ask to be born and got on with what life’s thrown at us.

The trouble is the Boomer generation have benefited massively although this is not their fault. And we have an ageing population so younger generations do have less. Acknowledging that isn't a slight on older people it's just a fact.

And when you’re paying over 15% mortgage payments, I can assure you there’s no chance of savings.

well my parents managed it & again how long did you pay 15% for?

Restricting it to age 50 and above makes no sense. There are plenty of people in their 30s who earn more than people in their 50s!

What really irritates me is that people constantly (and rightly) complain about how the NHS is being run into the ground, how salaries are too low, how it desperately needs extra funding. Then as soon as the government increases taxes to raise some extra funding, they're fuming. Where do people think the extra money is going to come from?

It simply should not come from the poorest in society who are already struggling. People have struggled to feed their kids during homeschool and lockdown, have their Torys not listened? Yes it needs paying for, but people on lower wages shouldn’t have to pay anymore when they’re already struggling.
We are high earners, it’ll have little impact, we’ll just save less. But I know people who are stressing how they’ll cope at losing £20 a month or whatever. We’ll see more people using food banks and children suffering. It’s disgraceful that this is the way the Torys have chose to raise the money. I just hope people remember this and bite accordingly.

What I would like to see is higher immigration into this country, particularly from countries like Afghanistan. More younger people working and paying tax would be a good way to address the social care issue.

we are going to need more immigrants sooner than later, look at the fertility rate which won't be boosted by today's news & we look even more unattractive to immigrants as they now will get paid even less.

There are plenty of people in their 30s who earn more than people in their 50s!

Statistically though people in their 50s earn more than those in their 30s.

*Vote Not bite 🤣

@BeenAsFarAsMercyAndGrand

The 15% mortgage rates precluded being able to save

They also RAPIDLY inflated away the mortgage debt.

And the 15% rates weren't long term either. They were for a VERY short proportion of the full mortgage term.

What I would like to see is higher immigration into this country
We need to reduce the population, not increase it. We won’t meet our climate change goals if the population keeps going up.

It simply should not come from the poorest in society who are already struggling.

I do think you're right on that point. As I've said, I'd rather it was paid through income tax, with the highest earners paying the most.

I believe Corbyn would have ensured that happened but most people on Mumsnet seemed to despise him.

@KleineDracheKokosnuss

It’s actually happened. They’ve done something which means I can’t even vote for them to keep out a worse bunch of mismanaging idiots. Sigh.

So Labour, the greens and the yellow ones can’t identify biological sex, have no policies and can barely speak coherently in debate. And now the Tories, who have the power if wanted right now to implement wide ranging reforms to fix multiple broken systems - decided to breach their own manifesto promises (calling it a separate levy doesn’t change reality) and make working people pay more to let boomers hang on the all the wealth.

Yay.

The thing is, it is not the old who will benefit from this. Once you are ill or disabled enough to need care, especially residential care, you are unlikely to be using your savings to jet off on holiday or buy caravans etc. So all those assets piling up in the bank will go to heirs. The tories are big fans of the rich passing on their assets.

But don't let that get in the way of you falling for tactics that encourage you in your ageism and ableism.

@bananapumpkin

There are valid arguments around NI vs IT etc., but I am really surprised how badly the idea of paying an extra 1.25% has gone down given that just a year ago many, many ordinary people were clamouring for a 1% tax to fund the NHS.

The generational war is really sad. I'm well aware that I buck the trend, but I'm in my 30s and vastly better off than my parents or grandparents. It is not as simple as saying that "boomers had it good".

I agree with this, but if the generational war is sad, aren't you angry that the government have just fed into it?

I think a lot of the people objecting to this specific measure would be happy to pay increased taxes that were applied in a progressive way. I know I would.

This will result in a massive wealth transfer from the working poor to the more wealthy.

Poorer pensioners won't benefit from this. They don't have expensive houses to sell, and their income will be too low to be subject to much/any taxation. If they are really poor they may still be working past pension age - so they'll actually have to pay the extra NI while their wealthy contemporaries do not.

The pensioners (and their offspring) who will reap the benefit of this decision are those who (a) have large property assets to pass on in inheritance, and/or (b) have higher incomes so they would have had to pay extra tax if it had gone on IT rather than NI.

Ps lots of boomers are still of working age.

So the 1500 who landed from small boats on Kent beaches yesterday thought the UK looked even more unattractive than the countries they travelled through? That's not logical!

Apparently the cabinet haven't even seen the proposals and are expected to simply rubber-stamp them

With no effective opposition Boris can do as he likes and knows it

I don't have a problem with the principle of an increase - after all the money lost during lockdowns some screamed for has to come from somewhere - but for me it should have been levied on all earnings, nt just for those working

@weresouth

There are plenty of people in their 30s who earn more than people in their 50s!

Statistically though people in their 50s earn more than those in their 30s.

The vast majority of people I know in their 50s and 60s live in their homes with a small or no mortgage. My adult children and most of their friends live in rented accommodation in their 20sand 30s despite saving hard and being sensible with money.

Many older people saved money by make do and mend! They did not spend money on needless things, keeping what little money they had for a ‘rainy day’ No latest must have mobile phones or gadgets, take away meal, latest fashions, then because they have been careful they are then told to pay for their care. Older people didn’t have it easy, they just did without and still do.