This Pen Farthing guy

[TheGenealogist]

The bloke with the animal shelter in Kabul.

Refusing to leave unless he can take ALL of his 60 odd staff and ALL of his 200+ cats and dogs with him. Expecting the government to make special rules for him and his friends.

Getting people out - understandable. The Taliban aren't going to look kindly on people who have translated for the military, or "collaborated" in other ways. But staff at an animal shelter?

And as for the refusing to leave without the animals and making this all out to be the UK government's fault? For not falling over themselves to arrange transport for a bunch of ownerless animals nobody wants when there are human beings in fear of their lives?

What is this guy playing at?

@Handsoffstrikesagain

FWIW, I don’t think this is the end of it. I do not think that Britain will withdraw leaving this shower of shit.

Sky says Poland have stopped evacuations and France will stop shortly. Your faith is misplaced.

Good to know there's a lot of vegans on this thread though that think of all animals as equal to humans, save the planet and all that.

@Peacrock

Good to know there's a lot of vegans on this thread though that think of all animals as equal to humans, save the planet and all that.

Is that supposed to be somehow insulting 😂

Reports are there are probably about 24hrs to go for British evacuations before they start getting our military out and leave the Americans to finish on the ground.

If we go past that we will be on borrowed time merely from a logistics point of view.

[quote lynsey91]**@DancesWithTortoises I think snakes matter just as much as fluffy bunnies. ALL living creatures matter.[/quote]
To what extent?

Parasites? Viruses? Mosquitoes with malaria?

Viruses?

It's a very bland comment. What does it mean?

And yes it's normal for animals esp mammals to prioritise and protect their own.

Yes humans are a disaster but in different ways so are our companian animals.

If this man had an org that was I dunno. Helping cockroaches or something.

You'd really say the same thing about that?

His military training hasn't done him any favours . First rule is surely to get as many people out alive

Which is exactly what he has been trying to do ffs, but he's been blocked at every step.

He is practically goading the Taliban with his media interviews and cheerleaders on Twitter

Don't be so silly - an ex Royal Marine was always going to be a prime target and a prize for the Taliban. He was always going to be captured, tortured and killed by the Taliban given half a chance. He knows that, and no doubt knows that he is fucked if he is left there regardless of how much noise he makes on twitter or elsewhere - he has nothing left to lose. But despite knowing this, his loyalty to his staff and friends is so great that he refuses to leave without them - there's his military training demonstrated right there by acting in a a way that is honourable.

It's laughable that a random on the internet thinks they can read the situation there and know the Taliban and their tactics better than a fucking ex COMMANDO who has served there. Do you have any idea how elite Commandos are and the level of their military training? But you honestly believe you could have a chat with him and him how he's doing things wrong.

Oh- and to the comments about animals using up weight capacity - so do fucking great trucks.

@JaniieJones

'The UK government did not refuse to help. They asked Pen, his wife and staff to go to the airport last Friday to be evacuated. Pen’s wife left, but Pen refused to go without his animals so arranged his own flight which has delayed his staff leaving too.'

Yes, he is playing a dangerous game with people's lives.

I wouldn't trust the UK Government not to renege on the deal or lose the paperwork shred it for the other staff the moment my plane took off. Look at the way they (Johnson in particular) totally fucked up with Nazanin Zaghari-Ratcliffe, for example 'oh, we'll sort this shocking state of affairs by announcing she was probably a spy when she wasn't '. Or deliberately destroying documentation that would have helped the Windrush generation when they decided to forget about the original rights they had here, Gurhkas, the Chagos Islanders or on any number of other occasions. A government 'promise' is about as reliable as Johnson saying he'll pull out in time.

@Saucery

Oh *@Janiie*, your tired old routine doesn’t work on me, love

Has she reported you yet?

I have a strong belief (for various reasons) that the UK will continue to get people out after the deadline

That's not what I'm hearing.

@EsmaCannonball

I've spoken to a former aerospace engineer about the possibility of humans travelling in the hold and (passenger seating wasn't really his area) he said the issue would be seatbelts, oxygen masks, escape routes, that sort of thing. If everything went well then things could be ok, but turbulence or a bumpy landing could lead to terrible injuries and if something worse happened it could be an absolute disaster. Finding a way to tether passengers in the hold could take a lot of time.

Your former aerospace engineer is correct….

As mentioned upthread people can and have accidentally travelled in holds but of course there’s obviously no safety equipment or provision for an emergency exit.

That said if it was a choice of doing that on the last flight out of Kabul or face the Taliban coming over the fence,..though somebody has to shut the cargo doors from the outside…

@EsmaCannonball

I've spoken to a former aerospace engineer about the possibility of humans travelling in the hold and (passenger seating wasn't really his area) he said the issue would be seatbelts, oxygen masks, escape routes, that sort of thing. If everything went well then things could be ok, but turbulence or a bumpy landing could lead to terrible injuries and if something worse happened it could be an absolute disaster. Finding a way to tether passengers in the hold could take a lot of time.

I was thinking it's probably something like this:

nzhistory.govt.nz/page/fox-glacier-plane-crash

Unsecured human "cargo" would be a disaster waiting to happen (the animals will almost certainly be crated and then secured as regular cargo).

@Handsoffstrikesagain

pick I was only referring to the UK. It isn’t misplaced. I have a strong belief (for various reasons) that the UK will continue to get people out after the deadline.

Based on what?

The UK has said it will continue to process people from third countries, but once we've withdrawn from Kabul, they'll have to get themselves across borders without support.

Shanghaisprize " Don't be so silly - an ex Royal Marine was always going to be a prime target and a prize for the Taliban. He was always going to be captured, tortured and killed by the Taliban given half a chance. He knows that, and no doubt knows that he is fucked if he is left there regardless of how much noise he makes on twitter or elsewhere - he has nothing left to lose. But despite knowing this, his loyalty to his staff and friends is so great that he refuses to leave without them - there's his military training demonstrated right there by acting in a a way that is honourable.

It's laughable that a random on the internet thinks they can read the situation there and know the Taliban and their tactics better than a fucking ex COMMANDO who has served there. Do you have any idea how elite Commandos are and the level of their military training? But you honestly believe you could have a chat with him and him how he's doing things wrong."

This

Those who shout about women and children/anyone in the desperate scramble outside the airport gates seeing animals loaded onto aircraft:

Really? Those walls are so high, they can't climb up them. The walls must be several feet high. Unless something's changed in recent hours, the gates are blocked by shipping containers, with armed Taleban standing on top, doing "crowd control" (aka: scaring the shit out of people). How, exactly, are any of those poor sods going to see who or what is accessing any plane? I suspect that if they *could see, they'd be more distressed that so many planes are leaving below capacity.

@Peacrock

Good to know there's a lot of vegans on this thread though that think of all animals as equal to humans, save the planet and all that.

And vegans don't generally feel that way.

That's not how the ones I know feel.

If a baby is born in the middle of nowhere and the mum dies. And the baby will be consumed by wildlife/ insects etc.

It's not a natural instinct not think yep all's equal. Let nature take it's course.

Cats and dogs have been bred as companian animals but are animals. Dogs form packs. Packs of dogs are scary. In countries where there are stray dogs. Cats are a serious very successful predator.

Cats or dogs would not give a second thought to doing whatever to protect or feed their young. Protect themselves.

But humans need to be different because... ?

I do understand this perspective. Humans are a too clever too successful damaging species.

But we're not worse than any other species in terms of instinct to look after our group and young.

Cats play with mice and other animals to learn, for fun.

Some mammals engage in cannibalism.

Etc etc.

The idea that a cat or a dog cut loose in Afghanistan is at more risk than the humans is very peculiar.

I do get it though.

I think there's no middle ground.

There's not going to be agreement.

Is that supposed to be somehow insulting

Nope, I've been a vegan for many years, I just suspect there are a tonne of hypocrites which is always amusing. All animals matter, erm unless I want to eat them or by products from where they've been exploited.

@Shanghaisprize I wholeheartedly agree with every single thing you have said on this thread. You have articulated exactly what I think in a far more eloquent way than I ever could.

@Peacrock

Is that supposed to be somehow insulting

Nope, I've been a vegan for many years, I just suspect there are a tonne of hypocrites which is always amusing. All animals matter, erm unless I want to eat them or by products from where they've been exploited.

Oh yeah, I can see now how it's a compliment. Thanks for clarifying.

they'll have to get themselves across borders without support

Yes, that's what I've heard too. I imagine very through will get through the Taliban roadblocks alive though. That's the reality.

@Shanghaisprize

His military training hasn't done him any favours . First rule is surely to get as many people out alive

Which is exactly what he has been trying to do ffs, but he's been blocked at every step.

He is practically goading the Taliban with his media interviews and cheerleaders on Twitter

Don't be so silly - an ex Royal Marine was always going to be a prime target and a prize for the Taliban. He was always going to be captured, tortured and killed by the Taliban given half a chance. He knows that, and no doubt knows that he is fucked if he is left there regardless of how much noise he makes on twitter or elsewhere - he has nothing left to lose. But despite knowing this, his loyalty to his staff and friends is so great that he refuses to leave without them - there's his military training demonstrated right there by acting in a a way that is honourable.

It's laughable that a random on the internet thinks they can read the situation there and know the Taliban and their tactics better than a fucking ex COMMANDO who has served there. Do you have any idea how elite Commandos are and the level of their military training? But you honestly believe you could have a chat with him and him how he's doing things wrong.

Oh- and to the comments about animals using up weight capacity - so do fucking great trucks.

This Last week I was open to anti Pen Farthing arguments. Not any more. 22 years as a Royal Marine will influence your attitudes. That’s 22 years service to his country. Some of us may feel comfortable sneering at that kind of dedication but not me. He’s an eccentric, is one way of describing him. He stayed in Afghanistan for positive reasons. He raised £200,000 in no time. He wants his staff safe, which the certainly won’t be. He has room for many people on his plane. Of course he wants to bring his animals out. Some of the dogs are ex service.
Go pen

*Very FEW

[quote lynsey91]**@DancesWithTortoises I think snakes matter just as much as fluffy bunnies. ALL living creatures matter.[/quote]
Snakes are less of a concern. Samuel L Jackson already got them out. They travelled in the cabin and the hold IIRC.