Accused of benefit fraud

[cakeinspiration]

I think my daughters dad and his girlfriend have reported me for benefit fraud. Is there any way I can find out if it was them or not?
I had my girl when I was 18 and split up with his dad when she was 6 months old. He got together with his girlfriend just before our daughter turned one. My girly is now 4.
I think his girlfriend is jealous of me because she loves kids but can't have any yet for whatever reason. She's told me she can't wait to be a mum and always tells me how lucky I am as my daughter is so polite and she loves her loads. I guess I'm happy that my daughter has someone who loves her a lot but sometimes feel like she's a bit much.
AnywY I met my partner a year ago and he stays at mine sometimes, maybe 2 or 3 nights a week. His 2 daughters (7 and 10) come and stay at mine too. I only have 2 bedrooms so the kids share my daughter's room or the living room.
I got a call the other week from the council asking if I share my home with anyone and I said no. My partner rents his own flat so pays council tax there and my council tax is just for me and my daughter, I have universal credit to go towards rent which is for my flat that I got when I moved out of my parent's house just before I had my daughter.
My partner and I don't want to move in yet as it would be hard for us to afford a place big enough for the kids, and we would lose out on universal credit and I don't think we can afford it.
The council lady said they might come and do a home check in the next couple of weeks and I'm really worried about it, what can they do? Will I get kicked out of my flat?

It's all a myth that someone can stay over 2/3 nights per week. In the eyes of the tax credit people, if people around you consider you to be in a partnership or a couple, you have to declare them. For council tax, it's if you have any of their belongings in your house that would mean they could stay for a period without the need to return to their usual place of residence. So my partner had his own place and stayed at mine on weekends. On social media, we were a couple and everyone saw us that way. So tax credits/council tax discount had to stop. My partner then moved in with me and contributed the equivalent of my lost tax credits and council tax deductions to cover my loss as a single household. This was almost 10 years ago.

As long as your other half pay councils tax rent bills elsewhere and has proof of this and has no bills or credit or not on the electoral roll at your house there shouldn’t be a problem
They might assume stuff but it’s what they can prove so in my experience before they have even visited you they will do checks for any credit taken out in his name at your address bills like sky and internet DVLA driving licence at your address
I would move stuff that’s his and his girls

@Grinch48 I could prove all that, he was on electoral role at his address, car tax, bills etc. But the wording was "do other people consider you to be a couple". And we clearly was. So could no longer claim anything. I wasn't claiming anything I didn't believe I was entitled to as he worked away and only stayed here on a weekend.

@entropynow @NigellasCookalong @LookAtMoiPloise I know someone who did this. The DWP turned up and opened every cupboard in her house. She lost all her benefits as a result. You are giving the OP false information. 2/3 nights a week is a regular amount.

I had this when i am positive it was my DP ex reporting me a few years ago before we did live together.
I was interviewed under caution at the job centre. But I could prove he lived elsewhere and had all his bills, bank, car insurance at this other address.
He was the same stayed over odd nights a week and weekends
They were really nice and reassuring when I advised I thought it was malicious reporting and said they would make a note incase it happened again

The turn2us website has some info on this. The 3 nights a week thing is a myth, you can have someone stay in your house as often as you like.
But the benefits people have targets for stopping claims so you'd be wise to play their game. Remove obvious items from your house and shut down your social media. Contact citizens advice for support.
If your OP is truthful and your partner is paying bills including council tax at another property then you don't have any need to worry. I know it's very upsetting and stressful but try to keep calm. Its just box ticking for them.

@PheasantsNest you are giving incorrect advice. 2-3 nights a week is NOT living together. OP can speak to CAB and they will confirm this. I used to volunteer in the benefits appeal team over there and that’s not classed as living together. Being on benefits doesn’t mean you can’t have a partner who regularly overnight visits.

There is no set limit of how many nights a person can have someone over and it should be fine as long he has a permanent address that he can provide bills for and doesn’t provide OP with any financial support. If your friend lost her benefits then there’s far more to that situation than you know.

OP, speak to CAB. They will put your mind at rest.

I do benefits advice! As long as your partner is maintaining a home elsewhere then you do not have a problem, those who have been harder to prove are when the partner claims to live with a parent/friend and has no utilities, mortgage or rental contract to link them there (you can have bank statements and car documents go to any address so they do not count) - councils and dwp will red flag such situations as possible benefit fraud and potentially observe movements from a property hence the 3 nights max suggestion. We advise clients to be truthful and to tell the relevant authorities if a partner is now staying more than half the week

Benefits people could open every cupboard in my house
Not sure what they think they’d find to use as ‘proof’ of anything I have 4 kids who I clothe and feed 2 of those are adult sized 16/19 boyfriend has his own house where be lives, pays mortgage, council tax and bills food etc he sometimes pays for food here if he’s round, but his bank statement doesn’t say on his statement ‘bought food for tinkerbell house’ on it? I pay all my own bills too. Nothing crosses over as we pay our own way or 50:50 for meals together out.

We may be a couple but he’s not responsible for me or my house/kids/bills as he has his own. And can prove that I think that’s the point, it’s when things become blurry that you can’t prove he doesn’t contribute to your bills/household.

@PheasantsNest

Were you honest with them? Staying regularly two or three nights a week sounds quite often.

So people on benefits can’t have guests stay over? 🙄

@Redkatagain

I had this exact situation. I had this exact situation around council tax. My partner lived elsewhere within the same district and we both expected to be staying at each other's guest. Mummy enquired about the council tax situation it turned out regular thing we'll both required to pay full council tax and neither of us was entitled to the 25% single person discount even though we were not living together.

In effect we will both required to pay for council tax as though we were a couple at both addresses.

You were informed incorrectly and should have gone to the CAB.

For you to pay council tax at a residence it needs to be your main home.

My DP use to do a role dealing with councils and benefits for vulnerable people, and lots of council/benefit people make things up then back each other up.

@PheasantsNest. My late husband worked on DWP benefit fraud. They can’t just turn up at someone’s home and search it. They have to apply for a warrant and have a police escort - and more importantly, actual evidence of wrongdoing, rather than just suspicion and here say.

If the call was from the council this will relate to council tax (or something else you’re claiming from the council) rather than benefits won’t it?
Agree you need a court order to enter someone’s home. They may have already sat outside your house without you knowing though as it’s a public area

If your on UC like myself then councils are now linked with them (my local council is so I assume all are) and they constantly share info with each other so I'm going to assume the UC will very shortly hear about this from your council and they will start their own investigations too. Within my council nobody in a council house can have their partners staying for any nights, I've been through the malicious reporting in the past and was even told a partner so much as buying a loaf of bread is deemed living together as it is contributing to the house, I'd be very careful from here on and remove every trace of your boyfriend. I do suspect though that you aren't being entirely truthful on how often your boyfriend stays, my friend has her own house and so does her partner but he spends every single night at her house barely goes home, both council properties and it frustrates me as we have a shortage of social housing and they are doing what they are, separate houses, claiming separate = more money, u have to claim UC to top up my wages just to get by yet people commit fraud and seemingly get away with it.

I would hide your partner and his girls things when they come to do the visit. That said I don't see how they can stop you having visitors?!

Do you ever stay with him?

Is the property he rents big enough for him & his kids?

They will be suspicious if the reality is:

• they are often all at yours & you are never at his
• he rents a tiny one bed etc in order to show he has his own place but is barely there & it has no room for his kids
• he has loads of stuff at yours. Be careful about things like paying for a residents parking permit if you don't drive/own a car but he does.

Unfortunately it’s the ones who really take the piss who cause hassle for people like the OP. I actually knew a lady with 2 girls, nice woman but she moved her partner fully in and he contributed around £800 a month , she carried on claiming as a single mum all the time I knew her which was a couple of years— I cooled the friendship as it really pissed me off— it was social housing too, so modest rent. She was actually better off than two of us working full time with a reasonable sized mortgage. They have a job to do OP sadly, even though you have done nothing wrong— I would just have stuff ready to hand to show he has a separate place he pays for.

@gogohm

There's a set number of nights you can have a partner stay over before it affects benefits, I think it's 3 days maximum. If he's got another property he's paying council tax for you shouldn't have an issue.

There really isn't.

Op. I think as long as he has evidence of his own place that he pays council tax on, rent on etc it’s fine. If he does not, then there is an issue.

I would also suggest removing his stuff and extra beds for the foreseeable until the case is closed though.

You will be fine, just pack his toothbrush and clothes up into a suitcase, put it out of sight.

@Carrottopppp

If your on UC like myself then councils are now linked with them (my local council is so I assume all are) and they constantly share info with each other so I'm going to assume the UC will very shortly hear about this from your council and they will start their own investigations too. Within my council nobody in a council house can have their partners staying for any nights, I've been through the malicious reporting in the past and was even told a partner so much as buying a loaf of bread is deemed living together as it is contributing to the house, I'd be very careful from here on and remove every trace of your boyfriend. I do suspect though that you aren't being entirely truthful on how often your boyfriend stays, my friend has her own house and so does her partner but he spends every single night at her house barely goes home, both council properties and it frustrates me as we have a shortage of social housing and they are doing what they are, separate houses, claiming separate = more money, u have to claim UC to top up my wages just to get by yet people commit fraud and seemingly get away with it.

The council cannot stop you from having anyone stay overnight, not even a partner. That would be a massive infringement of human rights.

And the "buying a loaf of bread is deemed living together" is nonsense too, otherwise any gifts of food or even paying for a meal out would be deemed contributing to the household.

With social housing, they tend to like to know who's living in their properties because it can cause problems if they ever have to take eviction proceedings if they don't, but that's not a benefits issue.

If his kids sleep at yours 3 nights a week and mainly with his ex they sleep at yours more than his?

I agree with above post that it does sound you're either more of a couple than you realise OR he's taking the mick/cocklodger as your home is basically his kids second home?

[quote user1471457751]@Haffdonga stop being so dramatic. Sharing a takeaway once a week isn't benefit fraud.[/quote]
I fortunately @Haffdonga is NOT being dramatic - the DWP are! It's true. Spit on in fact

*Unfortunately

*spot on

Is it DWP or UC?
Surveillance isn’t carried out anymore, not here in any case. They don’t look in drawers, not unless you invite them to.
I’m surprised a home visit is being conducted during covid, our offices aren’t even open to the public yet….

If he has his own place and pays rent/council tax and can show utility usage I’m surprised they are bothering to investigate you.
Agree with what sunnysidedownbriefly has said.