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AIBU?

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Original poster

To have being branded a ''paedophile supporter''.

88 replies

Balgoresboy · 10/08/2021 23:57

Tonight we were at a mates and 1 of them was going on about how Prince Andrew should be sent to US to answer the charges and it was a disgrace he wasn't.

I responded that that was fair enough but if that was the case America should send the diplomat's wife who killed the boy in the car back to the UK to answer the charges as that too was unfair.

Friend raged at me that my
attitude was disgusting and that I was defending a paedo. Was my point unreasonable?

OP posts:
VeniVidiWeeWee · 11/08/2021 02:55

@MrsTerryPratchett

The difference for me is risk.

Sex offenders have a very high recidivism rate. I think it's the highest of any class of crime.

People who kill by dangerous driving don't.

Risk to the public is massively higher in the first case.

Sorry, but what is your point?

PA is not a proven sex offender.

MrsTerryPratchett · 11/08/2021 03:04

PA is not a proven sex offender.

Isn't that rather the point of questioning him and getting him into a Court?

avamiah · 11/08/2021 03:26

Who knows what will happen to him ,look at Harvey Weinstein, he was a multi multi millionaire film producer now look were he is.

DewDew83 · 11/08/2021 03:26

Isn't that rather the point of questioning him and getting him into a Court?
Not in a civil claim, no.

MrsTerryPratchett · 11/08/2021 04:53

@DewDew83

Isn't that rather the point of questioning him and getting him into a Court? Not in a civil claim, no.
OJ Simpson may have some thoughts about that.
Applesandbaynay · 11/08/2021 05:20

They should both face justice but they don’t have anything to do with each other. I don’t see what the point is here. That we should protect a man who is accused of raping a child (whether you want to split hairs about the meaning of the word paedophile supporter this is what he is accused of) because the US haven’t ‘swapped’ him for Anne Sacoolas. Is that who we are as a country?

If there is enough evidence for him to be prosecuted in the civil or criminal courts then he should do so. No matter how the US has behaved in another case. Justice for a victim and prosecuting someone who has (allegedly) committed a sex offence should not be dependent on ‘swapping’.

The fact that he is not being prosecuted here despite the fact the offence was alleged to have been committed in London shows the absurd deference to the Royal family in this country. If he was an average Joe his feet wouldn’t have touched the ground.

Applesandbaynay · 11/08/2021 05:28

To clarify I mean morally Prince Andrew should go to the US and cooperate with the investigation. He is a member of the royal family and should behave in an open and transparent manner. He can’t be extradited unless he is charged.

Whether Anne Sacoolas should actually be entitled to diplomatic immunity in the circumstances is I think debatable. However they are two completely separate matters.

LoislovesStewie · 11/08/2021 05:33

@x2boys

I would say PA was more of a sexual predator and maybe a rapist if everything that he is accused of is true as a paedophile is someone who is sexually interested in pre pubescent children
Actually I want to make this point often, paedophilia is sexual attraction to prepubescents, Andrew may well be attracted to very young women, but that does not make him a paedophile. Regarding the whole extradition to the USA problem, if you look at this the USA rarely sends its citizens back to face justice, the whole extradition treaty seems to work entirely in their favour.
phishy · 11/08/2021 05:38

I agree with her a bit. Why not engage on the issue being discussed - the sexual abuse of a US minor (she was 17), rather than engage in whatabottery?

Plumtree391 · 11/08/2021 06:16

You weren't unreasonable, nor were you supporting Prince Andrew or any paedophile.

However the two cases are poles apart. From what I have read, PA is prepared to answer questions from the FBI.

It's best not to get into such discussions, views are so polarised.

MrsTophamHat · 11/08/2021 06:31

They have made the inference that you would be happy to see Andrew escape justice for as long as Sacoolas does. I wouldn't have made that interpretation.

Hecatestorch · 11/08/2021 07:08

People keep mentioning PA cases is a civil case I don't think that's what the friend was say she they specifically said answer charges

I am assuming they feel he should be sent to the US to face criminal charges.

Brefugee · 11/08/2021 07:27

YANBU to point out that when the boot is on the other foot it's shit because the USA won't play.

YABU to make the connection. The cases are different and not connected and frankly they should both be travelling across the Atlantic to answer to the courts.

Why did you feel the need to say that instead of just agreeing that he should go?

SmokeyDevil · 11/08/2021 07:28

@LolaButt

Yanbu to correlate the point that where there is a legal case to answer, one should be compelled to comply with proceedings.

Your friend has conflated the issue and focussed on the criminal act itself, not the procedural issue. Maybe not the sharpest knife in the drawer.

Was thinking this, she seems quite stupid. Maybe you need simpler topics for her op.

I mean, it's sadly never going to happen though, everyone knows that. Neither will face punishment for their crimes and both will get away with it. Still, it's nice to think about and hope for.

Brefugee · 11/08/2021 07:31

also, to the "Andrew isn't a paedophile" defenders because the girl was 17. eyeroll

Sure. But he should still have gone to the US on the occasions the FBI wanted to speak to him.

The imbalance in extraditions has been known for years and years and years. It is really nothing new.

Truthseeker34 · 11/08/2021 07:32

I disagree with you on this one.

McPancreas · 11/08/2021 07:35

Your friend was harsh to call you that however this false equivalence between unrelated cases does appear to be part of a concerted effort to defend and minimise Prince Andrews actions and behaviour.

It's not like his PR team could use anything he had said or done to defend him from the allegations of sleeping with coerced underaged girls.

MrsHuntGeneNotJeremyObviously · 11/08/2021 07:37

Plenty of criminals in the US escape justice because America won't extradite its own citizens. If American victims of crime committed outside of the US, feel hard done by or as if they are denied justice, they ought to take it up with their own government, whose attitude towards extradition is contributing towards this issue. Few people are going to support action against a UK citizen, while AS benefits from a diplomatic immunity she may not even have been entitled to! Victims of crime are often screwed over - it's reasonable to conflate the two cases because there are wider implications for all British victims of crime carried out by foreign nationals whose countries won't respect our laws. Hard for the US, even in a civil case, to argue that PA is accountable, while not making AS also accountable.

Epstein was an American. Id hazard a guess that there are other high profile US citizens associated with him who are not getting the attention that Prince Andrew is.

Truthseeker34 · 11/08/2021 07:40

@LolaButt

Yanbu to correlate the point that where there is a legal case to answer, one should be compelled to comply with proceedings.

Your friend has conflated the issue and focussed on the criminal act itself, not the procedural issue. Maybe not the sharpest knife in the drawer.

Context and crime is important though?
SchrodingersImmigrant · 11/08/2021 07:40

@Fiddliestofsticks

Andrew is being sued privately. He is not being indicted on criminal charges. Do we really want to go down the route were people are extradited due to private litigation? That could be seriously abused.

Saying that, Andrew should be facing criminal charges but until he is, what grounds are there to extradite? Anne S should have been sent back here long ago.

Many people totally miss this important bit
VanGoSunflowers · 11/08/2021 07:40

Your friend is an idiot.

a8mint · 11/08/2021 07:49

Prince Andrew has NOT BEEN CHARGED with any offence.

ElliottSmithsfingers · 11/08/2021 07:50

[quote Sparklfairy]**@ElliottSmithsfingers* don't be daft. Its perfectly possible to think Andrew should be forced to cooperate but also* think that Anne should too, without holding one to ransom to get the other.[/quote]
Indeed it is (and I am far from daft) - it was the OP that linked the two, deflecting from the subject at hand.

AlternativePerspective · 11/08/2021 07:50

He’s not a paedophile, and people need to get past that point first.

Yes, he is accused of having sex with trafficked girls, but paedophiles are attracted to pre-pubescent children, and the fact that any man who now e.g. has sex with a 16 year old who while pretty abhorrent is still of an age of consent is now branded a paedophile takes away from the horrific damage done to prepubescent children when they are actively abused.

In this instance it’s the trafficking which was the issue. Had the girl been in this country having sex with her wouldn’t even have been looked at as she was over the age of consent. It just so happens that in the country they were in she was 17 which still wasn’t considered to be the age of consent.

I dislike Andrew intensely and I think that he should be questioned, but I don’t think this is as black and white as all that.

Brefugee · 11/08/2021 08:01

He has been invited several times to go and talk to the FBI. His silence and wiggling out of questioning speaks volumes.

Tringtohide behind diplomatic status - as both Secolas and Andrew are doing here is simply because they know they are not 100% clean on their issue.

Frankly it's the abuse I'd diplomatic Status that we should be getting really excited about here