AIBU - no being able to forgive my MIL?

[beboopbadoop]

I'm struggling a bit with this at the moment and it's really difficult because my DH thinks I'm being unreasonable and that I irrationally hold onto things - maybe I do, but I don't know how to let go of them, and they are starting to eat away at me.

So basically my MIL and I have had a difficult relationship at times. These are the main points I get stuck on (sorry for the very long post!)

About 5 years ago: About a week after my DH proposed (after being together for 5 years) we met up with his parents at this outdoor event. When we arrived I was in the car talking to my MIL's sister (who is really lovely). She works at a wedding venue so we were talking about how maybe we could look into it for our wedding. I was excited about being engaged and it was nice to talk about some plans, even though we weren't thinking about getting married for a year or so. My MIL came up to the car and I rang off the phone, said hello, and said oh I was just on the phone to your sister, we were talking about maybe using where she works as the wedding venue. My MIL cut me off and said 'Oh I don't want to talk about that now, why do we have to talk about that now?' and I was a bit surprised but said ok and we all walked together to the event. Then later she starts saying that we wouldn't be getting married for a while so we don't need to think about it now, why do I have to start planning so early, weddings are so expensive, why do you have to spend so much money (I hadn't booked anything at this point). I was kind of upset because I was excited about being engaged and this was the first time I'd seen my husband's parents since he proposed so I thought it would be nicer. Anyway, later she'd had a few drinks and started saying to my FIL - 'why haven't you ever asked me to marry you?' (they're not married)? and I was like 'ok I get it now, I don't think her reaction is actually to do with me' but I was kind of pissed off that she was taking the nice edge off being newly engaged for me. Later on we go back to their house for dinner, and through the whole dinner my MIL kept talking about how if I had children I wouldn't breastfeed and would 'just feed them from jars' how I wouldn't cook proper food for them - she kept going on about it and it really upset me - not because I think there is anything wrong with not breastfeeding etc, just that she meant it in a mean way towards me. I'm terrible at confrontation so didn't say anything, but got really upset in the car on the way home. My DH said he hadn't realised anything was wrong but he rang her and said that I was really upset and she came over and said sorry and was crying but that it was to do with something else (not sure why I was bearing the brunt of whatever else was going on but hey ho). I was still upset but decided to just move on with life.

Then, when we did eventually get married I really enjoyed organising it and making stuff. I spent quite a while on the table plan and consulted my husband about his family members and who should sit where because I didn't know some of them that well. The day before the wedding we were finishing everything off and family and friends came to help. My BIL saw the table plan and kicked up a fuss because he was sitting near some family members he didn't like (my husband hadn't mentioned anything about this). My BIL said he wouldn't sit there and literally moved his place name and knife and fork to the corner of another table but all the tables had 10 places so it was really squished in. I got upset and was saying that the meal is only an hour or 2 so couldn't he just deal with it for a couple of hours ( my BIL was in his mid 20s at this point) because I'd spent a lot of time making the table plan and the tables were equally laid out. My DH was being a bit wishy washy about it and not saying anything, and I got really upset and went and cried in the car BUT nobody knew I was there - while I was there I heard my MIL slagging me off to my husband, saying I should have thought about it more etc, my DH was pretty weak and didn't back me up. He found me eventually and I told him I had heard everything they had said, and was really angry and upset (the night before my wedding!). Only at that point did he go and say that his brother had to sit there, it would only be for a short amount of time etc. I was supposed to go for dinner with my bridesmaids but this whole event took over and I ended up having take away pizza at home with them and I spent the night before my wedding exhausted with a red puffy face.

Next - this is the most unforgivable thing and I don't think I will ever get over it. I have previously posted about it before on here: Last year I had a stillbirth. We live abroad now away from family. About a week after the birth my parents came to visit, they booked a hotel, they gave me space when I needed it (which was a lot) and were happy to just be there for me when I needed them to be and brought books to read when I needed the space. My BIL was very kind and offered to visit us and look after us/cook for a few days and he offered to stay in an Airbnb - in the end he didn't come but it was a really nice offer. My PIL came to visit and my husband said that they couldn't stay in our 1 bedroom apartment because I felt I needed the space to cry and grieve in private when I felt I had to. His Mum made a fuss about how they couldn't stay with us but booked somewhere else. They arrived the evening of our baby's funeral. The next day we met up and went out for a walk but his Mum kept bringing up the fact we said they couldn't stay in our flat. She also said ''you wouldn't expect your brother to stay in an airbnb would you?' and I felt like saying 'yes we would, but we didn't need to as he offered to stay in an airbnb because he isn't an horribly insensitive person like you.' but once again, I didn't say anything - I know I should've but I was in such a state after losing the baby, going through birth and burying our baby boy in a foreign country that I just wanted to get away from her. My husband didn't say much but to be fair he was also struggling and traumatised from the whole experience. I was absolutely livid and walked away and ignored her for the rest of the day. She kept saying 'oh we came too soon, you're not ready for us to visit' and I wanted to scream 'f**k you - it's your behaviour that's causing the problem' but I didn't. Also when they were here after losing the baby I was talking about my experience, and my MIL interrupted me to have a joke with my FIL about something he was doing in the kitchen, literally whilst I was in the middle of talking about my stillbirth. I cried a lot about that time because I felt that even after I had a stillbirth, she still had to be the centre of attention and that my needs came second.

Anyway, fast forward to now and I'm pregnant again - 8 months. It's been a tough time for me and my husband because we haven't seen any family since last year and the covid lockdowns and restrictions whilst grieving for a baby and dealing with the anxieties of being pregnant again have been hard. A few months ago we were hoping family could visit - My parents offered to stay in a hotel again but in the end due to delta I said no visitors from the UK as I wasn't vaccinated at that point. My parents just said 'ok no worries, we'll come when you feel ready'. Then I had to have a long and painful conversation with my PIL about it and my MIL kept on about how she wasn't scared of getting the virus, and comparing me to other pregnant family members (who's experiences are totally different from mine) and how they would be ok with it. I felt frustrated that I can't just say 'I don't want visitors at the moment because I'm pregnant and feel vulnerable and the numbers are going up in the UK' and she just accepts it. My husband literally said nothing the whole call and I got really angry afterwards because I am fed up of it only being me saying something.

So now I will be double vaccinated and my parents are visiting and my PIL would like to visit but my husband is afraid of telling them they can't stay here (I still don't want anyone to stay and especially not after the way they behaved last time.) My husband is currently off work sick due to stress (I think partially due to the difficult circumstances of the last year) and so I don't feel I can really push him on this right now but I really want to get it sorted.

As I write this I know that it's really up to my husband to deal with this but his mother is really overbearing and both he and his sister have quite bad anxiety I think from childhood trauma of having such an overbearing mum. Both my DH and FIL both just go along with it because it means their lives are easier. Also it's not like she's this horrible witch the whole time, she can be kind and generous and has helped us in different ways, but I think she always has to been the centre of attention and how she feels and what she wants to do is the most important thing to her.

I feel like she has messed up every major thing I've gone through with my husband with her selfishness and inability to think that other people may think differently to her. I don't want her to do the same with this experience with my rainbow baby but don't know how to stop it from happening. When I talk to my husband he says I should let things go but I said I will never let go of the stillbirth incident. I hate how he makes it seem like I am being overly sensitive (perhaps with the first 2 incidents but definitely not the third) and it's easier for him to shift everything on to me rather than just be firm with his mother - upsetting me is easier to deal with than upsetting his mum. I worry that in the future my MIL will want to do something dangerous (for example take small children in the car without a car seat - something she tried to do with our niece) and that my husband won't have the balls to stand up to her about it if I'm not there.

AIBU? If so, how do I work through this, and if not, how can I stop it from happening in the future. Would appreciate any advice!

Sorry posted too soon. When I do see my mil and she starts with the moaning and put downs I just act like I wasn’t paying attention and say something completely random, ie:
Mil: Your water tastes so awful here
Me: Yeah I was talking to (mutual friend) yesterday, I can’t believe (son’s name) is already 12 years old!
Throws her for an absolute loop and shuts her up good.

Just to say you don’t have to forgive her. I wouldn’t. I personally would only communicate with her via your DH, I wouldn’t call her etc. An option is to challenge her as others have said, but be aware this is likely to blow things up and doesn’t sound like your DH really has your back. Other option is just to have a really superficial relationship- Don’t tell her anything, just the bare minimum. Don’t expect a normal relationship and this minimises the disappointment.

Best wishes with your pregnancy x

I am so sorry you lost your baby boy. Use that grief to protect yourself from your MIL. Don't explain why, just say 'no, that's not possible'. If she continues to push, say 'it's sounds as if it will upset you to visit and not stay with us. Please feel free not to visit.'

Pushing back gets easier the more you do it. Decide what you want to happen before you speak to her and don't accept anything more.

People like your MIL only do nice stuff when it serves them well. Breaking off while you were sharing something so heartbreaking tells you all you need to know you this woman.

So sorry for your loss

Your both -well actually your DH does ! -need to stand up to her as this will continue forever and you don't want that attitude around your child.

Tell DH if PIL turn up and are not booked to stay elsewhere you will be decamping to a hotel room for some TLC for the duration.

I had a MIL like this. We are now NC with her and have been for nearly 4 years. She had good points, which I miss. However, the always needing things to be her way, handing us an eviction notice on our DS 1st Christmas Eve and saying "Merry Christmas", not allowing my DW to say goodbye to her grandparent who we had always been there for, when she hadn't and refusing to tell her when the funeral service was, was just unforgivable to both of us. She has since turned DW family against us. I did used to speak up but it didn't really matter. She would always have to have her way. It was toxic and I didn't want our DC around that. She's missed out on so much. She did it to herself though. I hope you or your DH can sit down and explain to her how she has hurt you. Ultimately, you need to do what is best for your family and your mental health. Lots of luck.

I see why it's difficult to stand up to her. You are trying to keep the peace and make things better but there is no point because she doesn't like you. It's not about you she wouldn't like any DIL so remember this. Nothing you do will change her opinion of you so you might as well stand up for yourself and get what you want rather than continuing to try to please her and ending up unhappy. It is not unreasonable to ask her to stay elsewhere so just tell her and be firm. Be polite and friendly but firm.

Good luck.

Wrenna I'd love tk do that to my Mil I've mentioned talking nonsense to them before but dh not on board. It's hilarious though.

Op.. I don't think you should forgive her and I don't think any more happy times should be sacrificed

I’m so sorry about your loss.

I agree with others that you need to stand up to her and if that means a blazing row and the end of the relationship then so be it. I had a similar issue with FIL and he took it too far one time. I told him his behaviour was no longer going to be accepted. Ended up in a huge row and storming out. He has never done it again and the situation is a lot better now - I would go so far as to say he respects me. It doesn’t work out like that for everyone but unless you put your foot down it’s going to continue on especially when you have children. Life is too short.

Stop allowing her to be overbearing. Tell her they aren’t staying with you, tell them when they can come. If your dh won’t stand up to her, you will have to in order to save your mental health and that of your dh. He is clearly still deeply in the FOG.

Unfortunately if your DH doesnt have a backbone, it all falls to you.

“You can’t stay with us. If that’s a problem, don’t visit”

When she asks what your DH thinks, and he’s a wet lettuce, you interject with “DH respects my wishes on this issue, and agrees with me”

Yanbu
It doesn't have to be long and drawn out, when MIL starts, just cut her off with a "I said No". It doesn't matter if you become the 'bad guy' for a bit. You'll have to learn to stick up for yourself and your children soon enough anyway or everyone will take advantage /do things that are not best for your children.

Be clear like other PPs suggest and don't apologise for making your decisions about what you agree to or not. MIL & other people will get used to the new you quickly enough once you start of you don't back down.

"You need to book Airbnb for your stay... (mil argues).. no you're not listening... book somewhere to stay or don't visit. "
"Im not interested in your arguing back, We don't have space/ I said No. Accept it"

"It's time to go home/ back to air bnb because you're getting rude. Here's your coat. Bye"

Call her out when she's behaving badly :-

"Stop going in about it MIL, you were told no. It's not open for discussion"

"Mil you're behaving badly, stop it now. Do not say another word" (end call or visit)

"Im not interested in this, let's change subject or you go home now.."

"Stop ranting MIL, I don't want to hear it, I said no"

"Stop bullying my husband, he agrees with me, he may be your son but he doesn't like being put in this position. "

"That's not kind. You were told no. It's our house/life/baby/child, not yours"

You and dh need to read the books by susan forward. He needs toxic parents and you need toxic inlaws.

You and your husband don't stand up to her. Neither of you. You tolerate disgusting and unacceptable behaviour. You let her get away with it. She says and does whatever she wants and you allow it, and go and get upset afterwards when she is no longer present. So she wins twice; firstly by being able to say and do whatever she wants with no fear of being called out, and secondly because it upsets you even when she is no longer with you.

If anyone had said or done any one of those things (not including the stillbirth which is horrific and her behavior at that time would have had me explode and kick her out at the very first comment, never to be seen again), I'd have snapped back IMMEDIATELY. If it happened again, I'd have told her that she's on her last chance. If she continued, it would be NC for me.

You need to do one of two things. 1) Explain to her how her behavior is disgusting and how awful it has made you feel, and that if it doesn't seriously change then you will be going NC because you don't want your child to have to grow up with a cruel and undermining person in their life or 2) simply go NC and don't explain anything, just cut her out.

It's not fair on any of you to have to tolerate her (your child shouldn't have this person in his life if she has caused both of her own children to have anxiety issues) and as much as I get that you hate confrontation, nobody is going to be able to sort this except you and your DH.

Not forgiving her, but continuing to see her and not confront her, is doing nothing but hurting you and your DH, and she's just living her best life doing whatever she wants, getting to say and do anything without consequence.

She must be deeply unhappy.
Protect yourself and your family from this awful person.

YANBU, stick to your guns, your parents accepted gracefully that they can’t stay with you, so should MIL.

The consistent theme is your DH’s lack of support. He needs to step up. The wedding seating issue seems minor but DH should have looked for a solution rather than say dismiss it.

MIL’s jokey comment during you talking about your birth experience must have been very hurtful. Do you think it was deliberate or she is just thoughtless?

So sorry about the baby you lost and hope all goes well with pregnancy

I don't know anyone who hasn't had to steer the choppy waters of PIL. Here's my advice after 20 years of getting it spectacularly wrong and, then more recently, getting it right.

1. Over communicate so that you're in touch but can set your own plan and agenda.
2. Try not to take it personally.

Easier said that done with some of the heartbreaking scenarios you've been through but her ineptitude is more to do with her than you. 3 Treat it like a job to keep in touch with them .. but don't confuse this with your own family. They won't put you first and when they hunker down you won't be included - it happens to a lot of us.

1. In summary, don't feed the narrative of aloof DIL, play along but know you didn't get married and inherit another set of parents - they will always put you in another category .. and that's ok .. but they're not your mum and dad. .

You can’t stay with us, you know we haven’t room to have people stay.
Mil: dh what do you think?
You: dh will not have just pushed this baby out of his vagina, and nor will he be breastfeeding it regularly unless I’m deeply confused about the whole process. If you don’t want to visit we will understand, if you do please book somewhere.

Great responses from Tiana4! Short and to the point.

OP I'm sorry about your stillbirth, and wishing you the best for your current pregnancy.

I would be upset about this and I don't think it's actually wrong of you to be feeling angry and upset now. You have that right and she has never acknowledged her behaviour so how can you move on with her in your life? You can however move on without her and if you are wary about seeing her, well, you don't have to! DH needs to be having a long talk with her about what she's said in the past so she can understand why you feel the way you do. He needs to stick up for you more especially now you'll be your own little family.

I bet she's one of those people who would describe herself as "sensitive" seriously OP, use your protective maternal instincts to stand up to her, everytime you are firm with her and you feel yourself bending remind yourself your doing this for your baby!

Sorry for your loss.
I like the advice from @tiana4. You need to remember that this is your life and its up to you what behaviour you put up with in your life. Get tough and stop keeping thoughts in your head when you are dealing with her. Tell her when she is being rude / insensitive / pushy. You don't need clever coping tactics or comebacks, you just need to be direct. Don't be frightened to say "you are being very rude" and hang up or walk away. This is how I deal with difficult people (not my MIL, she is lovely) and its wonderfully empowering.
Remember that you can't change people, she is always going to be self centred, but once she knows you can't be manipulated dealing with her will be easier.
A few people are being tough on your husband- yes she should have stuck up for you previously, but again that isn't who he is and you won't change him. He is clearly suffering from his own mental health issues, which is making him pull back from dealing with his mother.
Please both of you get counselling before your new baby arrives, or as soon as possible afterwards.

My mum has just taught me something to use on my difficult inlaws: put it back on them. Every single time they say something horrible or indiscreet or pointed etc just ask "why did you feel the need to say/do that?" and wait. Sit in the uncomfortable silence, and calmly pause for them to explain themselves. I thought it was genius and I'm definitely going to use it.

Your DH is a coward letting her treat you like this. You need to tell him it’s HIS family and he needs to step up and deal with her. This will only get worse once your DC are here. I am so sorry for your loss. You need to stand up for yourself now!

I’m so sorry for your loss.

I think you need to let go of your MIL ever being a good person or behaving with empathy, politeness, social grace, etc, and accept she’s going to be an upsetting cunt and that your DH isn’t going to set boundaries. So it’s up to you to say no, put limits on things, ignore her tantrums, etc. “No, you can’t stay here, that doesn’t work for us” and stick to it. Ignore every argument or whinge from her – it’s not a negotiation.