Muslim mum here, looking for views of of other Muslim mums xx

[fsl409]

Before the summer holidays started, my sister started sending her son (my little nephew, recently turned 5) to madrassa (mosque school) for 1.5 hours every weekday evening after school, leaving no time of energy for him to pursue any other extra curricular interests, clubs or activites that most of his (non-Muslim) friends attend.
My sons are a little older than their cousin but mine have schedules of things like football, swimming and martial arts. They asked me to let them do these things as they really are passionate about them. At first I thought it might be too much for them after a whole day at school, but they really enjoy so I can't complain.
With my nephew, he's become withdrawn, quiet and looks permanantly exhausted. He doesn't seem to have much zest for life and talks with envy about his school friends who are allowed to spend their evenings after school playing sports, going to the park or just doing relaxing things at home or with their families.
Of course I believe it's important to learn about our religion, but I teach my sons about it in a way that fits around their school life, not in a way that takes over every spare minute outside of school hours.
I know my sister loves her son and wants him to grow up as a good and pious Muslim, but I'm concerned that she might be putting her wish for him to attend madrassa every single night for 1.5 before his right to have other interests and do the kind of "fun" activities that his friends do.
Just to be clear, I'm not suggesting there's anything wrong with attending madrassa or studying our religion, I'm just concerned about the amount of time each week my nephew is expected to attend and how this impacts on his opportunities to have other interests or activities.
I even offered to take him to play football with his cousins one evening per week for an hour but my sister was like... 'no, he has madrassa..". AIBU?

1.5 hours per day sounds a lot for a child to do anything on top of school.

Not Muslim mum but do they run the school on a Saturday or Sunday? Friends dc go to polish school all day Saturday so its not as tiring

I think that's a lot to go every day for 1.5 hrs. Other activities are just as important for his development. I'm not Muslim so I don't know how madrassa schooling works, but surely just going say once or twice a week would be better? Leaving him more time to pursue other extra curricula activities and not feel so tired.

Also not Muslim but with some Muslim family. My understanding is that madrassa is quite mentally draining as it's learning on top of school learning so it does seem like a lot for such a young child so quite tiring in a different way to playing sport. My kids do sport 3 school nights of 1 hour and they don't now get tired but they can only cope with about 20 mins of learning of an evening. I'm not sure there is anything you can do though.

I'm a Muslim mum and looking atmadrassa for my daughter but only on the weekends as her weekday is for school and extra curricular activities. Saying that it is hard to find madrassah spaces available on a weekend so it may be a case where its this or nothing for your sister. She may be thinking that it's for a short time and once he's completed Quran he won't need to go everyday and can then make time for extra curricular activities later on around secondary yschool?

Sorry not Muslim here so I don’t know how mosque school works but does he have to attend every evening? Or is there a option of just going a couple of nights a week but your sister is pushing for every night? Is there no weekend school he could attend instead!

I do totally agree that is way too much for a 5 year old after a whole day at school. Has the child’s father said anything? Or any other family members?

So basically this just too much for a 5 year old. I think that your sister is intending for him to learn Arabic intensely so that he can read the Koran in record time. This kind of pressure only suits certain type of kids and is definitely something that 99% of parents in this world would not put their child through. You need to talk to your sister. I think that if the kid is unhappy it is abusive. It’s obvious that this is all about your sisters wishes and desires. Ultimately it’s her decision but it’s worth having a word with her about her child’s happiness, finding balance, importance of good mental health and rest time. He might not be ready for after school activities.

Some places are every day or nothing until the Quran is completed. My son goes on a Sunday. He should be going on a Saturday as well but doesn’t at the moment as he has other activities he follows. His classmate started at a different place at the beginning of the summer break and has been going every day for 2 hours and can already recite many Surahs whilst my son has been going to madrassa since he was 4 ( he’s 5.5 now ) and has still not learnt any Surahs yet. That’s why the emphasis at many places is for everyday or nothing

@Flowerlane

Sorry not Muslim here so I don’t know how mosque school works but does he have to attend every evening? Or is there a option of just going a couple of nights a week but your sister is pushing for every night? Is there no weekend school he could attend instead!

I do totally agree that is way too much for a 5 year old after a whole day at school. Has the child’s father said anything? Or any other family members?

In theory, it's possible to just go a couple of times per week at our local madrassa. Doesn't need to be every day. Child's father isn't really around much, he works very long hours and unsociable shift patterns. I'm not aware of any feelings he might have on the matter as I rarely see him tbh. No other family members have spoken out, I seem to be the only one who is concerned. Perhaps because my own sons are so involved with a healthy variety of different activites I notice the contrast more.

Muslim mum of a 5 year old boy. Basically you’ve outlined why ours isn’t going to madrassa. I think the hours are far too long and require too much out of children and don’t give enough to the children. There are some madrassas that function more like clubs in that time frame but no to just learning after a full day at school.

YANBU. It sounds like she’s preparing him to recite the Quran in record time (I don’t know what it’s called in English but it’s a rite of passage to have done it fully and correctly by a certain age)!

I’m from a Muslim country, half raised by Muslims, we don’t do those😎 the people who do are religious ones. Like the church people who spend all weekdays in youth groups, bible study etc etc.

1.5 hour’s extracurricular every day at 5 is too much, regardless of religion.

Also to add a couple of times a week Is enough! I had religious classes in my own twice a week as well (although we had Islamic studies in school but I wasn’t Muslim )

My kids all attend but because of covid it was only for an hour every evening. They do swimming in the weekends as that's the only time I could get all 4 into their level classes on the same day.
I doubt that at 5 he is super aware of what all his friends are doing but my older 3 all did after school activities, eldest did a coding club, youngest attended a football club and my daughter tried a few different ones before she also chose a sport.
My youngest madrasa going child hasn't done anything other than school, multiple isolations and an hour's madrasa which she only just started at

1. She tried a few of the after school clubs but it was a hit and miss in regards to if she wanted to stay for club or not.

She's actually gained alot more confidence and made quite alot of new friends since she started madrasa 6 months ago. She loves to try and read the next lesson and has learned extra at home during the summer holidays as she wants to surprise her class teacher when they go back next week. Im sure if your sister was very worried about him she'd try and get a private madrasa tutor for the weekends instead but I think you might be projecting a little bit based on the fact that you are taking a different route in regards to the madrasa attendance of your own children.

Not muslim but worked for long time in muslim country. None of my muslim friends kids at that age would have that much religious schooling after school hours (and to be clear, not even during school hours). I mean seriously how much will he even retain and how much will he resent at one point. Working through the Quran is not supposed to be a race who can do it fastest; what lessons is he having? Does he speak Arabic or is he also memorising a language he doesn’t even understand? Being pious in any religion is best taught by parents who practice what they preach and lead by example in my view.

Poor little lad :-(

It sounds like it's too much for the kid and he's struggling. Poor thing.
Not a lot you can do though.

Muslim here. That's too much at his age as he is still too young. If your sister does want him to learn and then finish Qaran as soon as possible then this is not the way to go about it.

He will probably be too tired to give it as much focus as it needs. Also, he is only 5 so his attention span is probably quite limited.

Learning about and implementing our beautiful religion takes time, patience and dedication.

I think your sister needs to scale back and let him also be a little boy, who does Cotherstone things as well otherwise he might resent her later on

At 5 a child doesn't have the intellectual/comprehension skills to understand the Quran - all that can be going on is parrot fashion repetition. 1.5 hours every night of religious study after a day at school is quite shocking.
A child at that age needs to play.

I would tend towards your style of parenting, but your sister obviously has different views.
Not madrassa, but the kids used to go to school on a Saturday. That has different impacts on social life - miss class or go to a party.... We have moved to DH teaching at home. It is clearly not as effective, and progress is slower (slowed further by covid restricting time with the PiL when the majority language switches), but it opens up other opportunities.

Rather than focusing on just madrassa, can you talk about struggling with work load/commitments/priorities, or talk about how tired he is without assigning cause, and see where things go? But be gentle. The school wouldnt offer every night if it didnt work for some families.

I rented space to a madrasah - they do vary a lot. Yes they go nightly but the one at ours did games, activities (similar to those in scouts) as well as religious activities. Koran studies only get intense at secondary age. The guy that set this one up did so to offer a different kind of madrasah and it doubles up as after school care

Thinking from a totally different perspective...if the little boys dad is rarely around is the mum looking for respite child care for 1.5 hours after school without having to drop off/pick up at loads of clubs??

I doubt he's memorising anything at 5. He's only just learning to recognise the letters of the Arabic alphabet unless he's been attending since he was 2 which I doubt. No one can force a child to memorise the Qur'an, it's a skill that very few have at such a young age and unless she's been reciting to him at home I doubt he knows more than the shortest 3 lined surahs by heart.

Muslim here.
Not sure how much of a Muslim response you expected on MN tbh. It’s not exactly full of vocal Muslim parents. And threads about Islam tend to go very badly on here.
But anyway….
My 6 year old does an hour 3 days a week and then ‘Sunday school’ for 3 hours.
Every day can be a bit much but plenty of kids do it.
You start early because obviously no one can just suddenly be able to read the Quran.
You have to learn the alphabet and the the way sounds are formed and then be able to say words etc. This takes at least a year, then a couple of years to become fluent in reading. Kids retain much more the earlier they start esp learning to read a new language.

In Sunday school they learn much more about the meaning and stories of the Quran so they have an understanding of what they are learning to read. They also do fun engaging activities as groups about how to be good citizens and contribute positively to society. So they learn about charity and doing good deeds for others, how to show kindness, and help people. Etc.

My kids do swimming on Saturdays and a school based after school club one day. That’s it.
Not everyone is rushing to extra curricular activities every day esp when parents are working and lives are busy.

You clearly have an issue. I agree 1.5 hours 5 days a week is a lot. But you clearly have a problem with the madrasah issue overall. Some madrasahs don’t allow part time attendance. We were lucky that we could do 3 days.

You can raise it again I guess and suggest other madrasah options if you can find them.

@gogohm
Ours is similar, at 5 my dd does a lot of learning through play not sitting in a classroom and parroting verses as many on here seem to think.
They have different activities planned on different days through which they learn the alphabet, some basic etiquite and Islamic manners, they do crafts and colouring, and alot more fun stuff throughout ages 5-11. It's only after 10 that things get intense and that is only for those children who want to memorise the Qur'an and not everyone does