Surrogacy and Covid Vaccine

[OhHolyJesus]

Whatever your thoughts are on the COVID vaccine, or vaccines in general, is it ever ok to make medical decisions for the woman who is carrying your baby? If a woman is if sound mind and we are to believe she has body autonomy as a surrogate mother, should the person or people who have their genetic child inside her be the ones calling the shots and for this to be made legal via a 'contract' that is unenforceable in the U.K.?

"The anxiety around the potential harm the vaccine can do to a baby in the womb has led to surrogacy contracts being amended to ensure that intended parents can make medical decisions for the surrogate, and in some cases has led to the breakdown of surrogacy teams who cannot agree on whether to vaccinate or not."

https://www.bionews.org.uk/page_156655

I think surrogacy should be entirely banned.

As for the rest of these ideas that anyone has a right to another's person's body after using her organs and body to serve their own ends, that is straight out of Gilead and utterly chilling.

is it ever ok to make medical decisions for the woman who is carrying your baby?

No.

This kind of thing is precisely why I don’t like surrogacy and would like it banned. No of course a couple cannot make medical decisions for another mentally competent adult. She’s a person, not “rent a womb”.

These 'contracts' are unenforceable in the UK. So aren't actually contracts but just a written agreement between parents and surrogate.

No, to answer the original question, surrogacy should not remove a woman's bodily autonomy.

Once the embryo is placed inside her womb, it becomes her child anyway. However painful that might be for the hopeful parents, it ensures the surrogate retains her autonomy. It is and should always be this way in law.

Yes another reason why surrogacy should be banned in the Uk, as it is in so many other countries.

Bloody hell, of course they shouldn't be making medical decisions for the surrogate mother.

I also think this sort of baby purchasing g should be banned.

It's never OK to hand over body autonomy but that is a key part of contracts in the USA.

“The intended mother was going so far as to ask me if the surrogate actually got the vaccine, could she then turn around and request a termination of the pregnancy,” Ferrara said. “It just really exemplified, for me, that severe level of anxiety that some people have.”

McCutcheon, who lives in Marietta, Ohio, jokingly calls herself a “rent-a-womb.” As a surrogate, she says her connection to the baby currently growing inside her is nothing like the motherly love she felt when she carried her own 3-year-old twins. This is a job, and as part of that job, she signed a contract to let the baby’s parents make medical choices for her, including whether to get the COVID-19 vaccine.
They preferred that McCutcheon stay unvaccinated.
“This is their baby, so if that’s how they want to protect their baby, then as a parent they should be able to make that decision,” she said.

www.vice.com/en/article/qjpqe3/parents-are-demanding-surrogates-who-wont-get-the-covid-vaccine

'is it ever ok to make medical decisions for the woman who is carrying your baby?'

No it isn't. Jesus, what a question.

I'd like to think that in the UK, with an NHS that has a strong culture of safeguarding the surrogate mother could be assured of autonomy with all decision making but I'm not convinced. Quite a lot of midwives are in thrall to the joys of surrogacy.

IMO all antenatal appointments and scans should be conducted with the surrogate mother alone initially so that she is at the front of any information and decision making, and commissioning parents invited in at the end of the appointment if that is what the SM wants. But I have seen loads of CPs complaining about this sort of thing and demanding they be treated as the parents.

In the recent BBC programme the surrogates one CP basically made the decision the SM should be induced and took her off to see the obstetrician and the discussion about doing a cervical sweep was entirely between the Dr and the Commissioning mother.

Not sure if it was in a private setting, it looked as if it might be and I feel sure SMs won't have the same level of protection within the private system which will focus on the people paying the bill.

Everything about surrogacy sends a cold chill down my spine.

Absolutely do not agree with commercial surrogacy in any circumstances. No one has the right to a baby. It is wrong in every way .

is it ever ok to make medical decisions for the woman who is carrying your baby?

You think people who use surrogates give a toss about bodily autonomy, ethics, or morals? If they did, they wouldn't be using a surrogate.

Surrogacy is utterly fucked up.

@FannyCann that is just like something from The Handmaids Tale ... in fact I think there is a scene where Serena tells the doctor she wants Offred to be induced.

I thought surrogacy contracts were legally unenforceable in the UK. Also, the pregnant person is legally the mother, whatever the genetic material of the foetus. The genetic parents have no legal rights over the foetus, much less the pregnant woman.)

Jesus of course not. But the whole culture of surrogacy, particularly in the US, is fucked up.

Also research is now showing that coronavirus presents a substantial risk to pregnant women and their babies should they catch it.

"The results are stark: women with Covid during pregnancy were found to be over 50 per cent more likely to experience complications such as premature birth, pre-eclampsia, admission to intensive care and death compared with pregnant women unaffected by the disease."

www.telegraph.co.uk/women/life/year-startling-truth-covid-pregnant-women-finally-revealed/amp/

Sorry Telegraph doesn't do share tokens.

In the link the terms “teams” and “we” are sooo sanitizing. It isn’t a team, and her body is not communal property.

That's a really good point Crazy, the language around surrogacy is a problem for me, you rarely see the word 'mother' follow 'surrogate' in any article or news story these days.

I also have begun to detest the word 'journey' when used as 'our surrogacy journey'. It's all about the hardship for the commissioning parent/s and not about the 'pregnancy journey'.

[quote Twizbe]@FannyCann that is just like something from The Handmaids Tale ... in fact I think there is a scene where Serena tells the doctor she wants Offred to be induced. [/quote]
(I always forget I can quote sorry!)

In a scene in the BBC's "The Surrogates Mothers" shows the commissioning mother, Kate, request a sweep for Caitlin, her friend, employee and surrogate mother, to her unborn child (her and her husband genetic child).

Caitlin is very quiet on the matter, the conversation is entirely between the Dr and Kate. That is how the BBC edited it anyway.

@FannyCann

I'd like to think that in the UK, with an NHS that has a strong culture of safeguarding the surrogate mother could be assured of autonomy with all decision making but I'm not convinced. Quite a lot of midwives are in thrall to the joys of surrogacy.

IMO all antenatal appointments and scans should be conducted with the surrogate mother alone initially so that she is at the front of any information and decision making, and commissioning parents invited in at the end of the appointment if that is what the SM wants. But I have seen loads of CPs complaining about this sort of thing and demanding they be treated as the parents.

In the recent BBC programme the surrogates one CP basically made the decision the SM should be induced and took her off to see the obstetrician and the discussion about doing a cervical sweep was entirely between the Dr and the Commissioning mother.

Not sure if it was in a private setting, it looked as if it might be and I feel sure SMs won't have the same level of protection within the private system which will focus on the people paying the bill.

Talk about Gilead! Under his eye

is it ever ok to make medical decisions for the woman who is carrying your baby?

Err, maybe in Gilead....

Surrogacy is totally unethical anyway and should be illegal everywhere. It’s child trafficking and exploitation of women at its very worst.

Urgh.

Of course the woman should he able to make her own decisions. After all she's the one who had to live with the consequences once the intended parents bugger off out her life with the child.

One would also hope that POA /NOK would be a trusted friend or family member as opposed to the intended parents.

Another example of why surrogacy should be banned.

Agree with all of the above. Surrogacy should be banned.