to think that in the future obesity will be a mental illness

[postitgirl]

ok , bear with me....
I've been watching a few programmes about anorexia, I don't know why, they've just 'popped up' on netflix and amazon, and it's so interesting how even though people with anorexia are literally starving themselves, they still don't eat. So I started thinking, I've been trying to lose weight for years and year and years, and it's so bloody hard, because there is a thing in my brain that equates pleasure with over-eating crap. I go on a diet, and my willpower lasts for a few days, if I'm lucky, and then this overwhelming urge to break the diet, to binge, to eat chocolate and all the bad things, not just a small square of chocolate, like a bar, plus ice-cream etc etc. Any of us who struggle know what i'ts like. And it's getting worse as I get older. I'm becoming more attached to that feeling of 'release' when I do overeat... I'ts like a stress reliever to my brain - I'm suddenly a nicer person to my kids, I feel chilled, I feel satisfied, I feel happy, but of course i'ts a vicious cycle of self-hatred etc etc.
So it just occurred to me that in the future, maybe the treatment for obesity will be similar to that of anorexia, with the blame being taken out of the equation, that it will be treated literally as a mental disease - a disease where your mind is taken over, in a similar way to the way anorexia takes over. just the way some of the young girls were talking about how it was the "anorexia talking" even thuogh they knew they were making themselves ill, and could even die, the anorexia wouldn't let them eat.
Just as someone who has struggled mentally with my weight for all these years - i'ts like the "fat" talking. Cos when I'm "sane" of course I want to stop doing it, I want to get fit, and slim etc etc. And I know what I should be eating and what I shouldnt I could probably get a degree in nutrition at this stage I've done so much research on what I should eat and not eat.
What do you all think - can anyone relate.

2/3 is obese or overweight

The Japanese have hikikoromi - acute social withdrawal - apparently half a million Japanese youths have it (Wiki).

yes I agree, I saw an expert talking in one of the programmes and he said whilst anorexia might start as body dysmorphia, the desire to be thin, to go on a diet, that anorexics became addicted to the light-headed almost 'high' that they got from starving themselves. They started to hate the feel of anything in their tummy.

I agree I don't think anorexia and binge eating are opposite ends of the spectrum in that they are different, I think the thing some people don't realise about being addicted to overeating is the mental games we play with ourselves. For me it's not about having a latte and a croissant instead of a tea with a biscuit. i'm pretty healthy most of the time, I like vegetables, I always have a healthy breakfast lunch and dinner, that's all fine, the problem comes when I'm stressed and I turn to food, and like someone said it's a small dopamine high I guess. I have to eat enough to get that, and the amount grows as you get older, at least it has for me. I don't know the answer, I just wish I could switch off that voice in my head, that overwhelming urge, and just be normal around food. Eat my 3 meals a day and go to bed.

You've conflated an outcome (obesity) with a behaviour.

Abnormal eating patterns are already known to be associated with mental illness.

There are also a whole range of conditions and medications that can change your appetite and metabolism.

I think the growth and prevalence of anti depressants is significant.

They all make me eat my head off and have this affect on many people. If one in three have a mental health disorder that’s a lot of overeating.

Other psychiatric drugs have similar effects. No one ever seems to consider this.

I do agree OP, I think it's clear that over eating is very much related to the state of our MH. However, with c. 1/3 of the adult population obese, it's just not possible to treat individual cases with proper MH care, so people will need to find a way to help themselves, even if it is officially classified as a mental illness. I don't think telling people that they're ill and putting them on long waiting lists for help that never comes or is inadequate (which it will have to be because of the sheer cost involved) would be helpful, probably counter productive while people wait for someone else to solve their issues. Obviously it would be good if excellent support was available, but how can it be with so many people affected?

*I took take issue with the assumption that Anorexia is due to body image. I get so tired of this assumption.
*
It's not an assumption, it's based on my many years of clinical experience working with individuals with mental illness. And a PhD.

[quote HostessTrolley]@babyblues21 I disagree - while body dysmorphia is a feature of anorexia it’s not the core or the cause[/quote]

I didn't say it was the cause.

I said it was a key feature. Which based on my own clinical experiences, it is.

My point being (for those who seem to have misunderstood)

Nobody overeats because of an intense fear of being "too thin".

However .. Many individuals with anorexia under-eat because of a fear of the opposite (ie of gaining weight).

Body image is irrelevant when it comes to the reasons for over eating - no-one overeats to avoid being thin. However body image is very often a factor in anorexia.

Hence my point about false comparison.

And I did follow up by saying that I accept mental illness may be a driver for over eating in some people (not all - some). But I don't think the comparison with anorexia was helpful, for the reasons stated.

Yeah as another poster said, a lot of obesity that isn't sensory based is often trauma based,
one programme a mother was extremely obese and bedbound her daughter had to care for her, she and her siblings were badly neglected and often left alone in the house with little food whilst they were at the pub, she said i cant be abandoned now, which is all kinds of fucked up in regards to the daughter and the impact on her life, but yeah i thought that woman needs serious therapy not exploiting on tv!!!

I think it's actually quite easy in modern society to become overweight or obese. Severe morbid obesity is another issue and is often a symptom or result of mental illness or trauma. Some people turn to alcohol or drugs...for others, they use food as a drug. It's not surprising why. It's cheap, it's readily available, you dont need to meet a dodgy dealer to acquire it! It's gives you a dopamine hit and even if you want to stop, you actually can't because we all need to eat so you can't go cold turkey.

Rather than obesity being a mental illness, I would say that obesity is the symptom/result of a mental illness. Much like with anorexia, being very thin/malnutrition can be the symptoms/results of the mental illness, rather than them being the mental illness.

So I would say obesity is the physical result of mental illnesses like binge eating, overeating etc. In the future I think there will be more support for them, but at the moment there isn’t really much support as so much seems to be focused on treating the result (the obesity) rather than the mental illness, which is the eating.

Anorexia isn't about food or losing weight to get slim if it a controlling disorder.
Aneroxia is a loss of control when you can't get a grip on anything through MH issues food becomes your weapon.
I was never fat before I was restricting food it was never about my weight.
The warped power you now have over loved ones reinforced the need for this control eventually your stomach closes.
It has similar secrets hiding your body shape.
Comments on some teenagers weight won't cause aneroxia if they are otherwise NT.
I know with my friend she just hasn't got motivation and loves takeaways and sugary foods, wine.
She has a 3 y.o on reins because she can't keep up with her, It upsets her a lot but unless she makes a change it'll get harder.

I don’t agree I know several people who are obese due to health conditions and medication. One very close relative eats 800 calories a day as a maintenance diet to keep their bmi at 30. There isn’t much else they can do.

It may be related to mental illness for some people, but for most of the population who are overweight or obese it is a normal response to an obesogenic environment. And a lot of people do not realise what a healthy diet looks like, partly because a lot of crap is marketed as healthy (eg baby food packed with (natural) sugar)

I also don’t think it’s particularly helpful to pathologise the mental health of a massive section of the population, when actually it’s the environment they live in that is the problem.

@MoaningMel

I also don’t think it’s particularly helpful to pathologise the mental health of a massive section of the population, when actually it’s the environment they live in that is the problem.

Absolutely this.

I think it’s well recognised that some factors in obesity are linked to mental health. A side effect of MH disorders, or their medication, or in some cases entirely an MH issue in its own right. This is not a new thing at all, it is already well recognised.

However, there are plenty of people who are “just fat”.
From their environment - it’s harder for some people to be a healthy weight if they’re surrounded by processed food and they’ve working shifts that screw with their bodies, for example.
There are people who are just a bit overweight who are surrounded by others who are too, so that they simply don’t even realise they’re not a healthy weight.
But there are also people who are fat because they choose to eat too much, usually unhealthily. Sometimes, it really is as simple as people choosing the doughnut every day instead of once a week - and pathologising that choice isn’t helpful.

In some cases it is a manifestation of MH issues. Not all though. I went from normal to morbidly obese, now I am just bog standard obese. It wasn't MH issues. If it was for me labeled as MH issues I don't think I would ever start losing weight. Already the "oh well, maybe I am addicted to x foods" was a set back. I was just lazy and o ereating bit by bit while swimming in denial.

I am obese but have very good mental health. Have had a few bouts of anxiety in my time but my weight didn't change then at all. I am obese because I have gained about a pound in weight every year for the last 30 years.

I don't binge, I don't noticeably overeat, I probably eat a lot less than the average person as I am short and sedentary and stick to two meals per day.

Being obese is easily done!

l totally disagree. You say it yourself OP, the issue is a lack of willpower. This is completely different to Anorexia which has nothing to do with willpower. the process that stops them from eating is much more complex and deeply rooted.

I totally get where you are coming from because I, like a vast section of our society, struggle with resisting temptation and have fallen into bad habits. That's a sign of social poor health, not mental health. Sadly, we are much less resilient and being so has become much more socially acceptable.

Of course, some obesity is a result of a mental illness, undoubtedly, but it doesn't make obesity one by its virtue. If overweight/obese people were offered half of their income for 5 years to lose the weight and keep it, most would manage it. Most Anorexic wouldn't.

Being very underweight or overweight is not a mental illness or eating disorder in itself.

But these things can however be symptoms and complications from severe and untreated eating disorders. It also may not be caused by an eating disorder at all.

For example, anorexia is a mental illness, it's not being skeletal thin. Being very underweight is a complication of untreated severe anorexia.

There's a lot of ignorance around surrounding stuff like this even with doctors. If you're not very underweight then the treatment for anorexia is mostly non existent. Apparently the illness needs to leave you at deaths door before anyone will do anything about it.

I have a friend suffering from anorexia who is classed as obese. Some may say, well you can't be overweight and suffering from anorexia. Of course you can! She's disabled and is not able to exercise. She is plagued everyday by awful thoughts about her weight has in the past restricted food massively because of this. At some point she was living off water and one meal every other day and tracking her weight religiously. This is anorexia. And it took a giant fight for her to get therapy/treatment for it.

I agree completely that eating disorders, including binge eating, can lead to things like obesity. It's just beyond frustrating that you have to "look" like you have an eating disorder before people take it seriously. If only this could be recognised and treated earlier in life and not have to wait a decade before our bodies face the consequence of mental health issues.

In my opinion the whole attitude to EDs as a whole needs to change. This includes both those with EDs that lead them to lose weight and gain weight.

One thing I notice about a lot of overweight people is that they believe they're committed to losing weight because they spend a lot of time thinking about it and talking about it. However, this isn't the same as actually going to gym of exercising. It might seem like an obvious statement but IME it's often accurate.

Overweight and obese people can be incredibly strong willed and disciplined in other areas of life; finances, work ethic, deadlines, parenting. Will power is nothing to do with obesity. It's a complex issue but mental health, obesogenic environments, malnourishment, genes, gut biome, hormones are all areas of research providing more and more useful information. I speak as someone who spent 56 years overweight/obese and the last 4 years at a healthy bmi.

Anorexia is a biological and genetic brain disease and has appeared throughout history.

It's different to bulimia and compulsive over-eating which are more environmentally mediated. Therapy doesn't help with anorexia until weight restored, only feedng. Very different to the other EDs.

Of course not all obesity is a sign of mental illness. It might be genetics and how we respond to our obescogenic environment (really, the question is why aren't we all fat in developed countries?!) and, obviously, compulsive overeating is an eating disorder. But it's certainly far from all.