New Forest pub bans under 12 year olds...

[Dresssos]

m.facebook.com/story.php?story_fbid=10159581700162769&id=185263007768

It's all kicking off in the comments.

Do you agree with the pub's decision?

YABU No
YANBU Yes

It’ll be easier as they get older to go out places but for now I think it’s fine to have adult only places or places with age restrictions to eat.

The thing is if you only go to such places then they aren't going to learn how to behave somewhere more formal. I've always liked to do a variety. Thankfully I have dc who enjoy great food so they'll sit happily for a pub lunch, at a tapas restaurant or in the ivy, they can get up and move around at brewers fayre

The problem is that it’s often not just one family that’s a problem.

Once one family let their kids be noisy others inevitably follow. Then it gets harder for the staff to clamp down on it.

And ultimately staff in pubs and restaurants are well enough paid to have to tackle badly behaved families on top of the inevitable badly behaved drunk.

Mine are far from perfect, but I’ve always been prepared to leave a place of their behaviour merited it. Last weekend I actually heard a Mum say “well I’ve tried everything and it’s not working so...” Leaving and inconveniencing herself and her other children simply wasn’t an option for her clearly and many take that stance.

I'm sorry they've had problems but it's a dire pub.I'm all for dog friendly but it absolutely reeks of dogs in there.

We took our kids out to dinner on Saturday, after spending the day telling them off numerous times for fighting. It was DHs birthday so they were warned to behave themselves otherwise it would be a long time before we went out for dinner again. They were lovely, polite, and great company.
The table next to us was an absolute nightmare. They were there before us, a mum and dad and their daughters. The daughters were shrieking and singing and you could tell that other diners were getting pissed off with it.
The difference between our kids and the other kids...ours are 13 and 9 and theirs were in their late 20s. There were other, younger children, all well behaved.
The owners are absolutely within their rights to say who they will serve but I won't necessarily choose somewhere like that if it was just my DH and I, because adults are more than capable of ruining a meal.

Yes I agree @camaleon it's not about kids being better behaved in certain places, it's more about different social expectations -- not just about dining out but about confronting people who are being obnoxious

Where I used to live in France there is no way a cafe or restaurant would rearrange itself around one horrible family, everyone would just be telling them to knock it off or get out

Just wanted to say that because so many people say British kids are worse behaved than kids in other countries and I don't think that's true

Some children do ruin the pub atmosphere for me, and I adore children. some parents just can't parent or install manners!

That is a fair point to make. It is about the atmosphere. You go out to get away from normal life.

I’m British but live abroad, it’s much more family friendly here and usual for kids to be out with families at night eating/walking etc, rather than put to bed at 7 with a babysitter. When we return to the U.K. I notice the difference instantly. I prefer kids being able to be around.

@cocoloco987

It’ll be easier as they get older to go out places but for now I think it’s fine to have adult only places or places with age restrictions to eat.

The thing is if you only go to such places then they aren't going to learn how to behave somewhere more formal. I've always liked to do a variety. Thankfully I have dc who enjoy great food so they'll sit happily for a pub lunch, at a tapas restaurant or in the ivy, they can get up and move around at brewers fayre

If course they are, my eldest is 10 the younger ones 3 and 2.

My 10 yo behaves perfectly in ‘fancy’ places/restaurants and adult spaces. Because as he got older it got easier (like I said) and he was gradually taken to more adult places and exposed to them. And frankly I’m not a lazy parent, I taught him manners and respect. Being in formal places is not a challenge for him.

I’ve no reason to think the same approach won’t work with the younger two also. For now it’s a bit tricky because of the age gap but my eldest does prefers places he can play and where there is likely to be other children so for now I’m happy to take him to them, which naturally works well with my youngest.

Where I used to live in France there is no way a cafe or restaurant would rearrange itself around one horrible family, everyone would just be telling them to knock it off or get out

Just wanted to say that because so many people say British kids are worse behaved than kids in other countries and I don't think that's true

That's true, I've noticed in France, Spain, Italy and Germany that people have no qualms about telling others to behave or leave.

There are 6 pubs between our village and the neighbouring 2 villages.

One of the 6 doesn't allow under 13s. It's by far the busiest of the 6.

I think at least 3 of the 6 could go adults only and still be full.

As long as they are clear about their policy I think it's fine. I take my children to the pub often, they behave themselves well but many don't and it spoils it for everyone.

Very very few pubs are actually coeliac safe. NGCI is not the same as gluten free. I can't think of one pub locally where I can eat.

The thing is if you only go to such places then they aren't going to learn how to behave somewhere more formal.

I disagree.

If you know how to behave, the same rules will apply everywhere!
You need the same table manners in Pizza Express or Gordon Ramsay's.
One might be noisier than the other, but it's about it.

I kind of agree with them and I have a dc who was a bit of a nightmare when eating out.
Surely (with space permitting) they could use another area entirely for families? That way people without kids who want a peaceful meal get just that.
But of course it might be that the staff are fed up navigating around unruly children and parents letting them run riot and making a mess.

@BronwenFrideswide

Where I used to live in France there is no way a cafe or restaurant would rearrange itself around one horrible family, everyone would just be telling them to knock it off or get out

Just wanted to say that because so many people say British kids are worse behaved than kids in other countries and I don't think that's true

That's true, I've noticed in France, Spain, Italy and Germany that people have no qualms about telling others to behave or leave.

It's the parents. The reactions are different

If you know how to behave, the same rules will apply everywhere!
You need the same table manners in Pizza Express or Gordon Ramsay's

Pizza express yes. Still a restaurant where you are required to sit at a table but I was responding to a comment that said they only go to places with play areas. Most of these places have seating inside or directly adjacent to the play areas so it's perfectly acceptable for dc to be running to and from a table and getting up and down between having a drink. That's not ok in pizza express or Nando's

I'm so glad my children are growing up abroad! As an expat I miss the UK a lot in many ways, but it's so nice to live in a country where children are welcomed everywhere, in fact, seeing children play and run and laugh and sing and be children is viewed as a joy rather than in the UK where the very sight and sound of children annoys people. Crazy that seeing a child running or hearing their voice can cause such rage to British adults. To be honest, i was probably the same before movint abroad and realising that 90% of other countries are totally different to Britain and actually like children 😂 So lovely to live somewhere where people are genuinely so happy to see children being children in any environment.

I'm in agreement with the pub. There are other places to take kids to eat.

I noticed a few entitled parents in the comments, who, no doubt are the kind of parents that are the problem. I'd have been mortified if my kids had behaved badly when we were eating out. But then again, I took responsibility for them and pub visits were few and far between when they were young.

One local pub doesn't allow children at all, another only accommodates kids aged 12+.

Another pub decided to remove its playground because it found the kids were having accidents whilst their parents were getting drunk. They also expected the staff to keep an eye out, despite signs saying the pub accepted no responsibility.

Wetherspoons used to have a policy where one parent wasn't allowed to drink.

If parents can't get their children to sit still at the table quietly then I don't blame hospitality managers putting in restrictions.

Agree with Posieandpip.

[quote MintyJulip]@CovidCorvid I think most pubs these days do a gluten free menu.
That's our experience anyway, as a family member is coeliac. Even our small local city pub offers gluten free and vegan menu[/quote]
I can't think of a pub in a 100 mile radius which dd could eat at. I don't trust pubs with the odd gluten free dish... They generally have no understanding of cross contamination. Chain establishments such as pizza express are good. This particular pub has a national reputation in the coeliac community as being safe. I'm 4 hours away, never been to it but I know of it. So a loss to nearer coeliac families.

Good for them I have kids but I make them behave. I’ve always been annoyed by the we let our children run wild crowd. It’s a shame it’s been ruined for those who do behave.

We will be visiting 🤣
I have 2 teens with ASD who are well behaved, they love eating out but dd2 can’t handle small children being noisy, babies crying or kids running around.

There are plenty of pubs where children are welcome.

They can do what they like but it’s a kick in the nuts for those of us they know how to bring up our kids and have taught them from a very young age how to act in public.
I can hand on heart say dd has never been loud, disruptive or rude in a pub / restaurant EVER.

I think it's fair enough, albeit a shame for those who would like a full GF menu.

I can't stand badly behaved children in restaurants of any kind and have been very strict with my own 2. The one time DS1 misbehaved in a restaurant was mostly because there were 3 other small children just allowed to run riot - under tables, around tables, racing each other - and DS1 was only 3 and couldn't understand why he couldn't do it if they could. It was in the restaurant of the hotel we were staying at, so DH (who had finished his meal) took DS back to the room with the rest of his dinner so he was no longer distracted by the ferals, and I finished my dinner in solitary state before rejoining them.

I think the reason for banning under 12s (rather than a younger age limit) is because it also frees them up from having a "children's menu", as the cut off age for those is usually 12.

I don't really blame the pub for this. A restaurant local to where I live very nearly banned children because of a couple of feral incidents - but luckily for us, they remembered that there were decently behaved kids around, so decided not to. They didn't allow the feral families to book again though!

I had a sneaky thought, but I doubt it would be allowed - since patrons are allowed to put up reviews of the restaurants etc. that they've been to, wouldn't it be handy if the restaurateurs were able to put up reviews of the awful customers! I saw that many places already share info on runners, aggressive customers and ferals - but it would be great if there was a "Customer advisor" review page too. Pretty sure it wouldn't be allowed under data protection laws though.