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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

To be so ashamed of my husband causing a scene?

588 replies

Vaterinadf · 18/06/2021 19:51

It was so horrendous. We have 2 DC, 4 and 5 months. Yesterday we couldn't be arsed cooking and our 4 year old has never been to a restaraunt so I suggested we go to the local Pizza Express for dinner. 'D'H whinged about money. He is always complaining about money. Yes things are tight but we are able to stretch to the occasional treat as we have around £150 spare each month, but DH always gets in a tiff about it. I'm not regulary hounding him for treats, but the occasional "Ah shall we just get a takeaway for tonight?" will subject me to a half an hour long rant about how hard he works and about how I waste all his money. I work part-time but am on maternity leave. He reluctantly agreed to go.

As soon as we get in and are sat down, the whinging starts. "It's way too expensive, I want to go somewhere else, come on" (I was BFing 5mo at this point and didn't fancy traipsing around town for somewhere else to eat). I firmly said no, and that the DC will need to be in bed as soon as we get home and I'm not spending time wandering around.

Then he's rude and demanding to the waitress who was literally only a teenager. She asks if we're ready to take our order and we say yes. There's a technical issue with the order taking system she's using and she says "One second, sorry." and DH does a loud, extremely obvious tut that he clearly intended for the waitress to hear. The technical issue was sorted in literally seconds and was an absolute non-issue, the tut was just obnoxious and unnessecary. We then noticed her and another waitress kept glancing over our table so we'd clearly been marked as 'problem' customers. I've worked in hospitality previously and I've found myself risk-assessing tables before, so I felt awful. I did not want to be 'that' table.

I take baby to the bathroom to be changed and come back and the food is being served. DH again continues to just be rude and blunt. The waitress doesn't do anything wrong so he doesn't make complaints but I heard him say "No." (without a thank you) when the waitress asked if he'd like anything else. I thought that was rude. He whinges the whole time while we are eating about the food, the service, the decor etc. I didn't get to have a word in edgeways. The idea of a casual chat over a meal seemed to be lost on him. It was tense and I hated it. Even our 4YO could barely say a word over the monologue.

The waitress ends up dropping a fork on the floor when collecting our empty plates and is extremely apologetic and clearly nervous. DH again tuts and says that he's found the service disgraceful and it's horrendous we weren't offered a high chair for baby (Baby is 5 months ffs, the high chair at home is still boxed up so he was just looking for anything to complain about! It was quite obvious that baby was too young for a highchair so of course we weren't asked.). We ask for the bill and I tell him I think he's been absolutely disgusting and I'm ashamed of him and tell him to go and get the car. He then leaves but starts whinging and being sarcastic, saying crap like "Sorry for breathing." He's gone by the time we get the bill, it's a different waitress to the one who served us. I go up to the one who served us, apologise profusely and give her a £10 tip.

We argue about it when we get home and then he started the pity party about how he is depressed. I'm not saying he makes up his depression, but he only talks about it when I'm upset with him for something. "It's my depression that makes me like this!" and yet he never seeks help. I would never, ever say he just uses depression as an excuse but surely it is now his responsibility to seek help? He's a completely unpleasant human being and I dread him coming home from work every day. He is not the man I married, who I loved. He was kind and loving. I mean it, so kind. Everybody told me I'd got a goodun with him. I miss that man so much. He changed after first DC but has been absolutely insufferable since our recent baby. I don't know what to do. I enjoy being at home during the day with my 2 little ones, and then once DH comes through the door suddenly there is an unbearable tension.

OP posts:
XDownwiththissortofthingX · 19/06/2021 07:19

Always baffles me that so many mumsnetters appear to believe that formerly decent, affable human beings suddenly decide to turn around and act like complete and utter arseholes, for no apparent reason whatsoever.

Nope, couldn't possibly be a legitimate case of depression, not when that's exactly how depression often manifests itself in men. Nah, it's all just faked, for god alone knows what benefit Confused

MaMaD1990 · 19/06/2021 07:24

@XDownwiththissortofthingX

Always baffles me that so many mumsnetters appear to believe that formerly decent, affable human beings suddenly decide to turn around and act like complete and utter arseholes, for no apparent reason whatsoever.

Nope, couldn't possibly be a legitimate case of depression, not when that's exactly how depression often manifests itself in men. Nah, it's all just faked, for god alone knows what benefit Confused

So OP should stay in a miserable life, especially when he refuses to get help? What is your actual advice to the OP?
XDownwiththissortofthingX · 19/06/2021 07:27

So OP should stay in a miserable life, especially when he refuses to get help? What is your actual advice to the OP?

Where did I suggest she stays and remains miserable?

I've already posted a lengthy opinion on the previous page.

My point is, that every thread that mentions a depressed man invariably fills up with posters claiming that depression couldn't possibly be the explanation... for things that are absolutely typical of depression. It's utterly bizarre.

RealhousewifeofStoke · 19/06/2021 07:30

He gets an ultimatum.
Either he sees the GP and starts counselling, or he packs and leaves.
Your life with him sounds utterly miserable and wretched.
And I’m not convinced that he is suffering from depression if he can switch it on and off depending on the age and gender of the person he’s being an arse towards.
Don’t let this be the behaviour that your kids think is normal and acceptable.

XDownwiththissortofthingX · 19/06/2021 07:34

And I’m not convinced that he is suffering from depression if he can switch it on and off depending on the age and gender of the person he’s being an arse towards

Again, this is something that is entirely commonplace in depressed individuals.

At my very worst I couldn't even say 'hello' to my partner or acknowledge they were in the room, but if the telephone rang or there was a knock at the door I had absolutely no problem answering it and having a perfectly cheery, lengthy conversation with whoever was on the other end of the phone or stood at my door.

It's not a logical illness, hence why the symptoms often show in completely inconsistent and perplexing ways.

MaMaD1990 · 19/06/2021 07:36

@XDownwiththissortofthingX

So OP should stay in a miserable life, especially when he refuses to get help? What is your actual advice to the OP?

Where did I suggest she stays and remains miserable?

I've already posted a lengthy opinion on the previous page.

My point is, that every thread that mentions a depressed man invariably fills up with posters claiming that depression couldn't possibly be the explanation... for things that are absolutely typical of depression. It's utterly bizarre.

Ah, apologies, I didn't see your previous message. I do take your point, but from what the OP has said in updates, it does seem like he switches it on at convenient times, or maybe these things 'trigger' his depression in some way. Either way, his behaviour is pretty awful and he does need to seek help, if not for the benefit of his family, but himself.
Theunamedcat · 19/06/2021 07:37

@XDownwiththissortofthingX

So OP should stay in a miserable life, especially when he refuses to get help? What is your actual advice to the OP?

Where did I suggest she stays and remains miserable?

I've already posted a lengthy opinion on the previous page.

My point is, that every thread that mentions a depressed man invariably fills up with posters claiming that depression couldn't possibly be the explanation... for things that are absolutely typical of depression. It's utterly bizarre.

If he only acts like this with her and the children and ONLY her and the children I would find that suspicious ive seen depressed men there work colleagues and family know there is something wrong they seem "quieter" "off" "not themselves" depression is not a reason to treat people badly
RealhousewifeofStoke · 19/06/2021 07:40

@XDownwiththissortofthingX

And I’m not convinced that he is suffering from depression if he can switch it on and off depending on the age and gender of the person he’s being an arse towards

Again, this is something that is entirely commonplace in depressed individuals.

At my very worst I couldn't even say 'hello' to my partner or acknowledge they were in the room, but if the telephone rang or there was a knock at the door I had absolutely no problem answering it and having a perfectly cheery, lengthy conversation with whoever was on the other end of the phone or stood at my door.

It's not a logical illness, hence why the symptoms often show in completely inconsistent and perplexing ways.

‘Yeah, it absolutely is women who he always happens to get arsey with.’

Wow. A completely gender based depression. This guy would make a great case study for a medical journal.
Or he could just be a controlling, misogynistic arse who is making his wife and childrens lives absolutely miserable.

PotassiumChloride · 19/06/2021 07:42

He sounds an absolute arsehole. Ultimatum time but I wouldn’t hold your breath about him changing based on what you’ve said.

XDownwiththissortofthingX · 19/06/2021 07:44

If he only acts like this with her and the children and ONLY her and the children I would find that suspicious ive seen depressed men there work colleagues and family know there is something wrong they seem "quieter" "off" "not themselves" depression is not a reason to treat people badly

No, it's not a 'reason' or an 'excuse', and I would never claim it was, but it's often an 'explanation' for why someone who was previously a decent human being is acting like a git. Why? because that's one of the myriad of things that depression can cause a person to do.

I've been horrible to my ExP myself at times. Was I behaving like that 'because I'm an arsehole'? No, I didn't have any history of behaving like that before I suffered depression, and I haven't behaved like that since I recovered, but did I while I was depressed? You betcha, because it's a symptom of depression.

People do not choose to become depressed, and they don't choose to act like arseholes. It's a symptom, or at least it can be one of the symptoms, of depression. No different to a runny nose being a symptom of a cold.

XDownwiththissortofthingX · 19/06/2021 07:51

Wow. A completely gender based depression. This guy would make a great case study for a medical journal.
Or he could just be a controlling, misogynistic arse who is making his wife and childrens lives absolutely miserable

Yes, or you know, it could just be that he internally feels like that all the time with everybody, but he still retains enough rationality to know that there are times where if he does behave like that he's liable to get a smack in the mouth.

What makes you think he consciously decided, on a whim, to suddenly become a 'controlling, misogynistic arse', when there's no obvious, logical, or realistic reason for him to do so? Seems that this began when OP's first child came along, which, oddly enough, is exactly the sort of significant environmental/life circumstance change than often precipitates the onset of a depressive episode. It's not always the entirely wonderful, positive development that people seem to think it is.

So which appears more logical and likely? That a formerly perfectly normal person just decided one day to become an arsehole, for no discernible or worthwhile reason, or that perhaps they experienced the onset of a clinical depression and lack the insight to fully understand what they are experiencing?

Cam2020 · 19/06/2021 07:52

He sounds unhappy and resentful at his life post children. Perhaps he's so reticent to go to the Dr's because once he starts getting a handle on his depression, he'll have to face up to that.

I think you felt need to have a crunch talk with him about where you go from here.

XDownwiththissortofthingX · 19/06/2021 07:57

He sounds unhappy and resentful at his life post children. Perhaps he's so reticent to go to the Dr's because once he starts getting a handle on his depression, he'll have to face up to that

That's also my impression.

RealhousewifeofStoke · 19/06/2021 07:57

‘Seems that this began when OP's first child came along, which, oddly enough, is exactly the sort of significant environmental/life circumstance change than often precipitates the onset of a depressive episode. It's not always the entirely wonderful, positive development that people seem to think it is.’

It’s also an established fact that the controlling behaviour of abusive men often escalates when the dynamic changes with the arrival of a baby. Stepping up financial control when a woman is on maternity leave is a key red flag.
You are massively projecting your own experiences onto the OP and it’s really not healthy or safe for her. She is being financially controlled and abused. Depression is not a get out clause for that.

Whydidimarryhim · 19/06/2021 08:01

What was his childhood like and how does he relate to his parents.
What does he do “to treat himself” “have fun” - has he ever had fun!!!
What is the £150 a month for then?
Can you suggest you have half each and spend it on what you want. If you decide to go out for dinner that’s your treat. If he want to save his that’s up to him.
We all need treats?
Does he smoke or drink - have a hobby he spends money on?
I’m asking as we make life style choices.
Lots of things we can do cheaply too and have fun.
Picnic with nice food, beach trips - take a packed lunch but fish and chips on the way home - soft play - I’d leave him at home.
He sounds controlling and he a currently a kill joy.
Good luck.

XDownwiththissortofthingX · 19/06/2021 08:03

Depression is not a get out clause for that

How often do I have to say that I am not contending that depression is an excuse, a 'get out', or any other sort of free pass for awful behaviour?

It can absolutely be, and frequently is the reason for it though.

MsTSwift · 19/06/2021 08:08

Sorry but as a younger woman in the few occasions I received abuse and harassment from men and the wife / girlfriend was just sitting there like a lemon I judged her. Hard.

Bumpsadaisie · 19/06/2021 08:18

@Vaterinadf

Yes he didn’t initially want to go but I didn’t insist as such. My child is 4 and has never eaten out. I haven’t in years. I was just sick of seeing other people out enjoying life.

Something that is upsetting me the most is that my 4 year old barely said a word the whole time, once DH’s monologue started he just shut down.

It sounds so sad and unnecessary and joyless.

I know how much we love going to pizza express as a family and I just can't see why someone would want to ruin a lovely treat like that and humiliate young staff.

There's clearly massive amounts of resentment, depression, rage going on. If he refuses to consider any of this and try to think about change/getting help, then not sure there is any future really.

It's always a hard time for a couple with very young babies but usually the joy and the partnership wins out over the troubles - this is beyond the norm.

RealhousewifeofStoke · 19/06/2021 08:19

@MsTSwift

Sorry but as a younger woman in the few occasions I received abuse and harassment from men and the wife / girlfriend was just sitting there like a lemon I judged her. Hard.
Absolutely not condoning the behaviour of any man who does this. But to judge a silent wife/girlfriend who may be walking on eggshells already, who may have previously tried to speak up and paid the price for doing so?

Worth thinking about before you judge.

Bumpsadaisie · 19/06/2021 08:22

@CaptainBarbossa

Something that is upsetting me the most is that my 4 year old barely said a word the whole time, once DH’s monologue started he just shut down

This jumped out at me, because this does sound like emotional abuse, tbh. Your 4 year old was shut down due to the atmosphere his Dad created, that "could cut it with a knife" atmosphere, and the bad energy he brings which makes you dread him coming home in the evening, that is emotional abuse.

It sounds like he is using some other abusive tactics too, like trying to control where the money goes and some emotional gaslighting like not letting you challenge his bad behaviour because of his depression. A lot of abusers use depression in this way, and many threaten they will commit suicide if you leave them. The number that actually do is minuscule. This doesn't sound like depression, it sounds like abuse.

If so he is getting worse the more dependent on him you become, the more trapped he thinks you are. So after one DC he got a bit worse, and after second DC he got much worse. He is just becoming more secure that he has you trapped and therefore that he can drop the facade of being a decent guy and be the abuser he really was deep down all along.

You can tell a lot about a person by the way they treat the waiting staff. You can also tell a lot about a person by what little kids think of them.

This struck me too. Normally in a restaurant you're trying to contain a four year olds excitement and energy, trying to get them to sit quietly and not disturb others, for year old are exuberant!

The thought of your child sat there very quietly makes me think how dominated everything is by your dh mood.

RainbowHash · 19/06/2021 08:25

Made uncomfortable reading this, as is all too familiar. That's in my past now as he's now my ex-husband. It took years to get here and a lot of courage but I now don't have to walk on egg shells, fear him coming home, and am free to be myself. I hope you can find a resolution that works for you but I would put money on it that it will only get worse, so it may be worth thinking about a plan. 💐

KaptainKaveman · 19/06/2021 08:25

OP has he actually been diagnosed with depression?

I'm sorry you are having to go through this, he sounds unbearable. It's no life for you or your dc. He is making your lives a misery and that's no good for anyone.

MsTSwift · 19/06/2021 08:31

No apologies. If you sit there whilst your dh abuses another woman you are implicitly condoning that. Remember cycling back from a charity event and a man in an open topped car just shouted all the vilest most misogynistic insults at me imaginable utterly unprovoked whilst girlfriend just sat there. What the hell?!?

RealhousewifeofStoke · 19/06/2021 08:38

@MsTSwift

No apologies. If you sit there whilst your dh abuses another woman you are implicitly condoning that. Remember cycling back from a charity event and a man in an open topped car just shouted all the vilest most misogynistic insults at me imaginable utterly unprovoked whilst girlfriend just sat there. What the hell?!?
And you clearly have ZERO knowledge or understanding of the dynamics of domestic abuse. The only person who is to be held accountable for gender based verbal abuse, assault, harassment or any other crime is the perpetrator.
BreatheAndFocus · 19/06/2021 08:39

Your DH sounds totally self-centred not depressed. It was upsetting to hear how your 4 year old shut down during the meal out. Really horrible 😞

Sorry but lots of people have very little left over at the end of the month. When I was with my ex-h we had less than you left over, but we still took the DC out on occasion. We also had takeaways every couple of months. I don’t think the issue is the money. It sounds like he’s regretting having a family almost.

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