To wonder why so many women answered "don't know"

[rAvan]

I am studying politics, and I am particularly interested in different systems operating globally. I was surprised to learn that First past the post, the system we use in General elections is favoured by only one other country in Europe- Belarus.

Yougov conduct research on our electoral system and have been for some time. I was surprised by the gap between men and women's preferance on FPTP and PR, and I wanted to get individual opinions on your views about FPTP vs PR.

Usually cited pros of each:

FPTP- stops coalition governments, keeps extremists out
PR- seats more accuraccurately match votes, voters do not feel their vote is wasted due to safe seats.

I've added the men's one purely for comparison.

There are no wrong answers, I hope as many people as possible giving their opinion!

Perhaps it is because many women can see the merits and disadvantages of both systems, and are undecided as to which might be the better option, given the Brexit situation, Covid, Scotland thinking about independence again, you name it.

'Don't know' doesn't equal 'too thick to comprehend'.

You don't mention stability in your pros and cons. That's a biggie.

Especially so in a country like the UK, where from the 1990s to the early 2010s, both main parties tended towards the centre. Stability, without a tendency towards extremism, is quite attractive.

I’ve not given it loads of thought so would probably answer don’t know but on a quick thought if I had to give an answer I would say I prefer FPTP.
I like our definitive system although it can produce hung governments and a tory libdem government in 2010.
There’s been a few examples of EU countries ungoverned for several months due to PR. I think Belgium ( but might be wrong)
On balance fptp is a more stable system imo and keeps out the extremists better.

PR gives too much power to minority groups, some of whom have very extreme views. I am a feminist first & foremost & women would suffer most if some of these groups got a sniff of power.
In this country I am referring to the LibDems & the Green Party who basically want women to stfu when it comes to the conflict between trans rights & women’s rights to single sex spaces.
Take a look at Scotland for example.

Yes i think women say 'i dont know' to mean 'i need more information to make a reasoned choice'

I prefer a system based on PR - i think it was the german system i liked best. I really enjoyed looking at different voting systems and the pros and cons. The best thing about FPTP is people understand it as it seems simple.

Our system is adversarial and people cant cope with working together.

I can't believe that pps didn't realise the reality TV hypothesis was tongue in cheek in the middle of that post.
That someone thought it was the OP is even funnier.

And why I think more women say I don’t know is that they are less afraid to admit when they don’t know something or haven’t given it enough thought to have a considered opinion. Many men, even (or especially) those with no clue, will spout forth their opinions regardless

@Lordamighty

PR gives too much power to minority groups, some of whom have very extreme views. I am a feminist first & foremost & women would suffer most if some of these groups got a sniff of power. In this country I am referring to the LibDems & the Green Party who basically want women to stfu when it comes to the conflict between trans rights & women’s rights to single sex spaces. Take a look at Scotland for example.

As opposed to the Cons, with very middle ground views??

Without sounding sexist I would say a man is more likely to give an answer even if they don’t know as they don’t want to be seen as not knowing (like when asking for directions) whereas a female may not care as much if they don’t know.

There’s been a few examples of EU countries ungoverned for several months due to PR. I think Belgium ( but might be wrong)

Belgium didn't do too badly out of not having an elected government. At least they managed not to get out of the EU on a whim.

@Nightlystroll

Because you like fashion and reality tv doesn't mean you don't have brains. I like both of those things and I am super intelligent.

Not to mention modest!

I am now intrigued if women tick i dont more often on lots of other questions not just that one.

I'd prefer "first past the post"
Runs and hides

Especially so in a country like the UK, where from the 1990s to the early 2010s, both main parties tended towards the centre. Stability, without a tendency towards extremism, is quite attractive.

And then shit happened.

Funnily enough most European countries have still tended towards the centre and have been fairly stable. There are exceptions. But the UK is hardly a beacon for the FPTP system.

Totally agree about many men being unable to utter the words 'I don't know' (and often being happy to talk utter bollocks, even to present said utter bollocks to other people as 'advice', without shame or even the awareness that they don't know).

I wonder (and pollsters must know about this) whether there is any element of women saying 'don't know' and meaning 'please get out of my face and leave me alone'.

I know my own life experience is that when people approach me on the street, demanding my time, or answers to questions, I will usually be preparing a 'no thanks' response, before they've even spoken. Even if I do engage briefly, I am wary and in flight mode.

A lifetime of annoying salespeople with drawn out, faux friendly spiels and arseholes offering 'compliments', in the guise of friendliness or asking a question, is the cause.

You also fail to mention the local and personal link to the MP that FPTP gives, that most forms of PR do not. That's another biggie for a lot of people.

@VerticalHorizon

Nightlystroll

Because you like fashion and reality tv doesn't mean you don't have brains. I like both of those things and I am super intelligent.

Not to mention modest!

I never use bushels so there's no point putting my light under one.

@sergeilavrov

You should refer to the work of Kristy Parathkis, or experimental work in decision making (lots from the same department). Women have a higher informational threshold to make choices: they are more willing to say they don’t know, whereas men will provide opinion as fact at a far lower threshold (often zero or one piece of information) and rate their confidence in the choice more highly. This is despite women being equally or more well informed on a matter.

This feeds into some of the behavioural Econ literature, as women make better long term investments thanks to their risk alert status pushing them to take informed risks. I’m a little astonished your department hasn’t covered these cognitive sex-based differences if they’re exposing you to polling data! It’s pretty fundamental.

Gosh, thank you for posting this @sergeilavrov ! I often look at YouGov survey results and note the significant difference in the proportion of men and women answering ‘don’t know’, so I was really hoping this thread would shed some light. And thanks to you it has! I’ll do some reading in the author and areas you suggest. Loving the erudition and generosity of MN Talk!

People often forget we had a referendum on proportional representation during the conservative / lib dem coalition in 2011. 32% voted yes, barely 40% turnout

That is how much people care about the voting system we use. I despair

Here’s an interesting article from the Washington Post giving a little bit of data to support the intuitively appealing hypothesis that women are more likely to admit that they don’t know.
www.google.co.uk/amp/s/www.washingtonpost.com/news/the-fix/wp/2014/05/16/are-women-more-likely-to-say-i-dont-know-to-poll-questions-it-appears-so/%3foutputType=amp

I know Lweji shit did happen!

Plus the Iraq war and 2008 crash during that end-of-history-esque stable centrist period. Events do bugger up a good intention, as Macmillan sort of said.

@lottiegarbanzo

You also fail to mention the local and personal link to the MP that FPTP gives, that most forms of PR do not. That's another biggie for a lot of people.

That is probably my only plus point. I do wonder, however, how much it can actually benefit constituents, or if it is just a perception.

For those saying I have not included stability, to be honest whilst it is often cited as a pro, I'm not sure it is as clear a pro as it once was. I would say that in 7 of the last 11 years it failed to provide that.

And to respond to people saying it does keep extremists out, one could argue that extreme positions are already in the House. The reason UKIP and the Brexit Party were demolished was because the Conservative Party moved to the right to align with the voters who had left them for those two parties. Johnson even removed MPs who most considered the moderates in the party in 2019.

And on the Left, you have the Left in the Labour Party who are so Left they can't stand the centre-left! After Batley and Spen they were so angry that they could not now mount a leadership batter against Starmer that they couldn't even say well done on telly!

Plus the Iraq war and 2008 crash during that end-of-history-esque stable centrist period.

It is interesting that both were triggered by the US, under a President elected under another FPTP system, and with less votes than his opponent (at least on the first election in 2000).
What would have happened under Al Gore is anyone's guess, of course.

@bumblingbovine49

People often forget we had a referendum on proportional representation during the conservative / lib dem coalition in 2011. 32% voted yes, barely 40% turnout

That is how much people care about the voting system we use. I despair

That wasn't offering true proportional representation, the alternative to FPTP was an alternative vote system.