To wonder why the government don't increase taxes to fund the NHS better?

[Smolgoose]

From a lot of threads on here recently about lack of being able to access healthcare, and my own anecdotal experiences, it seems like the NHS is in a worse crisis than ever, and not able to cope with the demands upon it.

This thread is definately not about individual NHS staff, but about the whole system generally.

Why don't the government increase taxation to increase NHS funding? It wouldn't solve some issues such as the shortage of staff, but funding could be also funneled into increasing the number of people trained.

A lot of people think we are heading down a privitisation route, but as far as I know the government have not yet floated the idea of changing free at the point of service.

It’s far from perfect but there are a lot of people with reason to be very grateful for it.

This is something I just don't get. On a personal, emotional level, of course people are going to be grateful if they receive the medical needed. But why on earth be grateful in the abstract for a system that lets so many people down? It's funded by our taxes. It's run by people who are paid to be there, and have chosen to be there. I have no idea whether the root cause of the issues in the NHS are lack of funding, mismanagement, or a mix of both, but clearly there is a problem. Rather than being grateful, shouldn't we be demanding more?

Medical help needed

I accept that in accurate situations the Nhs works but medicine is more than that. I pay tax for emergencies but the idea that id use it beyond that is not workable. There’s no choice and flexibility. It’s an awful system which many British adore but I certainly do not.

I worked in nhs management in the last labour government. Their actual plan was to throw loads of money at it, and prove it couldn’t improve even with increased funding. And they were right, as the excess money went to managers, new It, not to the wards and staff

I worked in the NHS then too. And I don’t recognise what you’re saying at all. The improvement was massive, not least because it was aligned to targets. Waiting times went down to virtually nothing and it wasn’t unusual on weekdays to find our A&E waiting room empty or very close to it. Before the usual anecdote accusations are wheeled out - although “My GP drives a Maserati takes some beating - here’s the data.

www.kingsfund.org.uk/projects/general-election-2010/waiting-times

[quote Blossomtoes]I worked in nhs management in the last labour government. Their actual plan was to throw loads of money at it, and prove it couldn’t improve even with increased funding. And they were right, as the excess money went to managers, new It, not to the wards and staff

I worked in the NHS then too. And I don’t recognise what you’re saying at all. The improvement was massive, not least because it was aligned to targets. Waiting times went down to virtually nothing and it wasn’t unusual on weekdays to find our A&E waiting room empty or very close to it. Before the usual anecdote accusations are wheeled out - although “My GP drives a Maserati takes some beating - here’s the data.

www.kingsfund.org.uk/projects/general-election-2010/waiting-times[/quote]
My partner was a budget manager in the NHS in the early to mid 90s, i agree that was exactly the plan... tell everyone you were throwing money at it, don't actually give anymore money, then get rid of it.... only inaccuracy is that it was under the tories.

Then along came Labour and an historic increase in funding, inc to IT and managers, without which the NHS cannot function & be efficient (same with any large organisation)

If you really were an NHS manager, you should be more than aware of this.

This is pertinent to many threads but someone here might know if it's worth dealing with

I've arrived home to a letter saying I'm 15 months overdue on smear test. This is wrong.

It also says I've been selected to get a test kit as part of a pilot.

There's no way listed to correct the info or opt out.

It is a waste of a kit to send it to me and I wonder how many others got this on the basis of wrong info? While others would probably like to be part of the pilot and might have been delayed in testing.

Is it worth trying to correct this or will some poor staff member be entering several portals of hell to sort it?

@84wood

I accept that in accurate situations the Nhs works but medicine is more than that. I pay tax for emergencies but the idea that id use it beyond that is not workable. There’s no choice and flexibility. It’s an awful system which many British adore but I certainly do not.

Yes. I was going to start a separate thread but wondered if it's worth deregistering from the GP surgery or will that be a huge problem if I need A&E?

People who aren’t registered with a GP are treated in A&E all the time. But why would you want to de-register?

@Blossomtoes

People who aren’t registered with a GP are treated in A&E all the time. But why would you want to de-register?

We did because we had a truly awful GP. We're now with another surgery and I made a formal complaint but I'd rather have had no GP than that vile cunt.

@Blossomtoes

People who aren’t registered with a GP are treated in A&E all the time. But why would you want to de-register?

I've had really bad "treatment" there. I could stay on the books but what next if you get chosen for pilots with no consultation, based on wrong info?

I was thinking to join Benenden.

I think @Ostara212 was planning to have no GP at all. Which is an unusual choice.

osbert I would say mine is well intentioned but got some major things badly wrong

That was also the result of not looking holistically at the patient....it just seems like Benenden or any of the private online GP services would actually do better because they will allocate more time and not fill in several databases, but just one!

My mum has just opted to go private for something. Communications thus far have been efficient, she said it's a whole new world!

I worked for the NHS for nearly 20 years, ironically, in finance. The NHS doesn't need more money, it needs restructuring. Chucking more money at it will not solve the problems.

We are registered with an NHS Gp thinking it will be helpful for A&E if you update for children which we do. Also good for covid vaccine that you can’t get privately. I feel I pay tax for this.

But we avoid for non emergency.

@HowCanHeFindIt

I worked for the NHS for nearly 20 years, ironically, in finance. The NHS doesn't need more money, it needs restructuring. Chucking more money at it will not solve the problems.

The NHS was restructured three times in the time I worked for it. The last time it cost £1.5 billion. Imagine what that amount of money could have done for patients instead of moving deckchairs on the Titanic.

@HowCanHeFindIt

I worked for the NHS for nearly 20 years, ironically, in finance. The NHS doesn't need more money, it needs restructuring. Chucking more money at it will not solve the problems.

Yes people who say this usually haven’t done a clinical role. Those of us who have worked the frontline understand how underfunding impacts patients.

Unfortunately there is no appetite for an increase to tax.

I also dont trust the government to channel it to where it is most needed either. They'll just give it to their mates via random contracts.

The only way that will work is something more similar to the continent and a pay per use model.

The NHS doesn’t work because money is ploughed into preventing litigation by making stupid policies that make it inefficient.

Healthcare should be partly privatised.

Tax will increase now whether there’s an appetite for it or not. There’s no fat left to cut on public services and the only way to recoup the recent spending spree is to raise taxes.

I completely agree with you all of you wanting for taxes to be increased.

I think the best way forward is for the citizens earning more than £50k a year to pay at least 40% of their income in tax and all earning more than £100k to pay at least 50% in tax. I think it's only fair. 👍

@imforourfreedomback

I completely agree with you all of you wanting for taxes to be increased.

I think the best way forward is for the citizens earning more than £50k a year to pay at least 40% of their income in tax and all earning more than £100k to pay at least 50% in tax. I think it's only fair. 👍

Erm.... this already happens

Actually, maybe that's your point

@diggingatrench

Actually, maybe that's your point

And nicely made IMHO.

Pithy but inaccurate. It's no tax at all on the first £12.5k, 20% on the chunk between £12.5k and £50k, 40% on the chunk between £50k and £100k, and 50% on anything over that.

High earners categorically do not pay 40/50% of their income in tax. A person earning £62.5k only pays tax on 4/5ths of their income. And pays 20% on 4/5ths of that. Less, if they put into a pension.

@SunshineSum

Pithy but inaccurate. It's no tax at all on the first £12.5k, 20% on the chunk between £12.5k and £50k, 40% on the chunk between £50k and £100k, and 50% on anything over that.

High earners categorically do not pay 40/50% of their income in tax. A person earning £62.5k only pays tax on 4/5ths of their income. And pays 20% on 4/5ths of that. Less, if they put into a pension.

Still a fuck load of tax!