To think that families who choose to home educate should receive government funding?

[PinkyU]

It costs the uk government(s) circa 75K to educate a child from 4/5-18.

AIBU to suggest that families who HE (home educate) should receive a percentage (50%-75%) of this to aid in their ability to provide learning opportunities for their child, given that it would still save the government money?

Do you think more families would HE if it seemed more financially viable?

I’m torn. I can see that part of the plethora of reasons school education exists in the format it does is to allow for (potentially) two adults to be working full time and paying tax, so the money saving aspect may fall down there.

From another perspective, accepting government involvement financially may come at the cost of government involvement concerning how and what the child should learn which is the antithesis of what HE seeks to do.

I do think that part funding HE would allow much more access to learning opportunities which would hugely benefit the child.

What do others think?

(Rambling over)

I have known families who would decide to "home educate" just to get free money from the state. Their children would get zero education.

Possibly. As long as parents who home educate would be willing to follow the government imposed National Curriculum and open the door when Ofsted come knocking!!

@PinkyU so should those without children get a tax rebate as well? Or should I get a rebate if I don't have a car so don't use the roads? Or what about a rebate because I haven't used the library for years?

You can't tax people on the basis of which services they use it would be chaos. The state pays for services and citizens decide to use them or not.

Should happen when I get to pay private school fees out of my pre tax income so I’m not paying twice to educate DC. i.e. never.

I'd be thrilled just to have access to some of the same resources, especially a student card that heavily discounts public transport and entry to so many exhibits and activities.

Home educated kids are very restricted in the GCSE's they can do - to only those GCSE's without coursework and often it means sitting IGCSE's. If you don't live in a big city it can also be really hard to find somewhere to sit the exam. Costs vary widely too from about £120 per subject to £300 IME just to sit the exam and receive your grade. Most state schools don't acceot orivate candidates.

The pandemic has been terrible for home ed GCSE and A level students as they don't have "teachers" who have approval to give them grades when sitting exams hasn't been an option. So, I think some opening up of access to more exam centres and maybe support for paying for exams would really help. This year the government have made a grant of £200 per entry available to centres willing to register private candidates (students still have to pay fees) despite this the nearest Independent school who previously accepted private candidates won't be doing so this year (45 minute drive away). Opening up access to exam centres would also help adult learners who find they need Maths, English and Science at particular grade levels to access Uni courses (that you didn't need in the past).

@Xenia

I've paid about £1m in before tax income from 1987 to 2022 for 5 children at private nursery school, private primary, secondary school and university and post grad. I would rather like to get a cheque for £1m next week as my refund particularly as I have paid hundreds of thousands in tax.

I have also only seen a doctor for 7 minutes in the last 15 years despite paying vast sums to the NHS (20% of our income tax goes to the NHS), the NHS never being there for this family when we need it.

I am not holding my breath for either sadly.... I would much prefer a much smaller state and much lower taxes.

To be fair Xenia, while you and your many children have been fortunate enough not to need NHS care in the last 15 years, I would point out that your taxes and mine have continued to fund the hospital buildings, nursing staff, medical staff, surgical staff , ambulances , porters, administrative staff etc etc so that had your ,or your children (or me) required emergency care at any time during those 15 years the care would have been available.

It is called National Insurance, because that is what it is, an insurance against possible future need.

If you, or one of your children broke their neck resulting in total paralysis, or had a brain tumour requiring proton beam therapy, or one of your future grandchildren required a million pound course of gene therapy treatment for a genetic illness (widely reported recently) , the money you have paid out would be repaid in kind.

I think when schools LA councils etc manage out children with SEN to home education their parents should get some money or vouchers to buy home ed supplies
Some kids can't cope with the number in schools or have sensory overload or are not "bad" enough to need special school ( can't get statement ) but not coping in mainstream or are being bullied there are numerous reasons why sometimes schools fail to deliver and parents HE to save their child's mental health etc but can' really afford it and are unsupported all the way HE then becomes a choice of desparation

Unfortunately I just don’t think it’s doable. Either they give the grant to anyone who wants to home school in which case you would get a lot of people choosing not to send their children to school for the financial benefit, despite not actually having plans to properly homeschool them or they have much more rigorous inspections of those planning to home school... which costs money and goes against the homeschool ethos.

@Xenia

500,000 childre are in fee paying schools and most also pay exam fees. Indeed I did wonder if I could register my 5 at a state secondary and see if the exam fees could be paid via that even if the child never attended - pie in the sky but it does feel unfair given we pay so much - massive taxes at up to 45%, then pay the school fees on that money already taxed so highly plus pay the exam fees. A tax off set would be nice including for parents whose children get the minimum university maintenance loan of about £4k who make it up to the full loan of £8k. That used to be off set against tax in the 1970s so why not now?

I’m about to pay almost £400 for my child’s GCSEs that she’s not actually taking

I'd be worried it'll cause those families who are afraid of sending their kids to school because they have something to hide to be encouraged not to do so on a higher level.

I doubt the majority of the population would use it for the wrong reasons but it could encourage people to have more children for more education funding. It was one of the reasons the benefits cap was bought in.

It's not as simple as that because things happen and people find themselves in situations they didn't foresee but encouraging people not to access state provided services is as a dangerous oath to go down as it is having a authoritarian nanny state.

@Thesearmsofmine

I home educate and no I don’t want funding. I don’t want the strings that would no doubt come along with it. Most seasoned home educators feel the same,

This!

My Uncle's side of the family is like Shameless except less charming. They have four children. For an extra £7k a year which OP is proposing, none of the children would have gone to school or been educated at all.

@TeacupDrama

I think when schools LA councils etc manage out children with SEN to home education their parents should get some money or vouchers to buy home ed supplies Some kids can't cope with the number in schools or have sensory overload or are not "bad" enough to need special school ( can't get statement ) but not coping in mainstream or are being bullied there are numerous reasons why sometimes schools fail to deliver and parents HE to save their child's mental health etc but can' really afford it and are unsupported all the way HE then becomes a choice of desparation

100% this. Or maybe schools could overhaul their entire system to make it truly inclusive for all children. I am so angry reading all these comments about parents "choosing" HE. 9 times out of 10 it's not a choice but an absolute necessity.

No way
The government provides education in a school
The only way funding for home education should be provided should be for medical reasons e. G disability etc and then it should be done via local authorities rather than direct funding to the parent

You couldn't just hand over money to anyone who claimed to HE because the amount of abuse of the system would be huge. It would have to come with regular inspections, evidence of lessons, national curriculum, tests, exams etc because it would be totally unworkable to assess on a case by case basis. There would also be a requirement for the parent to show they are capable of teaching. Etc etc.

If the government was to hand over the money you'd better believe they'd want a shitload of proof and adherence to lots of regulations.

It's my understanding that people who HE do so because they think the system is not fit for purpose. Would they really want to basically be an extension of that system?

My Uncle's side of the family is like Shameless except less charming. They have four children. For an extra £7k a year which OP is proposing, none of the children would have gone to school or been educated at all

That was the very first thought that came in to my head.

Also, what I just can't fathom re Home schooling, is what happens if your children are cleverer than you? I got a few crap O'Level's and I'm not very academic. My son has a Masters in Engineering and my Daughter has a Bachelors in Education. There is literally no way that I could have home schooled them without massively holding them back. I mean, I got a "U" in O'Level Maths (unmarked paper it was so bad), whereas my son got an "A" in Higher Maths.

I home-edded my son, who would have done himself serious self-harm if he'd had to stay in a school which refused to do anything about the bullies. I had to spend a fortune one way and another through no fault of his/ our own. I think it's a slippery slope to say we should get any handouts, but I do think it would be a good idea to make public exams free of charge for all home-edded kids.

If you want public money you will be epected to demonstrate value for money. Bringing in funding for HE means a testing and inspection regime is an inevitable consequence to ensure appropriate use of the funding. Which will, in itself, cost money to fund.

No

And no, I don't want to be an extension of a service that doesn't work. It was the last thing I wanted. But there were no other viable options.

You do get inspected when you home-ed. We had a visitor to whom we showed the work he was doing and talked through the GCSEs for which we were preparing him. They were satisfied he was getting an education, asked about socialisation and keeping fit physically etc. And they send through some helpful info and links.

@Spikeyball agree with many of your pints, however this is exactly where EOTAS comes into play. Parents fill the gaps, receive financial support to do so but they remain in "the system" , still able to access specialist services and benefit from a fully rounded education. For those here thinking this is a way out for "lazy/money grabbing" parents I'd invite you all to check in with some of the SEND chat threads detailing the sheer hell this process is to achieve. You're basically seeking to create and secure a huge business tender, whilst caring for a high needs child 24/7. Easy it is not!

And give local authorities even more reason to stick their beaks in? When many already unlawfully do so - snooping and billing??

A group has just successfully received permission to JR Portsmouth LA for their unlawful overstepping and bullying.

It’s bad about as it is without adding weight with a ‘well you do get funding’ argument.

[quote PinkyU]@Proudboomer I think my point is more that people who HE are paying for school education and then also experiencing the additional costs of HE their child, in effect (but not necessarily) paying twice to educate their child.

People who don’t have children aren’t incurring the (potential) double cost.[/quote]
So are people who choose to send their children to private schools. Should they also get the money? Where does this end?

No because for many children school is better environment for education than home. Many would also claim to be home educating, take the money and do no education.