To ask what you think of weighing children in school

[cadburyegg]

Discussion on our school groups about the possibility of weighing children restarting as it was halted in March 2020. Lots of parents think it’s shameful and unnecessary, some are of the opinion that it’s “just for statistics” and can also be useful to see what centile your child is at.

I’m on the fence tbh. What are your thoughts?

My eldest especially (6yo) is slim, can see all you should be able to - ribs, spine, muscles etc - but it is SO. HEAVY. Has been since he was born, and he was even a failure to thrive - skin and bones and it was a real problem, but an official failure to thrive despite other babies his weight being totally fine. My little one is very dense too. So I would be told they’re overweight, but they’re definitely not, professionally certified healthy.

I live in a relatively affluent area and yet many of the children couldn't do their bikeability becaise they couldn't meet the minimum cycling requirements, and many have to stay in the shallow end and gain water confidence at school swimming lessons because they're so underexposed to pool swimming etc. These children are all driven to school and many are visibly overweight.

We know from research that the current 'obesity epidemic' in adults that it can blight lives. That type 2 diabetes, heart disease, strokes, cancer, mobility and joint issues etc etc all have links to weight.

We don't yet understand what increased risks being overweight earlier in life holds but we need to, we should be aware of and understand all the complex factors at play.

It is only by collecting data that greater acknowledgement and understanding can occur.

Like I say, my DC were completely unbothered by their measurements being taken. We didn't fixate on it at home and it was very much a low key event in school.

The question is why would it only be a low percentage? Why can't parents appreciate that if experts are telling them their child is overweight, it is worth investing in looking at the reasons
Because too many adults would have to examine their own actions and attitudes to food if they accept their child is overweight.
Some people do a lot of mental gymnastics to avoid taking any sort of action or accountability. If I had a pound for every "BMI is rubbish because it says pro rugby players are obese" type comment on here, I could afford a nice little holiday. We all know that your average person who is clearly heavily overweight to obese and leads a fairly sedentary lifestyle isn't a pro athlete with nutrition plans and training programmes.

@Dixiechickonhols

DD went to a private primary school and the NHS wouldn’t go in for routine eye tests, weighing etc. So if that’s case for all areas they are excluding a percentage of children anyway from stats (given higher sport levels in private and link between poverty and obesity I suspect most of those missing would be healthy weight) So when they say x percentage of 11 years olds overweight I always wonder if they’re just talking state educated.

Interesting, @Dixiechickonhols DS's primary was also fee paying, but they still had the regular weighing sessions. Possibly because we live in an LA with overweight/obesity levels way above national averages? There were large numbers of overweight/obese children in his school, so definitely not as simple as poor= fat, wealthy=slender. Many, many parents are in complete denial about their children's weight. This is becoming a huge public health crisis. Fitness levels of children have dropped through the floor over the last 15 months, even those that are slim are unfit, with very few maintaining pre-lockdown fitness levels. I include my own, slim, children in this! A lack of moving from classroom to classroom, cutting down on pe/games due to timetable changes needed for.covid measures, extra-curricular clubs being closed etc have all had an impact.

A national exercise programme (perhaps not quite a la China!) would be a very good thing right now.

@LolaSmiles

The question is why would it only be a low percentage? Why can't parents appreciate that if experts are telling them their child is overweight, it is worth investing in looking at the reasons Because too many adults would have to examine their own actions and attitudes to food if they accept their child is overweight. Some people do a lot of mental gymnastics to avoid taking any sort of action or accountability. If I had a pound for every "BMI is rubbish because it says pro rugby players are obese" type comment on here, I could afford a nice little holiday. We all know that your average person who is clearly heavily overweight to obese and leads a fairly sedentary lifestyle isn't a pro athlete with nutrition plans and training programmes.

Because too many adults would have to examine their own actions and attitudes to food if they accept their child is overweight.

Absolutely this ^^

In a way, it's like telling your kids smoking is bad for them while hanging a fag out of your mouth.

But parents need to swallow that bitter pill if they want a different outcome for their children.

I work in early years, so our children are still weighed every year.
Myself and my colleagues generally already know who will receive the letter about their child's weight and sadly the number of children overweight in foundation rises every year.
Unfortunately it's largely pointless, the most common reaction from parents is to either ignore the result or shockingly, claim it's inaccurate or a mistake etc
Very very few address the problem and I unfortunately see the same children, years later when they are in year 5/6 massively overweight and really struggling in pe etc

I honestly don't know what the solution is?
I've done this job for 30 years now and just in the past 10 years, there seems to have been such a huge increase in overweight young children.

It's important for child health planning. DS was last weighed in year 5 I think.

Predictably, most of the parents of overweight kids got upset and indignant. One of the other mums came for coffee and was in tears that she had been told her 9yo son was obese. She swore that she only fed him healthy meals, suitable portion sizes and he was 'big boned'.

Yet I had been to her house at Easter and the coffee table had a bowl full of Cadbury Creme Eggs. I watched her son eat three while I was there (about an hour).

I very gently suggested that maybe her son had temporarily put on a bit of weight over Easter, but she flared up at me. Some parents genuinely cannot see the problems right in front of them.

I went to a private primary school, no weighing i recall.
Do not remember my sons being weighed, I think education of parents needs addressing, here in the uk, it’s generally to cook from scratch than takeaways.
If parents are ignorant of healthy eating and over fed their kids, it’s tough, so much info these days

@Dixiechickonhols

DD went to a private primary school and the NHS wouldn’t go in for routine eye tests, weighing etc. So if that’s case for all areas they are excluding a percentage of children anyway from stats (given higher sport levels in private and link between poverty and obesity I suspect most of those missing would be healthy weight) So when they say x percentage of 11 years olds overweight I always wonder if they’re just talking state educated.

That's quite unusual.

NHS programmes which are hosted by schools take place in every school, state or not. Just as they do for immunisations

No idea how this is shameful. It’s pretty obvious to teachers, other parents and the school class themselves which kids are overweight. Kids don’t need a set of scales to tell them.

Sorry, should have added that the one group that don’t always see it is the kids parents themselves.

In order to have usable information, every single child needs to be weighed and measured. The heavier children opting out could skew the data downward. Stop opting out, parents of bigger kids.
Leaving out kids at private schools does not skew the data as it's under 7% of UK kids and they will be a range of weights.

The Programme organisers say:
"the privacy and dignity of the child must be safeguarded at all times, and the measurement is to be done sensitively in a private setting".

Information about the programme is here:
digital.nhs.uk/services/national-child-measurement-programme/

Not oy do I absolutely think that all children shod be weighed but I don't think parents should be able to opt out as it's the parents with issues around food (either over feeding or their own food / weight / mental health/ hang ups ) that will opt out.

I also think it should be mandatory to attend nutrition and education courses if your child is flagged as overweight so that you can come to realise that they are overweight and how to sensitively manage it.

I'm sorry but it's neglectful parenting to make your child overweight and it needs to be dealt with like any other form of neglect.

*excuse the typos I have a sticking keyboard that misses letters.

Leaving out kids at private schools does not skew the data as it's under 7% of UK kids and they will be a range of weights

It doesn't miss out the entire private sector. Just as other NHS programmes such as immunisations don't miss out the private sector, though I suppose schools can refuse to host the programme.

I expect being the one who isn't called to go and be measured could be a bigger classroom stigma.

worralLiberty

So get the statistics and then what?

The kids deemed underweight don’t matter as approach is just feed them crap to fatten them up.

Do they follow those kids deemed fat beyond 11? Having watched kids round here grow up from being chubby little short arse toddlers to all of sudden they tall slender teenagers.

It’s obvious which kids unhealthy over weight
as to those unhealthy underweight without need to weigh them.

Do they take height into consideration too? My son is 94th centile for weight and height, the health visitor said that means he is fine, just tall. I wonder when he gets to school age he will be heavier than average because of his height?

My son is very thin, there is absolutely no weight he could possibly lose!

@wallpapering the statistics are used to support policies such as the tax on sugary drinks; and on policies intended to make Active Travel easier; funding sport and active play, parks and so on; free school meals, free milk, free fruit and veg; National Minimum Wage. - knowing how healthy your population is is a fundamental piece of information. The information is available publicly and anyone can use it to develop policy. It is also used for international comparisons.

@Namechangedlady

Do they take height into consideration too? My son is 94th centile for weight and height, the health visitor said that means he is fine, just tall. I wonder when he gets to school age he will be heavier than average because of his height?

My son is very thin, there is absolutely no weight he could possibly lose!

Yes, they do.

And then it's turned into a BMI centile

It's not the same as for adult BMI. In children, the NHS states underweight – on the 2nd centile or below. healthy weight – between the 2nd and 91st centiles. overweight – 91st centile or above. very overweight – 98th centile or above.

And of course BMI is a screening, not a diagnostic tool

I'd be more supportive if there was any real plan to tackle childhood obesity. My lifelong eating disorder started at primary school when a teacher reported me to the school doctor for being overweight. Rather than receiving help/support to deal with it, I suffered "victim blaming". I was only 7 - I had no control over what my parents fed me. Yet, the school doctor made it all about my fault and my parents bought into that narrative and put all the blame on me. Apparently, it was my fault if I ate everything they put on my plate etc. Their answer was to put me on a strict diet - on my own. They'd have their fish & chips and give me a plate of salad. Obviously I rebelled and ended up stealing their money to buy crisps at the school tuck shop. Then the school reported me for that too. So I started eating in the toilets, getting friends to buy me stuff. Inevitably, my weight just got higher and higher and I became a closet eater, at school and at home. That led to bullemia. In later life, all GPs ever did was preach about healthy eating and refer me to dieticians who preached about healthy eating. None of them ever dealt with my binge eating etc which is a mental issue, not a healthy eating issue.

So, by all means identify potentially overweight children, but lets have some proper support for them and their parents to tackle it. GPs and dieticians aren't the right people to deal with eating disorders.

haba this was in a deprived town where obesity levels are high. Maybe other nhs trusts are more inclusive! My DD has a disability and I needed to return some equipment and the system was they collected from school but they wouldn’t go to her school (even though it was on main road and they’d be going past it regularly) I can’t remember what we did with it end. It definitely was nhs excluding not school.
She didn’t have immunisations at primary so no idea. They did miss them from reception eye test (I just took her to opticians)
She’s state now at Secondary so I don’t know.
7% is a lot to miss if not and could scew stats.

So the child's whose parents opt out in our child's class (there is only one opt out and I know this because the children notice!) is very clearly overweight.

Not so long ago we were having a general chat waiting for the school gate to open about fussy eating and what pests the children can be with food generally. I said my child had shocked me by the amount had eaten that morning as she'd had two scrambled eggs on toast followed by fruit with some (natural) yoghurt (that's unusual for her she'd normally have one or the other or a bowl of weetabix/porridge with fruit).

The father of said child piped up 'ugh we can't get X to eat any fruit or veg. But we don't worry, she had three breakfasts this morning, never mind the two yours had - Frosties, a pack of breakfast biscuits and then two waffles and honey! She often does, there's nothing wrong with her appetite so we don't worry!'.

The fact that A) It's not normal for a reception age child to regularly eat three breakfasts B) that's a sugar and carb heavy feast with very little nutrition in it and C) his child is tall but also very large was lost on him. He is not overweight but the mum is, very.

Tellingly they are the family who chose not to have their child weighed. Some people just don't want to know.

This is not in a deprived, poverty stricken area. These are not uneducated people, they're professionals.

If children of such people are eating regularly like this at five years old then really I'm not surprised we have an obesity epidemic quite frankly.

These are also the parents who complained loudly in the playground after school not long after we started that their child was not allowed Nutella sandwiches for lunch every day. School is nut and chocolate free. Apparently not allowing this child her chocolate spread sandwiches means she won't eat because she only eats these or jam and jam isn't allowed either.

No, before anyone shouts at me, this child does not have SEN as a reason for limited eating. She is just allowed to eat sugary crap at home and they don't like it that it's not allowed in school. Child now takes a large sausage roll in place of a sandwich every day.

Judging by the kids in our school it's entirely necessary but completely ignored anyway. It's a national scandal the levels of childhood obesity in this country. Sleep walking our children into a disaster.

I don’t feel it’s an issue personally. Both my kids were weighed in primary school and neither of them thought anything of it. They are both very slim.

I was an overweight child and remember the humiliation of being weighed at school. I have struggled on and off with my weight since then (BMI is currently 26) but I have always been careful not to project my weight issues on to my children and they have never been aware of me dieting.

Wow I didn’t expect such a response. I agree that some people won’t accept their children are overweight. Lots of people don’t realise that it’s perfectly normal if they have a young child whose ribs show, and doesn’t mean they are underweight. I’m glad the reporting is done sensibly and privately. Interestingly two of my friends who I have known since primary school who were overweight then, are still overweight now, possibly even in the obese category.

I think it’s great that exercise and activity provision could be increased in schools as a result but I also think the focus should be on healthy eating, as the saying goes you can’t outrun a bad diet. I weighed and measured my DS1 the other day and was surprised when it said underweight/1st centile, he never stops eating and is always hungry. I’m not going to fall into the trap of feeding him loads of junk though because I’m sure his metabolism will slow down as he gets older.

I don’t think the bmi tool is perfect by any means but it will apply for the majority of people and those who are very muscular are unlikely to be using it anyway. It makes me roll my eyes a bit when people who clearly have a lot of body fat say that they have a lot of muscle…. Muscle takes a long time to build with weight training etc and by the time you’ve got enough muscle to make you weigh more on the scales, you’ll have lost a lot of body fat already and the muscles will be visible