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Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

To think that equestrian events are ridiculous

936 replies

BFrazzled · 02/08/2021 23:05

In the Olympics.

Poor horses. This ridiculous dancing in dressage, who the hell thought of that?

There was one winner of the dressage contest who supposedly also won in the nineties. No mention of the horse, guess it was with a different one then Hmm

OP posts:
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11
mbosnz · 03/08/2021 11:30

@BornToRunButQuiteSlowly

It seems a tad unfair that the competitors aren't using the same 'equipment', ie the horse. Bruce Springsteen has spent gazillions supplying his showjumping daughter with the best horses money can buy.
If all riders were to use the same 'equipment', then the same horse would have to be used by all the riders, no matter their weight and height, and how many times would the horse have to do all three aspects of the event, dressage, showjumping and eventing? I think then there would be very just grounds for complaint on welfare grounds. . . poor horse!
Lelliebellieboo · 03/08/2021 11:32

@rantymcrantface66

I'm sure Milton was still competing til a ripe old age too. It takes a lot of care to have a horse able to still perform to the best of their ability in their more senior years and they'd have to still enjoy it. A horse will soon let you know if they have had enough.

There are some awful practices and training techniques in equine sport, including dressage but these are abhorred by riders such as Charlotte, Carl and other top riders and it's good to see these are the riders and horses that are winning the medals.

I had hundreds of posters of Milton on my wall as well!

About 10 years ago, my husband bought me a toy replica of Milton which my 6yo now has to play with, using her barbies. Only a few weeks ago, she asked me about him and we ended up down a YouTube vortex watching 1980s showjumping!

The OP seems obsessed with the horses not getting credit and refuses to agree with anyone who says that they do. When I was growing up, my bedroom wall was covered in posters of the horses, not the riders. I had Milton, Mon Santa, even Downlands Cancara (the old TSB horse). For many equestrians, we become fans of the horses more than the riders. That's why when Charlotte rides, there's so many people talking about how much they loved Blueberry (Valegro) or Pumpkin (Gio) because they recognise what those horses are physically capable of.

rantymcrantface66 · 03/08/2021 11:36

Keeping horses with no or very limited / solo turnout is terribly cruel for animals which are designed to live in herds and walk miles a day. Just recently an international competitor stated she never let her horses have any turnout

I agree with you and so do most UK equestrians. The first thing that happened when Gio returned from the games was for him to be turned out in his paddock. I've seen the video.

VeryLongBeeeep · 03/08/2021 11:43

Lelliebellieboo I once met Cancara at a county show, it was the highlight of my day out!

Polkadotties · 03/08/2021 11:46

The horses not getting credit is simply not true. It’s a partnership. On the leaderboards both the rider and the horse’s name are shown.
The horses are at the awards ceremony too.

To think that equestrian events are ridiculous
rantymcrantface66 · 03/08/2021 11:54

My favourite was Nick Skeletons horse Apollo. I still remember in detail what he looked like with his big white face. I even remember the bridle he wore with the rope noseband. On the other had I couldn't pick Nick Skelton out of a line up. It's definitely the horses who are the stars. Equestrian sports are far less publicised now though. As a child I remember watching Hickstead, horse of the year show, olympia, Olympics all on terrestrial TV and the horses and riders were far more of a household name.

Ekofisk · 03/08/2021 11:56

Fond memories of Hugo Simon on Gladstone.

rantymcrantface66 · 03/08/2021 11:58

It’s interesting that ‘horsey people’ are largely deriding people who don’t agree that horses should be travelled to the other side of the world to compete in high heat, high stress environments. When actually it is more the none horsey people, who acting on the instinct, that are probably more correct and show a better understanding for what is good and not good for horses!

Maybe because we've followed footage of the horses, before during and after their journeys and have seen the horses arriving in to top class facilities looking calm, relaxed and happy. Your instincts are wrong!

gwenneh · 03/08/2021 11:58

Part of the scoring in dressage is the score for "Harmony" between that particular horse and rider pairing. It's an understated term, but has a coefficient of at least 2 (which means whatever score the judge gives the combination is multiplied by 2 when calculating the final score.) A horse has to trust the rider to walk into the arena at all, let alone listen to the rider's aids over instinct -- this is why the particular partnership between a specific horse and their specific rider is important and why horses aren't interchangeable. Though CJ/CH could probably sit on any horse and produce amazing results, those results are best on the horses they work with, day after day.

Dressage, from Xenophon onwards, is about creating a movement from the smallest possible rider input. The quieter the "aid", the better. This is why the best riders look like they're sitting still. This is the heart of the sport. Charlotte Dujardin can lift a seatbone and move her outside leg back a fraction and there will be a beautiful canter depart, and that is what is glorious about her partnership with her horses (be it Valegro, or Pumpkin.)

To get to that point, the rider has to know the horse, to feel when they are even in a position to ask for something. It would be no use even asking for a horse to canter if you couldn't feel that their muscles were loose and they were moving with their hind legs properly -- you wouldn't get the result you wanted AND it would annoy the horse.

And to get to THAT point, there is a lot of grunt work. My Apple watch estimates my average heart rate during a ride to be between 160-180. You have to warm up properly both yourself and your horse and be flexible and receptive enough to work on those aids. Sometimes getting a steady warmup with all three gaits in their right place is a challenge! You have to be so receptive to your horse's state of mind and physical preparation, both on the ground and under saddle, to do this even remotely successfully.

As far as the idea this is the sport of the privileged, it's just not. Some people have privilege. We have an impressive array of PSG & GP riders at my yard. Some of them are wealthy. Others are working students, showing and competing the owners' horses for them while the owners come up the levels. That is how I started out, as a broke student shovelling poo & doing yard work for 10 hours per day in exchange for lessons. Many openings for working students exist, across all equestrian disciplines, and it provides learning in return for work.

And as far as thinking you're "too old" to start -- you're not! Go and give it a try!

MyAnacondaMight · 03/08/2021 11:58

@BornToRunButQuiteSlowly

It seems a tad unfair that the competitors aren't using the same 'equipment', ie the horse. Bruce Springsteen has spent gazillions supplying his showjumping daughter with the best horses money can buy.
This is a really interesting point. Historically, in some equestrian competitions riders have had to ride each other’s horses (old format world equestrian games showjumping finale, for example). It could make for some great spectator viewing - especially when a horse takes a dislike to its new rider - but it’s hard on the horses, and in some cases dangerous. Choosing your mount is a big factor in men and women to competing on an equal footing. Some horses go best for a small, female rider - others are brilliant in the right hands but require a lot of physical size and strength to keep controlled.

If you want to see some athletes of, er, “mixed” equestrian talent showjumping on horses they’ve never ridden before, then watch the jumping phase of the modern pentathlon on 6 and 7 August. The results tend to be exactly what you might expect...

GrumpyMiddleAgedWoman · 03/08/2021 12:02

The Olympics should be reserved for elite athletes only.
Have you any clue how fit you need to be to ride at that level? I used to share a dressage lesson with a friend and I'd be knackered by the end, despite the fact that I'd spent half the hour sitting there watching huffing round the manege. It's much, much harder work than just hacking out, which I can do for hours.

As for cost, I rode weekly as a teenager and we were a very long way from wealthy: we were scraping along the bottom. Our local hairdresser is married to a handyman and they keep two horses. There are routes for pursuing an equestrian career if you're not wealthy: I know someone who joined the army to do exactly that.

And the horses get so little credit that while I could remember Valegro's name, I had to read this thread to be reminded of his rider's...

BFrazzled · 03/08/2021 12:05

Some horses go best for a small, female rider - others are brilliant in the right hands but require a lot of physical size and strength to keep controlled.

Sorry to hijack your comment but this kind of contradict other horsey posters claiming that horses want to do it all by themselves and just love dancing to music.

OP posts:
Genvonklinkerhoffen · 03/08/2021 12:06

@MyAnacondaMight as an ex modern pentathlete, I can absolutely agree. My dad used to call it "blood sports". Symptom of a change from riders to swimmers IMO. Painful to watch!

BFrazzled · 03/08/2021 12:09

@GrumpyMiddleAgedWoman

The Olympics should be reserved for elite athletes only. Have you any clue how fit you need to be to ride at that level? I used to share a dressage lesson with a friend and I'd be knackered by the end, despite the fact that I'd spent half the hour sitting there watching huffing round the manege. It's much, much harder work than just hacking out, which I can do for hours.

As for cost, I rode weekly as a teenager and we were a very long way from wealthy: we were scraping along the bottom. Our local hairdresser is married to a handyman and they keep two horses. There are routes for pursuing an equestrian career if you're not wealthy: I know someone who joined the army to do exactly that.

And the horses get so little credit that while I could remember Valegro's name, I had to read this thread to be reminded of his rider's...

Do you realize the difference between being fit in that horse sense and being fit to compete in absolutely any other manpowered sport in the Olympics?

Both are far from everyday or amateur sportsmen level of fitness, but yet very far apart as well.

It’s like the distance from your village to London, from London to New York and then from New York to the Moon. All on different scales.

OP posts:
BFrazzled · 03/08/2021 12:11

@rantymcrantface66

My favourite was Nick Skeletons horse Apollo. I still remember in detail what he looked like with his big white face. I even remember the bridle he wore with the rope noseband. On the other had I couldn't pick Nick Skelton out of a line up. It's definitely the horses who are the stars. Equestrian sports are far less publicised now though. As a child I remember watching Hickstead, horse of the year show, olympia, Olympics all on terrestrial TV and the horses and riders were far more of a household name.
This might be true that horses are the stars, and they deserve to be at least on par with the riders, but Olympics are for human competition.
OP posts:
lastcall · 03/08/2021 12:12

You are not wrong.

All about 'old' money showing off their very expensive horses and not allowing 'new' money in, let alone 'common' people.

It's all about the horses as well. Beautiful animals. But very much a 'haves vs a have nots' event. I won't even call it a sport since the horse does all of the work.

plominoagain · 03/08/2021 12:16

@lastcall

You are not wrong.

All about 'old' money showing off their very expensive horses and not allowing 'new' money in, let alone 'common' people.

It's all about the horses as well. Beautiful animals. But very much a 'haves vs a have nots' event. I won't even call it a sport since the horse does all of the work.

As opposed to watching overhyped young men chasing a bag of wind around a multimillion pound arena in a seat that's now priced many people out of going to watch ? Let alone buy their strip every season ?

Or is that ok because it's 'new ' money ?

mbosnz · 03/08/2021 12:19

Erm, as Olympic sports go, I think you'll find that the Equestrian events have been part of the Olympics for rather longer than many of the current sports. So it would be a very recent decision to decide that they no longer 'belonged' in the competition because those with neither interest nor understanding think they should be there.

Smartiepants79 · 03/08/2021 12:19

‘The horse does all the work’
So if I put you on a dressage trained horse you’d be good to go then??
I’m not a dressage fan but this kind of comment is nonsense.

VeryLongBeeeep · 03/08/2021 12:20

Sorry to hijack your comment but this kind of contradict other horsey posters claiming that horses want to do it all by themselves and just love dancing to music.

Now I know you're being deliberately obtuse, OP. Nothing that that poster says contradicts the facts that horses display all the movements of dressage in the wild, only at a less refined level, or that many horses enjoy the process of learning to produce such movements on a rider's cue.

As for relative fitness...let's see a rider take on an archer or a golfer, shall we? I know who my money would be on.

gwenneh · 03/08/2021 12:22

It’s a bit like saying gravity does all the work in the diving events.

Tiddleztheelephant · 03/08/2021 12:30

@Smartiepants79

‘The horse does all the work’ So if I put you on a dressage trained horse you’d be good to go then?? I’m not a dressage fan but this kind of comment is nonsense.
I was once given a private lesson in a very well trained dressage horse (county level though not Olympic standard) I spent half the lesson getting the bloody thing to move at all! Grin I finally got the horse to cooperate but every muscle in my body was aching by the end of the lesson. These horses are well-trained and talented but you certainly can't just sit on them and let them do their thing. They need a close relationship with a talented and sensitive rider to be able to achieve anything at all.
WiddlinDiddlin · 03/08/2021 12:40

@Tippexy

Much loves horses... who are sometimes left behind when the owner flies home...
Eh?

Who has done that?

Astronutter · 03/08/2021 12:41

During the first lockdown, a pile of riders took part in various team (even terms vs SJ vs dressage vs racers etc) challenges as a fund raiser for the NHS. One of the challenges was the plank. --Oliver Townend— Olympic gold medalist Oliver Townend planked for 15 odd minutes. Not going to be able to do that if you’re not already very fit!

As with all sports, fitness is honed to the sport - I’d bet your average even term for example could run a mile faster than a weightlifter, but obviously neither are going to be as a long distance runner as they specifically train for that. Riders have to have tremendous core strength as just ‘sitting there’ needs a fair amount of muscle tone - compare the riders position to that of a beginner, who struggles to sit up and not fall off even at a walk, let alone a more active pace. For XC, try crouching, legs apart for 10-12 mins (average length of a 4L or 5 XC course, this time was shortened for Tokyo for horse welfare). Then do (or imagining doing) that balanced on something constantly moving with regular large jolts. IIRC Sam Watson (an Irish team rider) mentioned on an equiratings podcast that his heart rate will go 200bpm + during XC.

Astronutter · 03/08/2021 12:42

Stupid auto correct does not like the term eventer or eventing there!