Accused of benefit fraud

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I think my daughters dad and his girlfriend have reported me for benefit fraud. Is there any way I can find out if it was them or not?
I had my girl when I was 18 and split up with his dad when she was 6 months old. He got together with his girlfriend just before our daughter turned one. My girly is now 4.
I think his girlfriend is jealous of me because she loves kids but can't have any yet for whatever reason. She's told me she can't wait to be a mum and always tells me how lucky I am as my daughter is so polite and she loves her loads. I guess I'm happy that my daughter has someone who loves her a lot but sometimes feel like she's a bit much.
AnywY I met my partner a year ago and he stays at mine sometimes, maybe 2 or 3 nights a week. His 2 daughters (7 and 10) come and stay at mine too. I only have 2 bedrooms so the kids share my daughter's room or the living room.
I got a call the other week from the council asking if I share my home with anyone and I said no. My partner rents his own flat so pays council tax there and my council tax is just for me and my daughter, I have universal credit to go towards rent which is for my flat that I got when I moved out of my parent's house just before I had my daughter.
My partner and I don't want to move in yet as it would be hard for us to afford a place big enough for the kids, and we would lose out on universal credit and I don't think we can afford it.
The council lady said they might come and do a home check in the next couple of weeks and I'm really worried about it, what can they do? Will I get kicked out of my flat?

I believe the main thing is that you need to demonstrate that your finances are completely separate. I used to work with someone who was convicted of benefit fraud and amongst other things they used evidence that her DP had paid for her hair appointments as proof that their finances were linked.

In that particular case he was also a financially abusive cock who controlled her completely, and clearly didn't live anywhere else but sadly she believed that he was "treating" her.

@PyjamasAndWellies

I know someone who had this happen to them, her dp stayed over sometimes (as you would expect) and someone reported him as living there (he wasnt)

They were told that he wasnt allowed to stay over even occasionally. The idea that they can stay 3 nights a week is a myth apparently, they arent allowed to stay over at all. It's obviously ridiculous, people have a right to a relationship for gods sake. She was just given a warning, they said please dont do it again and that was the end of the matter. I really doubt you would get in any trouble

That's crazy. Of course people are allowed to have other people to stay overnight!

As long as there is evidence that he has his own place, eg tenancy agreement/mortgage, council tax bill, bank statements and other official correspondence etc sent to his home, the DWP are very unlikely to deem you to be cohabiting.

Making sure that he doesn't have clothes etc kept at yours is good advice though, OP. Also be clear that he doesn't eat at yours every night, that he does his laundry at his place and stuff like that.

There used to be a particularly unpleasant bloke in the housing benefit team here, who once insisted that the presence of a man's razor in a woman's flat was proof that her boyfriend was living there. It was her razor, ffs! And her BF had a beard.

I won 3 appeals against him, and he hated my guts.

@LakieLady a razor wtf woman don't shave their legs then sounds like he should not have been working there. Imagine the stress he caused people

If they are watching OP then it will look a bit odd her suddenly getting all his stuff out her flat?

Remove all their property from your place and no more sleepovers.
Then you can honestly say you live singly.

@2catsandhappy

Remove all their property from your place and no more sleepovers. Then you can honestly say you live singly.

Agree.

It could have been anyone who reported you, it’s not really in your exes interests to try and reduce the income in your home but who knows. It also could have come about if your partner has used your address for something. If your partner has a rental agreement, pays council tax and has bills at another property you have nothing to worry about. Perhaps he would give you a copy of something not too personal (rental agreement or council tax?) to send them? He doesn’t have to but it would save you hassle!

I was told, by someone at the benefits office, that the "3 nights a week rule" is, and always has been a myth. There is no set number of nights someone is allowed to stay. As long as you can prove that he doesn't contribute financially towards the household. However they said there's an element of personal judgment and some people think you should never be allowed an overnight guest. I was told this could, potentially, mean your dp buying a takeaway could be seen as contributing. They also said it would be unlikely that they would class it as such on the basis that your mum, or a friend could also treat you to a takeaway.

And if they use number of toothbrushes as an official measure of how many people live there then I'm screwed. I think there are about 6 in my bathroom. There are 3 people who live here and we are all single
(Well I guess the teens might not be but they don't have guests over). And there are men sized shoes and clothes. Because I have man sized teens.

I think it's more likely to be your neighbours who have reported you OP, as three children in a 2 bed flat is likely to be much noisier than one.

For the purposes of the home check, get him to take all his stuff and his kids stuff back to his place until it's done. And if you're really worried, suspend visits until the check is done. I'd assume your DP is supportive and will be mature about that.

2-3 nights isn't a big deal, but for simplicity unless you've said otherwise just say 2 nights. Tenants are allowed to have visitors. And he's paying council tax on a place so it should be clear you're not trying to fiddle anything.

If they are watching OP then it will look a bit odd her suddenly getting all his stuff out her flat

It's unlikely they've got people doing surveillance on a flat with ambiguous evidence. It's more likely that a neighbour has grassed and will have their phone at the ready.

I don't understand - why are his DC sleeping at your place if he doesn't live there? You obviously don't mean for the odd sleepover or they wouldn't have their own stuff at yours.

I don't think you are intentionally doing anything wrong but this man appears to be moving himself and his children in by stealth. Is this really what is best for you and your DD?

Actually, do you enjoy keeping the stuff of three extra people in your flat? If it gets under your feet this is a good time and good excuse to get rid. The kids can just bring a bag when they visit. I wouldn't leave their stuff lying around. Maybe you can all split visit nights between both of your places from now on?

I hope it all goes okay.

So much conflicting advice on this thread.

I think if I were you, I'd box up their stuff and hide it at the back of a cupboard somewhere and have no overnight visits for a few weeks. It's better to be safe than sorry, I think.

Just out of curiosity, do you spend most of the other days at his home?

[quote Imatramp1]@LakieLady a razor wtf woman don't shave their legs then sounds like he should not have been working there. Imagine the stress he caused people[/quote]
He was utterly foul. He behaved as though every penny paid in housing benefit came directly out of his own pocket.

He was also intimidating. While we were waiting for the appeal on one of these cases, he saw the claimant early one morning, near the home of the bloke she was alleged to be living with. He demanded to know what she was doing there, and told her that he would add this to the evidence, as it was proof that she was living with the man. She was really upset.

Her friend had broken his leg, and early every morning, she used to go to his house and take his dog for a walk.

Her neighbours had "informed" on her. They really resented the fact that she had a flat of her own but spent very little time there, preferring to visit friends and family. This was because she hated being at home alone. She had MH issues and an LD, and she found being alone all day and night made her MH a lot worse.

The tribunal that heard the appeal were brilliant, and I've never got so much satisfaction from winning an appeal than I did from that one. The look on the odious bloke's face was a picture.

He took early retirement not long afterwards, thankfully.

A minor point to what others have said, but try to refer to him as your 'boyfriend' rather than your 'partner'. I know it might sound silly, it's all about how they perceive the relationship.

It could be anyone that has reported you. Have you considered your partner's ex partner or his or her families and friends?

They may resent his children being around at yours so much - it may be that it appears as if you do all his child care. Are they shared 50/50? Do they have bedrooms at his place? How much of their stuff is at your house?

There may be concerns about where all the children are sleeping. Do they have proper beds?

@2catsandhappy

Remove all their property from your place and no more sleepovers. Then you can honestly say you live singly.

Why should OP not be allowed to have her partner stay round?

That's ridiculous.

So either he is living there sometimes, with his DC, and contributing to your bills etc which = benefit fraud.

Or - he isn't contributing, which = Cheeky Fucker Wannabe Cocklodger.

Has this just crept up on you OP? Might be time to re-evaluate how much of his/their time is spent at yours, to the financial detriment of yourself and your DD.

I wouldn't have their things there. Bag them up and get him to take them home with him. As its a sign someone else is living there.

Surely the only way they can actually prove anything is by having photographic evidence that they’d been living there. My DP has had to move out but hopes to come back soon (very complicated situation), lots of his stuff is still here - stuff in a house means nothing, it’s not an actual person, just stuff 🤷🏻‍♀️

Why should OP not be allowed to have her partner stay round?

That he is referred to as PARTNER is problematic. If he is your partner OP and and your are financially enmeshed then you could be in trouble. even if he does not live with you full time.

@ChateauMargaux

www.advicenow.org.uk/guides/survival-guide-benefits-and-living-together

Two seperate households is evidence that he is not living with you. I am sorry you are being investigated. If someone implies that one or two nights a week is problematic, ask them to show you where the rules state that.

The two or three nights rule doesn’t apply any more. They now do it on merit according to what constitutes full time occupation. The council may or may not carry out a home check but in cases where they do, and suspect fraud, surveillance will monitor who goes in and out and at what times of the day. Evidence from that will be used to determine what’s going on. If the OP’s DP has his own place and there’s evidence of him paying bills/council tax there, then there shouldn’t be a problem if he and his kids stay over for the odd night. What does matter is UC - if the DP is making any kind of contribution to the household, the OP would be expected to declare it.

There's a set number of nights you can have a partner stay over before it affects benefits, I think it's 3 days maximum. If he's got another property he's paying council tax for you shouldn't have an issue.