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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

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Original poster

To think it's good England football team came second ...

73 replies

Dustyboots · 12/07/2021 23:22

It fine to come second. It's good for our kids to know that and to see how well the team did to get to the final and how well they played anyway. It's good for us all to know that coming first isn't the all important thing.

And this has shone a light on something far more important than winning - racist bullying - I feel like we're actually talking about it now. The racists and the idiots in government are having a proper light shone on them.

This feels an important moment that wouldn't have happened if we'd have won.

OP posts:

AlmostSummer21 · 13/07/2021 07:49

Italy played dirty (surprise, surprise). They should have been down to 10 men, they were allowed to 'get away' with FAR too much.

It shouldn't have come down to penalties.

But they are all stars to agree to take penalties.

We had missed opportunities throughout, which was a huge shame.

They did exceptionally well to get as far as the finals, they're a young group and a real 'Team'. Hopefully the World Cup will be our opportunity to 'bring it home'!!

The racist idiots aren't fans, they're just idiots using football as a platform.

Eskarina1 · 13/07/2021 07:50

DV going up 36% doesn't tell you anything about how many England fans are abusive just that they are more likely to be abusive after a loss. 100, 100000 or 1,000,000 can all increase by 36%.

We need to change how we think about winning or losing. Only one team can win. That doesn't mean the other 32 teams are rubbish or didn't deserve it. We don't need to unpick why we only came 2nd.

We have a very young team, who are getting better. Italy's team included many players at the end of their career. What happened to Saka was unforgivable. Not related to the play, just a vicious attack from a grown man on a teenager. It doesn't change the fact that Italy were the stronger team but it does mean I wish literally any other team had won.

OffMyCloud · 13/07/2021 08:02

I would have strongly preferred that we'd won.

Overall though, probably the best team won the competition. That doesn't always happen in football, but it seems fair in this case. I though Spain were better than Italy in the semifinal, and feel we would have preferred to play them in the final?

We have a great team, getting more experienced after this event. Hopefully that very significant minority of scummy fans will learn a lesson with policing in the WC. Fingers crossed!!

TheDevils · 13/07/2021 08:09

It's not a small minority of English football fans that are racist and thuggish. If it was a small minority why is it DV goes up 36% after a losing game?

Football is the occasion not the reason. These men will be racist and thuggish with or without football. DV also increases at Christmas, on bank holidays and during spells of hot weather. The common denominator is alcohol.

They are violent men who would be violent whatever the occasion.

Fallsballs · 13/07/2021 08:35

Agree @TheDevils racism, sexism and violence is not the product of social media but inherent in a large group of men who happen also to be football fans. Too easy to blame SM and not address the fact there’s a massive amount of mindless thugs who have a heightened sense of entitlement and are wankers.
Yes wankers, and there’s a lot of them.

TheDevils · 13/07/2021 08:45

I've seen a lot of people share the DV statistic during this and other tournaments and it concerns me.
It is very important that we shout about DV and do what we can to raise awareness and tackle the issue but I worry that it creates a particular narrative around football fans and perpetrators of DV, a narrative that can cause people to make assumptions.

I know an awful lot of football fans. All of them are wonderful, kind, caring people.
Unfortunately I've also know men who are perpetrators of DV and none of them had any interest in football.

Men who carry out DV are violent individuals. They would still be violent individuals with or without football.

StormzyinaTCup · 13/07/2021 08:46

Penalty shoot outs are harsh and as other posters have said the focus then becomes about the individual rather than the team.

Maybe they would be better off after 90/120 mins if the result is a draw the winner is decided on the team with least amount of yellow cards at the end of the match. It would make for a cleaner game. As it stands at the moment, and for some countries more than others, dubious/underhand tackles are well worth taking a card for if it prevents a potential run on goal by the opposition.

Buttons294749 · 13/07/2021 08:48

I think coming 2nd is a huge achievement. Out of all the 20 (?) Ish teams they were I the top 2. Great!

Buttons294749 · 13/07/2021 08:49

@stormzyinatcup yes! That's actually a brilliant idea, cuts down on cheating which spoils the game.

EdgeOfACoin · 13/07/2021 08:53

@Honeybeebloom

Better thugs too the Italian squad.......

Bitter much? England were the more aggressive team in the first half, then the Italians came back at them hard in the second. Obviously Chiellini's move was out of line but there was nothing else any different to what the English players were doing the whole game.

Ah, that's probably why England got one yellow card whereas the Italians got what, 6?

Because they were equally aggressive.

ConstantlySeekingHappiness · 13/07/2021 09:05

Maybe they would be better off after 90/120 mins if the result is a draw the winner is decided on the team with least amount of yellow cards at the end of the match

This is ridiculous.

Why not base it on the team who had dominant possession of the ball? Or the most shots on target? Or the most goals throughout the tournament? Or any other statistic relating to the actual game.

What does yellow cards have to do with anything???!!

Sterling dived to get a penalty in the Semi. Why no comment on those dirty tactics?

A tournament isn’t won on fewest yellow cards.

MrsDThomas · 13/07/2021 09:08

They didn’t come second. They lost.

And they don’t take well to it.

3Britnee · 13/07/2021 09:58

This.

And every other country, pretty much, have their own share of hooligans too. It's not just England.

3Britnee · 13/07/2021 09:59

Ffs, I'm so pissed off with quotes dropping out all the fucking time 🙄

pinkcircustop · 13/07/2021 10:00

@Moanranger

The better team won, more experienced, better footwork. England tried hard, but talent won.

No, the cheating team won.

Honeybeebloom · 13/07/2021 10:17

No, the cheating team won.

😂 I'm a teacher and some of the posts on here like this one are exactly the kind of thing 8 year olds I teach say when they've lost something.

grapewine · 13/07/2021 10:26

No, the cheating team won.

The team that scored the most penalty shots won. And they were better on the whole in the match. Deserved.

StormzyinaTCup · 13/07/2021 10:26

This is ridiculous.

Why not base it on the team who had dominant possession of the ball? Or the most shots on target? Or the most goals throughout the tournament? Or any other statistic relating to the actual game.

What does yellow cards have to do with anything???!!

Sterling dived to get a penalty in the Semi. Why no comment on those dirty tactics?

A tournament isn’t won on fewest yellow cards.

It was just an idea - jeez
I was suggesting it as a way to clean up the game from dirty tactics which some countries use to their fullest. I didn’t suggest deciding it on ball possession or any other examples you mentioned because that would be ridiculous.

grapewine · 13/07/2021 10:28

Sterling dived to get a penalty in the Semi. Why no comment on those dirty tactics?

Quite.

StormzyinaTCup · 13/07/2021 16:49

@grapewine

Sterling dived to get a penalty in the Semi. Why no comment on those dirty tactics?

Quite.

A blatant dive is a yellow card (in some extreme cases a red). Sterling appeared to be diving so he should have got a yellow card but the ref obviously thought otherwise. Maybe that should have been looked at on VAR especially as it was such a key match for both teams.

I follow a football team that has a player who has a habit of going down in the box (won't name names). I don’t like seeing it from him or any from any other player.

Original poster

Dustyboots · 13/07/2021 17:01

Maybe they would be better off after 90/120 mins if the result is a draw the winner is decided on the team with least amount of yellow cards at the end of the match. It would make for a cleaner game

This is a really good idea

OP posts:

Mandalay246 · 13/07/2021 21:13

No, the cheating team won.

The excuse made by bad losers all around the world.

Penalty shoot outs are harsh and as other posters have said the focus then becomes about the individual rather than the team.

Surely you realise that penalty shootouts don't happen only in football? It's part of the rules - deal with it. There are, believe it or not, even more unfair ways to decide the winner of sporting fixtures.

Lampzade · 13/07/2021 21:14

@HmmmmmmInteresting

I'm glad they didn't win because the fans don't deserve it. They certainly don't deserve these players.

This

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