To be shocked the librarian was so poorly read?

[bendmeoverbackwards]

In the library recently reserving some books for dd. Librarian had not heard of A Handmaid’s Tale and did not know that As you Like It was written by Shakespeare.

These are not exactly obscure books!

AIBU?

If they are employed as a general museum steward to help guide visitors round an exhibition and check tickets then why would they be expected to know about all topics the museum has exhibitions on?

I would expect them to have an idea of the general categories of galleries in a museum, as would be shown in the visitor guide leaflet that most museums have, and to know about current exhibitions - that is the sort of info visitors expect front desk staff to have.

I also want expect anyone over about age 6 to know what a T Rex is. If they want expert dinosaur detail, they probably need a palaeontologist, or a 6 year old...

Libraries are run by teams. It may be that the person who served you is really good at running group activities like rhymetime. Or they may spend most of their time in local studies and barely handle literature.

I hope everyone who is shocked at the state of libraries today didn’t vote tory though.

@tenlittlecygnets

As You Like It is not a book. It's a play.

It's also the title of an album by The Barenaked Ladies.

I used to be an on-gallery volunteer at the Natural History Museum, and all the on-gallery staff had to undertake intensive training and learn huge amounts of information about various disciplines within the field of natural sciences. Not just basic familiarity like oh it's a fossil, but where the fossil was found, how fossils are formed, what kind of creature is it a fossil of. Really in-depth stuff.

People checking tickets aren't generally inside or anywhere near the exhibitions themselves. Except in tiny museums.

It's like asking my bin men where the rubbish goes and the technicalities of recycling. They aren't paid for that. They excell at their job they do but like a librarian if they are well read and well educated they would be applying for a higher paying job where their intelligence matters. Libraries are on the brink of surviving as it is

I worked as a library assistant for years. It was very much seen as a customer service role and interest in literature/reading was not a prerequisite for the job at all. Later on, my manager confessed that one of the reasons I was offered the post was because I didn’t use the “I love reading” line in the interview.

As it happens, I have an English degree and do love reading but this was completely irrelevant as the skills required for the job and the role itself were totally unrelated. Patience, good at handling complaints/problem solving, organisational abilities, being numerate (as Dewey system used to shelve books), able to process invoices, fines etc- these skills were far more important according to my manager than having a love of reading.

@mermaidsariel

The point is if someone works in a museum with dinosaur exhibits for example and a member of the public asks about an exhibit , the reply ‘I don’t know much about dinosaurs and I’ve never heard of a Tyrannosaurus Rex’ might be greeted with incredulity . You do expect the person working in a specialist area to know about what they’re dealing with. That’s not snobbery.

That’s exactly it @mermaidsariel I don’t really care or am interested in what the average person on the street knows or doesn’t know. It’s the fact that she works in a library that seems surprising to me. But I’ve been put right about the workings of libraries these days so maybe I am BU.

@Aroundtheworldin80moves

There are thousands of books published every year. No one can read everything. Even extremely keen readers only read a few a week... Shakespeare for example wrote a lot of plays. I could probably name 10or so. I doubt I'm that unusual. Handmaid's tale... I'm pretty sure more people have watched the TV adaption than read it. And it wouldn't appeal to everyone.

I think you are unusual. You may not have read all the plays but if you were a qualified librarian I would expect you to know of them.

You may not have read all the plays but if you were a qualified librarian I would expect you to know of them.

A librarian qualification isn't an English Literature qualification. Why don't people get this?

I think people's expectations are often wholly unreasonable.

I used to get asked 'What book shall I get for my 7 year old'. And people thought there was a magic right answer.

I would ask the parent and/or child if the child is present.

• Does your 7 year old enjoy reading?
• What sort of books is s/he reading at school
• Is there anything else that s/he has read recently? At home?
• What sorts of stories does s/he like?

I would take the parent and child to the age-appropriate bit of the library. I'd pick out a few books by popular authors, depending on the answer to the above questions. I'd suggest that parent and child spent some time browsing the shelves, pointing out that they could get out up to 10 books, so they might take a selection home and that way they might find a few they really liked.

Almost inevitably the parent would look disappointed that I hadn't magically/psychically given the 'right' answer to the question, 'What book shall I get for my 7 year old?'

I think we are in two camps here. Those who think libraries contain books and that the staff employed should have, as well as the required skills for performing the practicalities of the job, an interest and a good knowledge of literature. Not an in-depth knowledge of every book ever written, but definitely a broad expertise.

In the other camp are those who think a “library” is purely an information/social hub and that people who work there are functionaries who no more need an interest in reading than they do in knitting for the Knit and Natter group.

Maybe the second group are quite right and librarians are something out of the dark ages. BUT I don’t know why so many posters of this persuasion are so dismissive of general knowledge and wide learning. It seems so depressing to cast people as snobs or sneer at anything remotely seen as a bit “ooh, hark at her”. Perhaps councils should axe library books altogether if reading is such a poncey niche pursuit.

@IrmaFayLear

I think we are in two camps here. Those who think libraries contain books and that the staff employed should have, as well as the required skills for performing the practicalities of the job, an interest and a good knowledge of literature. Not an in-depth knowledge of every book ever written, but definitely a broad expertise.

In the other camp are those who think a “library” is purely an information/social hub and that people who work there are functionaries who no more need an interest in reading than they do in knitting for the Knit and Natter group.

Maybe the second group are quite right and librarians are something out of the dark ages. BUT I don’t know why so many posters of this persuasion are so dismissive of general knowledge and wide learning. It seems so depressing to cast people as snobs or sneer at anything remotely seen as a bit “ooh, hark at her”. Perhaps councils should axe library books altogether if reading is such a poncey niche pursuit.

Your attitude is so weird. People are defending a librarian for not knowing a particular Shakespeare play and you keep spouting as though those people want some form of Fahrenheit 451 outcome. No one is arguing that books or libraries should be done away with, simply that the OP is being unfair towards a person for not knowing THT or AYLI. And as I said earlier, but you ignored me, I am saying this as a writer who used to manage bookshops.

ohforarainyday
That sounds similar to the museum education teams at some of my local museums. Those who were working with exhibitions and there to inform and educate know more about their specific areas.
As you say levels of exerpetise and knowledge will vary for different roles.

A librarian qualification isn't an English Literature qualification. Why don't people get this?
Because it allows them to pretend to be super shocked and confused that anyone might not know the books they have heard of. They're like the snide teenagers in the classroom who mock others for not knowing the answer, or laugh at their peers having not heard of a particular band that's in the charts. The idea that their peer might have excellent knowledge in other areas and have different tastes in music is irrelevant to them.
It's no wonder children have these attitudes when there's adults who do the same thing.

@IrmaFayLear
Completely agree. It's a sad situation that there is no one to guide and advise any longer, to encourage kids and adults to read different books, to make suggestions. Once upon a time, librarians were crucial to many who couldn't afford books. I was someone who used to be taken to the library every Saturday by my father, and I developed a life long love of reading as a result. Sadly it seems, this is no longer the way things are.
School library budgets are being cut all the time, and they are being run as Information Centres by staff who don't know much about literature either. So where are kids to learn a love of reading?

Yeah most of the staff in my local library are retired people who volunteer to keep busy.

so where are kids to learn to a love of reading

At school, at home, in the same places they always have. I have never been recommended a book by a librarian yet I have always read ferociously. Harry Potter fever wasn’t spread thanks to a librarian making a suggestion. Yes it’s very sad that libraries are no longer supported in the way they once were, but people will always read and children will too. And they do, in their droves.

Maybe the second group are quite right and librarians are something out of the dark ages. BUT I don’t know why so many posters of this persuasion are so dismissive of general knowledge and wide learning. It seems so depressing to cast people as snobs or sneer at anything remotely seen as a bit “ooh, hark at her”.
Perhaps councils should axe library books altogether if reading is such a poncey niche pursuit.
Nobody has said reading is a poncey hobby, nor has anyone dismissed the value of learning and knowledge.

The challenge has been towards an attitude of "I can't believe someone didn't know... if they don't know X's name then they can't be read much... what a depressing situation when someone doesn't know X author or Y book... so what they might have extensive knowledge of other areas, they can't be intellectually curious or be interested in their subject if they don't know the things I think they should..."
It's an unpleasant and quite arrogant attitude from people who think that THEIR list of knowledge is somehow the bets set of knowledge to have.

Challenge this attitude and you're met with ridiculous claims that people hate general knowledge, people hate people learning things and people hate academia.

I don’t know much about dinosaurs and I’ve never heard of a Tyrannosaurus Rex’ might be greeted with incredulity

I don't think T. rex is in the same category as As You Like It or The Handmaid's Tale.

I expect everyone will have heard of the dinosaur, but I wouldn't expect the exhibit worker (or most MNetters) to know how to write the name properly, as a biologist would.
The same goes for librarians or bookshop workers.

As You Like It and The Handmaid's Tale are very very well known to anyone with any interest at all in reading.

Why is it an issue if a well-educated linguistics graduate, who knows the curriculum and reads widely around the areas they are teaching doesn't know about Russian dramatists?
Why is it awful if an intelligent Media and Journalism graduate, who has a wealth of knowledge about sociology and the politics doesn't know about Hemmingway?
My DP is a graduate in electronic and software engineering and has no particular interest in English/Media and Journalism as subjects. His personal reading preferences are sci-fi/speculative fiction. He has still heard of Chekhov and Hemingway.

@bendmeoverbackwards

Surely part of the job is recommending books to library users? I would expect that in either a library or a bookshop.

In all the decades I've used the library service I have never expected or asked for recommendations. Sometimes they put books in special places to promote them, but that's as far as it's gone.

No one is mocking someone. If a, I don’t know, butcher hadn’t heard of THT then so what. But a librarian? I guess the problem is the job title. Those of us who are older probably think of a librarian differently from people familiar with the sector as it currently operates. To be fair I think that our local “Discovery Centre” employs “information directors” or somesuch.

CaptainOatFlosser - what on earth has your being a writer got anything to do with it?

Lweji
I agree, but it's making those sorts of comparisons that only highlights the attitude of "stuff I know is obviously basic general knowledge and it's shocking anyone wouldn't know it". Why else would people seem to compare knowledge of a Shakespeare play that isn't taught in most schools to a dinosaur that most children encounter by primary school?

@IrmaFayLear of course it’s related, because you keep arguing that anyone who is defending the librarian doesn’t appreciate books, reading or even classics. Your argument would suggest that those of us who think you’re being snobby have no interest in books, however that is not the case at all, as demonstrated.

IrmaFayLear
People are mocking the knowledge of others throughout the thread. It's there in all the "oh how depressing someone didn't know... I can't believe they didn't know... a librarian should know... surely a teacher, regardless of specialism, should know these authors I want them to know... ... if someone doesn't know X Y Z they can't be intellectually curious..."
It's snide and it's unpleasant.