To think Laurel Hubbard should not be competing against other women

[Belle82]

I know I am going to get ripped apart for this.

I have no problem with the transgender community, that is your life/body and I am not one to judge anyone else, do what makes you happy.

There is something fundamentally wrong about a person who is biologically a man competing against a woman in sport as significant as weightlifting.
I am not taking anything away from women weightlifters, however when competing in that sport, a person who was born a man will always have an unfair advantage over a woman.

I am all for equal rights but it seems political correctness has now put us in a position that we will only consider the equal rights of those in the transgender community. What happens to the equal rights of all the other women who have worked extremely hard to get to the olympics who should be competing against biological women.

There needs to be clearer cut criteria on entrance requirements to every sport, to give every person the equal rights they deserve.

My heart goes out to all the other women competing who I’m sure must be somewhat disheartened about their chances of success now they are competing against a biological man.

www.google.co.uk/amp/s/amp.theguardian.com/sport/2021/jul/29/ioc-praises-weightlifter-laurel-hubbard-ahead-of-transgender-athletes-olympic-debut

I fear you have truly missed the point of this thread

@LadyGAgain I know you’ve missed the point of that post….

For anyone looking for discussion on this topic, note that MN have recently split the 'Feminist Chat' board and hidden any conversations related to 'sex/gender' on another board.

www.mumsnet.com/Talk/womens_rights

@Shoxfordian

What do you think the best solution is for transgender athletes? They should compete with the gender they’re born into? Not be allowed at all? It seems unfair to say Laurel can’t compete. Maybe there needs to be extra categories

That's for transgender athletes to work out, not women.

YANBU It is a travesty that Laurel Hubbard is competing against women.

I can't see any way to vote?

@Shoxfordian

What do you think the best solution is for transgender athletes? They should compete with the gender they’re born into? Not be allowed at all? It seems unfair to say Laurel can’t compete. Maybe there needs to be extra categories

They should compete with the sex they were born into and comply with all the relevant doping regulations. Anything other than that is unfair to other competitors

@chunderwunder

Thanks for starting a thread for all the bigots to have a froth about transgender people, OP. You're providing a valuable service that they can't get elsewhere on Mumsnet and other social media.

Do you agree that biological men should be allowed to compete in the women's category?

How the poll currently stands:

What do you think the best solution is for transgender athletes? They should compete with the gender they’re born into? Not be allowed at all? It seems unfair to say Laurel can’t compete. Maybe there needs to be extra categories

They can compete. With other members if their biological sex. You do sports with your body not your identity.

@Babdoc

Testosterone is irrelevant. You could remove every molecule of testosterone in a man’s body and it would do NOTHING to shrink his shoulder girdle, femurs, lung capacity, cardiac output, lean mass/fat ratio, oxygen carrying capacity, or lower his centre of gravity, change his pelvis, gait, carrying angle, proportion of fast twitch muscle fibres- need I go on? He will retain all the advantages of being male, and is therefore beneath contempt for cheating if he enters a women’s sports event. The IOC is destroying women’s sport to pander to men. In 20 years, every country will have to enter teams of men to all women’s events, to have any hope of winning.

It's not just the IOC, It's the individual sports governing bodies.

They make their own rules for participation. For example, gymnasts must be 16 or older to compete, however in Skateboarding competitors are allowed to be 13....

It's the inconsistency that's not helping.

Or there should be an Open category.

@Shoxfordian

What do you think the best solution is for transgender athletes? They should compete with the gender they’re born into? Not be allowed at all? It seems unfair to say Laurel can’t compete. Maybe there needs to be extra categories

They should compete in the sex class they are. Gender is a social construct not a biological one.

YANBU. Weightlifting is my sport. Just to be clear I’ve never competed at anything other than an amateur level. However even lighter/smaller males (who are trained in weightlifting) will generally out lift much bigger women. You only have to look at weightlifting standards to see this.

@Shoxfordian

What do you think the best solution is for transgender athletes? They should compete with the gender they’re born into? Not be allowed at all? It seems unfair to say Laurel can’t compete. Maybe there needs to be extra categories

Male bodies belong in male sports.

It’s not unfair. Hubbard can compete in the male event, as Hubbard did for many years. Not many victories, though, because Hubbard just isn’t that good. We don’t do sport with our gender identities, we do sport with our sexed bodies, so someone’s gender identity is just irrelevant. There are loads of sports where men and women compete on the same course at the same time. (Tri, cycling, road racing, open water swimming), so the world is full of opportunities for transgender athletes to fully participate in sport.

Recent comment on the subject:

It's good that the Olympics has brought this to the attention of the world. But as others have said - this has been happening in all sports.

Governing bodies dismantling women's sport with everyone too scared to point out that it's anti fact, anti science and anti women. If you protest you're a bigot - sportswomen threatened with losing their places & sponsorship if they dare speak out by their male dominated governing bodies.

Everyone knows it's not fair - but by creating a climate of fear, too many obediently parrot kindness, inclusion and transwomen are women while ignoring the exclusion of women from our own sports..

From the article
Dr Richard Budgett, said “everyone agrees that trans women are women”

I would expect someone who has been educated to his level would understand the basics of biology

And no everyone does agree this untruthful

It’s a very important discussion to be had this isn’t just a feminist issue

This site has some excellent illustrations of why we used to have sex segregated sports, it compares the sporting results of High School boys with OLYMPIAN women.

boysvswomen.com/#/

Yanbu

There should be a men's category, a women's category, and if there are entrants, a transgender men/women's categories. Then everyone is competing against people of the same biological make up.

How long until a mixed reley team comprises 4 x biological males?

@chunderwunder

Thanks for starting a thread for all the bigots to have a froth about transgender people, OP. You're providing a valuable service that they can't get elsewhere on Mumsnet and other social media.

Do you think makes should be allowed to compete on female teams?

Do you think a male has a biological advantage over a female, having gone through puberty?

Do you think it fair that makes biological advantages are removing females from their spots in teams?

Are you happy that female sports will be dominated by males?

@Shoxfordian

What do you think the best solution is for transgender athletes? They should compete with the gender they’re born into? Not be allowed at all? It seems unfair to say Laurel can’t compete. Maybe there needs to be extra categories

People aren't born into a gender.

Sex is the correct definition.

Gender is a social construct.

A biological male should not be allowed to compete in sporting events for biological females. And vice versa.

Many moons ago john McEnroe made a comment about women’s tennis and said that a male tennis player ranked 100 in the world would beat a woman ranked number 1. Whatever his motivation for saying this it is true. At the time he was vilified for this comment.
What I find shameful is there are a lot of young males competing in sports now being supported by their families to compete as a women. If it was my child I just wouldn’t allow it. It’s an absolute disgrace

@tommmanndjjerrry

Yanbu

There should be a men's category, a women's category, and if there are entrants, a transgender men/women's categories. Then everyone is competing against people of the same biological make up.

You need to be clearer with your language

There should be a male category, a female category, then women's and men's, where any sex/gender identity can compete the women's or men's category.

I will never understand biological women on here who defend this and label those of us who believe it twisted and unfair, as transphobes. This is nothing to do with transphobia, this is simply biological equality in sport.

How can they justify this as fair? How? Please, one of you who feels that way, explain it to me.