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Original poster

To think that this whole chaos in Afghanistan has happened because Biden wanted to be out by 9/11

75 replies

ThisBeTheName · 23/08/2021 10:45

11th September this year is the twenty year anniversary of 9/11. It is now obvious that Biden decided he wanted some nice headlines where he could boast, on the big day, that the US was out of Afghanistan.

He could have chosen to withdraw his troops this winter, after "fighting season" was over, when all the Taliban men would be back in their villages and so wouldn't be available overrun the cities, and Kabul in particular. Biden was advised to do that, in fact. But that would have meant that the US wasn't out by September 11...

Why choose August 31t as his deadline to be out? Because of 9/11! Otherwise the end of August is a totally spurious timeline.

It's a shameful mess, all because Biden wanted some headlines and a legacy. Well he got that...

OP posts:
Peacrock · 24/08/2021 19:04

Biden himself and spokespeople said clearly that trumps deadline of mid May was extended to September 11th, it has now been brought forward but even they acknowledged the sept date- it's not a conspiracy.

OP there are a few interesting articles mainly in the US press about why they think this was the desired date.

freddiethegreat · 24/08/2021 21:33

@FreshFreesias the treatment of the animal rescues - specifically Nowzad and KSAR - is mind blowing & quite why it isn’t all over the media I don’t know. The Nowzad situation is perhaps fractionally worse because of the U.K. Government u-turn, but KSAR has still been seemingly abandoned - & they had the Taliban in the house earlier & guards outside the door now! 😢

Original poster
ThisBeTheName · 26/08/2021 09:55

This is why Biden has refused to extend the deadline in any way - so he can gethis 9/11 "win". And bugger what his allies or NATO want, need, or are advising.

We're fine to use when the USA needs us and our military lives, but Biden is happy to throw everyone to the Taliban now Angry

This could all have been managed so much better by the US.

OP posts:
Brighterblighter · 26/08/2021 14:10

I have don't know but its a cock up, massive awful cock up that he briefly admitted caught him on the hop.

It's utterly disgusting. Even more than what's going on in Afghanistan is they damage he has done to the relationship with the allies.

I had high hopes for him, everyone thought he would be normal and he's done thus!!

Brighterblighter · 26/08/2021 14:11

It's not a 9/11 win he's begging and negotiating with the taliban!!

Original poster
ThisBeTheName · 26/08/2021 18:07

@Brighterblighter

It's not a 9/11 win he's begging and negotiating with the taliban!!
He'll still want to say "Mission accomplished" on 9/11, ie that America is now out of Afghanistan. That's what this rush and chaos is all about.

So awful about the suicide attacks at Kabul airport today Sad

OP posts:
Original poster
ThisBeTheName · 26/08/2021 18:08

@Brighterblighter

I have don't know but its a cock up, massive awful cock up that he briefly admitted caught him on the hop.

It's utterly disgusting. Even more than what's going on in Afghanistan is they damage he has done to the relationship with the allies.

I had high hopes for him, everyone thought he would be normal and he's done thus!!

He's turned out to be such a disappointment. Full of ego, but tries to seem like a nice guy.
OP posts:
OhWhyNot · 26/08/2021 18:13

Yes I think there is a drive to be out by the 11th

I was in the US in the first and tenth anniversaries of 9/11 it’s a huge deal we went to a church service (I’m not religious my dad is) it was packed. Candle vigils held in many places we don’t have anything like it here

MarshmallowSwede · 26/08/2021 18:24

Maybe now everyone will accept that the Americans have “America first” policy. And there is not really anything wrong with that.

All this talk about allies and “special relationship “ the UK liked to speak about. Maybe now you will see that the Americans want to end their status as the worlds police. And I cannot say that I blame them.

But maybe everyone needs to adopt the same policy and worry about their own nations first. Americans have a large enough military where they don’t necessarily need Europeans to get involved. Europe has made the mistake of being too reliant on the US military in my opinion.

I don’t predict the Americans being very willing to help any operations in the ME moving forward. The American population has been extremely vocal about their wish to get their soldiers out of ME conflicts and they have.

Everyone else needs to take this as a signal to learn that this will be how they deal with the world moving fwd. Nations have to learn how to manage without them. I don’t think they are worried about having a strong relationship with “allies” right now.

Original poster
ThisBeTheName · 26/08/2021 20:22

You're right @MarshmallowSwede.

12 US Marines dead today - I wonder how Joe will spin that? Not quite the win he was looking for.

OP posts:
MsJinks · 26/08/2021 20:34

Biden didn’t want to be there in 2002 so he’s already late out. Trump’s Doha agreement was struck with the Taliban so Biden couldn’t reverse it unilaterally like some of his predecessor’s ‘work’.
I am disappointed that it reflects badly on the rest of his presidency and reduces the hopes of that presidency but I’m horrified at the humanitarian disaster caused by the big nations - caused imo not just ‘happening’ through a bit of recent misjudgment- they knew what would happen and should have managed this better, or at least been honest about how countries accept attrition rates. equally every single action since Russia invaded, and probably before, has helped to lead to today’s horror. It’s not just Biden at all and it’s difficult to realise we in the west had and continue to have no problem killing many human beings and wrecking countries for cash and power.

SisterBeaverhausen · 26/08/2021 20:38

Please don't call Afghan people "Afghanis" it's "Afghans"

Original poster
ThisBeTheName · 26/08/2021 20:58

@SisterBeaverhausen

Please don't call Afghan people "Afghanis" it's "Afghans"
I'm so sorry! I think that was a mistype on my behalf. I first referred to Afghans.
OP posts:
PicsInRed · 26/08/2021 21:01

Maybe now you will see that the Americans want to end their status as the worlds police.

They should then expect to end their role as the world's taxman.

Original poster
ThisBeTheName · 26/08/2021 21:02

@MsJinks

Biden didn’t want to be there in 2002 so he’s already late out. Trump’s Doha agreement was struck with the Taliban so Biden couldn’t reverse it unilaterally like some of his predecessor’s ‘work’. I am disappointed that it reflects badly on the rest of his presidency and reduces the hopes of that presidency but I’m horrified at the humanitarian disaster caused by the big nations - caused imo not just ‘happening’ through a bit of recent misjudgment- they knew what would happen and should have managed this better, or at least been honest about how countries accept attrition rates. equally every single action since Russia invaded, and probably before, has helped to lead to today’s horror. It’s not just Biden at all and it’s difficult to realise we in the west had and continue to have no problem killing many human beings and wrecking countries for cash and power.
I agree that there are many issues surrounding Afghanistan for the big nations. I do not disagree with Biden's, or the US's, desire to leave the country.

What I, and many others, do have an issue with is the absolutely appalling way that the US leaving has been handled. It is, basically, a shit show. And now 12 US Marines, as well as others, are dead. Killed by a villager in a suicide vest. It's a rout, is what it is. All because Biden wanted his 9/11 headlines, and wouldn't wait for a more measured extraction and handover to the Afghans in the winter.

And what the hell he was thinking, pulling his troops out of Bagram with no notice, and not getting US citizens out first...

OP posts:
gorgeousjewel · 26/08/2021 21:10

@ThisBeTheName

60+ dead Afghan men, women and children are not "others"

When USA stops policing world, starting wars, overthrowing democratically elected Governments ... then you may have something worth saying

As it is US Imperialism is alive and well and has sadly caused thousands of deaths across the World this year alone - including the poor marines (cannon fodder) killed today

SisterBeaverhausen · 26/08/2021 21:13

That's okay OP, I wasn't sure if you understood how to refer to them but I can see now it was likely a typo.

MsJinks · 26/08/2021 21:59

I don’t disagree the pullout is shocking - however, I think possibly it was always going to be this way and they all knew it, if not the immediacy of it being flashed around the world. Don’t forget they’ve had time and all countries have been bringing folk home for months now, this bit is just the end date that I’m sure must have been considered by experts. This is the first time it’s so documented but what’s horrific to most might just be what powers ‘accept’ and have previously accepted as collateral damage - trouble is the world is watching and they have to try and pretend some acknowledgment. Obviously not a ‘fact’ just my thoughts. There are many countries suffering and it doesn’t ‘matter’ much - for example we sell arms to Saudi to bomb Yemen but that’s not talked about much at all.
I don’t condone biden’s actions but I blame an awful lot more than just him.

Brighterblighter · 26/08/2021 22:11

I agree we rely on US too much.

Nato is an embarrassment... Other countries need to step up... it's just that for America to withdraw like this.. A wounded bear with a hurt paw slinking away... Leaves a massive dangerous vacuum.

Who trusts America now?? The pull out would never be easy but it doesn't need to be this horrific and this bad.

Smaller details, having people waiting in a fucking sewer, hastily throwing containers up.. No security... Burning peoples passports!!
. It did not ever have to be this bad. There was no contingent planning and if there was apparently Biden didn't want to hear.
People are frightened of him, he may seem smiley and sweet to us but it's been reported that he's running an autocracy.

So no rational thought, running through different scenarios..

We've had people in a sewer.

Brighterblighter · 26/08/2021 22:13
  • the especially sad thing is often the "suicide" attackers are people with disabilities and probably no capacity.
PicsInRed · 26/08/2021 22:16

@Brighterblighter

* the especially sad thing is often the "suicide" attackers are people with disabilities and probably no capacity.
I remember many years ago learning that female rape victims were used, against their will. The belts are sewn and bound on so that they cannot be removed by the wearer and often have remote detonation enabled.

Bastards.

ohfook · 26/08/2021 22:20

Biden's fucked up but this doesn't rest solely on his shoulders. The burden of this is shared between every president from Reagan onwards.

Trump negotiated the date. Biden extended it to a point.

Brighterblighter · 26/08/2021 22:25

Too awful pics.

It's the details.

A proper thought out contingent plan wouldn't have included people wading in a sewer!!

A sewer, hastily grabbed containers to stand on and pull people up from the crush.

It's been scrabbled together in a crush.

Proper planning would have made all this far swifter and more humane.
Biden laughed and said only days ago "there will be no scenes like saigon".

He runs an autocracy. He doesn't listen and people are afraid of him in the white House.
.

PicsInRed · 26/08/2021 22:35

Is anyone else watching Biden live?

Fuck me, he's lost the plot.

Brighterblighter · 26/08/2021 22:44

Yes I'm watching its unbelievable.
Was that really americas choice?? Trump or Biden???

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