To not know what to do - daughter wants to move class

[Schoolissuesdaughter]

Sorry this is long, but don't want to drip feed.

My Dd is in reception. We moved areas the summer before she started, so she didn't know any of the children. It's a school with a nursery so a lot of kids already knew each other. She very quickly made friends with a lovely little girl who was in the same boat, I'll call her Lily (not her real name). Lily unfortunately is in the other reception class. In reception the classes are joined together by a sliding door and the classes spend a lot of time together. This will not be the case in year 1.

Before the January lockdown DD mainly played with Lily, but also played with a handful of other girls including a girl I'll call her Hope (who is in her current class). Since going back things seem to have shifted and she has mainly played with Hope, with playing with Lily when they are in group together (Lily has settled well and has lots of friends so not left out). Throughout I have tried to encourage DD to play with a wider group as I know how easily kids at this age can fall out. I do not know Hope at all as a child as she stays for after school club so isn't about at pick up. Recently my DD has admitted that Hope is quite controlling and doesn't like her playing with other children. She will stand there watching and refuse to join in. She will tell DD she wants her to play her game. I have told DD that she should continue playing with other children if she wants to. DD then came home the other day upset. Hope had been given the opportunity to pick a friend twice that day for a small treat and neither time she picked DD despite the fact they spend all their time together. She also said Hope isn't always very nice to her though I didn't get specifics.

On top of this there are a couple of mean girls in her class (the only term I can think of based on Dd's description). They will make snide comments, like for none uniform day DD was wearing a bow the same colour as what she was wearing. One said 'Oh.. she's matching' in a nasty tone. One grabbed my daughter against her will one day and took her over to other (I can't really work out why? Something to do with a game the mean girls were playing). My Dd say's these girls seem a lot older. She has only told me about these girls today.

I had been hoping they would mix the classes next year as my Dd was asked who she played with a few weeks back (she said Hope and Lily). I have been told by someone who works at the school she didn't think they were. I asked my Dd this evening if she was given a choice which class would she go into. She said she wanted to be in the other class with Lily.

I am not sure what to do now. Lily is a lovely girl, but again she would be relying on one other child. That said there is often another girl from that class around when we are waiting to pick up my other DD who seems really keen to befriend her. As for the mean girls, do you always get kids like this in every class? I know I had one when I was in primary school. I am also not sure if it has just been a tough couple of weeks and she is reacting or this has been building up. I am really unsure if I should speak to the school and ask if it is possible for her to start year 1 in the other class.

She is 5!
If you are getting involved in friendship issues now and think this is bad just wait until they are 9/10 and older !

With 'Lily is a lovely girl' and the mums you speak to are from the other class, I think it is you pushing your DD to change classes?

A 5 year old pulling another one to show them something isn't necessarily controlling' either.

It might be better to try to help your child deal with social situations she doesn't like rather than moving her away from it. None of this sounds awful and similar situations will continue to arise over the years, building her resilience might be more beneficial. Not picking your DD for a treat and saying something in a 'nasty tone' (in your 5yo DD opinion presumably?) Doesn't make 'mean girls'

obviously every area is different but where i am it is unlikely a child would be moved class because they would rather be in the same class as another child. If they did it for one parent they'd have to do it for all.

Schools really can't just move children from class to class for reasons like this, otherwise everybody would constantly be asking them to! Every child has fall-outs. Every child has groups of kids they don't like. Every child has friends they don't get to sit next to or whose class they don't end up in etc.

You are massively over-invested in this.
Moving to a new class will bring new friends and different trials, exactly the same kind of silly ins and outs of details. If you are gonna raise her to be confident you need to MODEL bring more confidant and relaxed and not taking everything she says in such detail and with such weight.
Children only report a minute fraction of Interactions to their parents, very rarely the happy ones.

We had something very similar in reception. Spoke to the teacher who then monitored the situation and they did a lot of work about modelling good friendships. Speak to the teacher!

Op it has been so tough on lockdown for this age group. You need to remember that all these children have missed a lot of normal developmental socialising. All the children you are talking about are very very young. They aren't being mean and they may need support on learning about social skills

You absolutely should talk to the teacher but there is no point asking to move and really your daughter just needs more support.

You can arrange playdates what has masks got to do with it ? I have literally had every child my kid wants round St some point ! I don't know the parents but I make the effort to go and introduce myself even though it isn't always easy. And you can always just ask in the class WhatsApp hey can I ask is so and so mum here.

1. Speak to the teacher. You are going for the option of last resort rather than engaging in communication. Which is ironic when you say there is all sorts of communication issues going on in your 5year olds life.
2. With that in mind, i have to ask is your influence having an impact here in any way? There seems to be some projecting here and you being the one to label 5 year olds mean rather than 5 year olds still learning social skills.
3. Kids of this age regularly change friendships. Its unusual for a kid to have the same best friend from nursery all the way to high school.
4. Do you know if the school change classes later on or not? DS's school have a routine of rearranging the two classes after reception to 'balance them better' for both the kids and the teachers after getting to know them better. What was interesting about this was which parents complained because knowing the kids and spending extra time in school helping out, i knew why they had separated certain kids from others but the school couldn't tell the parents why. In every case there was a good argument for why it had been done. The school have a policy where they won't allow parents to argue with the decision for this year move.

They don't move them at DS's school after this point without an exceptional reason but it does happen occasionally.

From talking to parents from other schools they sometimes do this changing around at a different age rather than at year1.

5)Usually these things seem less one sided than you think and they can give as much as they get at age 5. Its all about boundary testing and its normal. 5 year olds can seem mean to adults but its meaningless and part of learning. They fall out and an hour again they are best mates.

Golden rule, keep it in school OP. It’s really important for children to learn socialisation skills, even more so after the past 18 months, this includes problem solving, conflict resolution, how to get on with different types of people, compromise, etc etc list goes on. They can’t do that if parents intervene whenever there is a disagreement, or someone they don’t get on with. It gets harder over time not easier, wait until KS2! Let your daughter figure it out, I promise you she will and it will work itself out in time.
Unless there is bullying, or sustained malicious behaviour I wouldn’t even mention this to the teacher. As others have suggested, play dates can be helpful in establishing/cementing friendships.

Ask for a meeting with teacher or head and set out what you have said here. Say your daughter hasn’t settled well and is feeling bullied in her current class and you are considering moving schools but would like to see if she could be happy in the other class.

Do NOT say ‘she wants to be with Lily’ they will run a mile if they think this is a ‘please change classes around so my daughter can be with her bestie’ they often deliberately split best friends up btw. DO saybyou are considering moving schools as this will be a pain for them and will wake them up a bit. DO be prepared to be patronisingly told that your daughter is fine in her current class.

DO say you are considering moving schools as this will be a pain for them and will wake them up a bit.

It will? I wouldn't be so sure about that, we've had parents threaten a school move in my school before to try get their way (now I'm talking about issues like this, not huge problems). Our standard reaction is "well, it will be sad to see little Alfie go but we wish him all the best". I've only ever seen one follow through on the threat and we were oy delighted to be rid of her.

OP, the above is the nuclear option and way OTT for the 'situation' that you have at the moment. Situation is in air quotes as it's such a non-event and very typical for the age. This is something that your child will likely experience again in primary - it's very normal - and you need to give her the skills to cope with that. The teacher can help support that, if you come at it wanting to work together.

DO saybyou are considering moving schools as this will be a pain for them and will wake them up a bit.
This is just pure nonsense. How exactly would the school be inconvenienced by a pupil leaving?

Skysblue
Let's say that the Op threatens to move schools and frames it as her dd feeling bullied. The school move her dd into Lily's class. Three weeks later her dd complains that Lily prefers to play with other girls and she feels left out again. What then? Go back and say ' Oh actually, she would be better off back in the other class'. The OP needs to chill out and let her dd learn how to socialise and deal with the normal ups and downs of social communication.

It's sadly how they learn. Bossy ones get their corners rubbed off. Quiet ones have to find their voice. In hindsight I would teach her what to say back. I like my bow and that's all that matters. I don't care what you think. I won't pick you next time Hope. And I'd give tips on how to ask someone to play a game. How to connect with others. Coping strategies. This never goes away until they're about 15. You can't keep dodging it.

I won't pick you next time Hope
Bloody hell, don't . Teach her that Hope had no obligation whatsoever to pick her, not to try to get revenge because she didn't.

I disagree @greyhound. If ops dd has prioritised Hope and it's not reciprocated to the point it has upset her, it's ok to verbalise that.

@Weedsgalore no child should be taught to emotionally manipulate others. Threatening that you’ll leave the other child out next time is emotional blackmail that should be heavily discouraged. Small children do this a lot anyway ‘I’m not inviting you to my (nonexistent) party’ ….. it’s not to be encouraged. It’s doesn’t build positive relationships.

@Weedsgalore

I disagree *@greyhound*. If ops dd has prioritised Hope and it's not reciprocated to the point it has upset her, it's ok to verbalise that.

Hope had to pick 2 people on a given day. No indication that this is lack of friendship reciprocation. Maybe Hope picked the child that is often left out, or never picked for treats, or the new child ... All behaviours that should be encouraged. Or maybe she didn't pick OP's DD because they'd had a falling out 10 minutes previously and hadn't yet made up (that came 10 minutes later). Friendships at Reception age are famously hugely volatile.