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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

Possible suspension?!?

44 replies

GoodHairDay86 · 11/05/2021 13:28

Its my 1st post here not sure if I'll get flamed but I've thick skin so here goes..

DD 12 year 7 generally a good girl no problems so far at school. She was on the playground at break time when another child randomly pulled her hair. She reacted by pushing him to the ground, a crowd formed and were mocking him "haha you got floored by a girl" type of stuff he was embarrassed and left and she continued her break.
Next lesson the deputy head pulls her out of lesson and they are both put into isolation separately. No idea what was said to him but she was told off for reacting how she did, said her violence is what created the crowd and that she may be suspended.

This is all her side of the story. I emailed yesterday and the deputy will be contacting me later today.

Im super annoyed if this is how it went down because I think she shouldn't be punished for defending herself. She's never had a fight before and honestly I'm so shocked she reacted that way because it isn't her way if you see what I mean.

So I won't start the convo with deputy all heated but I feel she is being blamed for something that wouldn't have happened if he kept his hands to himself. If she had floored him and then started kicking or punching hell yea thats too far but the kid wasn't hurt only his pride so I think leave it there lesson learned.

We've told our daughter that we are behind her 100% and that if thats what happened we are OK with what she did even proud, but that we will be hearing what the school has to say aswell.

So AIBU fir being pissed off before I've even spoken to the school?

OP posts:
Sargass0 · 11/05/2021 13:36

I'm with you. She defended herself. I'd be 100% by my daughter in these circumstances too! I would hate for her not to feel able to defend herself in later life should she need to in case she's punished for it!

Mydarlingmyhamburger · 11/05/2021 13:46

Your daughter is definitely not in the wrong here, however schools generally discourage pupils standing up for themselves. To keep out of trouble she needs to say she felt like she had to defend herself. Defending herself isn’t necessarily pushing over a boy who pulled her hair once, but then stopped. The school will say she should have gone and told a teacher. I’d get her to say something along the lines of ‘he pulled my hair and it really hurt, and laughed at me. I got upset but then he had this look on his face/made a movement towards me and I thought he was going to do it again, so I pushed him away.

Bearnecessity · 11/05/2021 13:58

As long as the boy did definitely touch and hurt her by pulling her hair....then you are justified..

AnneLovesGilbert · 11/05/2021 14:00

She defended herself. Maybe other girls and boys being picked on will feel able to do so having seen it. Maybe he and other bullies will think twice in future.

Stand up for her. She did the right thing.

vivainsomnia · 11/05/2021 14:16

You don’t know what happened, only what she told you which could be very different to hid version.

Maybe he pulled her hair by accident, running pass, hair stuck in a zip kind of thing. Maybe she did push him hard and maybe he did get hurt.

Why don’t you wait for the call and hear the school position before already concluding that your daughter is a victim in this.

Exhausted4ever · 11/05/2021 14:17

She did the right thing. Yanbu

Daphnise · 11/05/2021 14:31

Wait till you find out the real story.

Children, even good ones, are terrible liars when they are in trouble- not so much deliberate lies, but cover-ups and misleading statements to keep them out of further trouble, and just not anticipating that any searching enquiry will probably bring out the truth.

The boy's mother will believe him in the same way you do your child.

KarmaStar · 11/05/2021 14:36

When you have two people telling their version of events separately it's wise to believe half of each of the stories as the truth is usually in the middle.

skirk64 · 11/05/2021 14:43

The school have to react in this way because they can't be seen to allow violence, even if the claim is self-defence. Children can't be taught that violence is sometimes OK because it may lead to problems for them as adults.

As an adult you can only defend yourself in a way that is proportionate to the threat. If someone pulls your hair you are free to try to fight them off while their attack is continuing. If someone pulls your hair and then walks off you cannot respond by pushing them to the floor after the attack has finished.

Hilarias · 11/05/2021 15:51

@KarmaStar

When you have two people telling their version of events separately it's wise to believe half of each of the stories as the truth is usually in the middle.
Hope you’re not a judge Hmm
CloudofRain · 11/05/2021 17:02

A similar thing happened to my DD when she was in yr 8. A child started throwing her stuff on the floor in an art class. When they went out to the lockers he started punching her. She pulled his hair to get him off. The school only found out anything happened at all because she was so distressed.

Then they called me and said that there was an incident and that she might face significant sanctions or similar. She was too shaken to give a coherent statement and didn’t specify it was self defence instead describing it as a fight.

In the end we contacted the school and they allowed her to redo her statement. All the witnesses also backed up her version of events so it was not punished.

We went to see the head of year as we were really concerned about how what happened was able to happen, why the teacher completely missed her stuff being chucked on the floor etc. We asked them what they thought she should do next time if a child came up to her and started punching her and nobody intervened to help? The school was quite sheepish in the end and were unable to answer really.

There should be systems in place to prevent pupil on pupil violence. If your daughter was hurt by another child from behind they need to have systems in place to stop it happening again.

I hope it works out okay. We found the whole thing incredibly stressful as our daughter was so distressed.

LolaButt · 11/05/2021 17:15

We had a similar incident this week.

I stated that I do not condone violence but do not condemn my child for reacting to another child’s physical act.

In an ideal world the responding child walks away. But that doesn’t always happen.

TwoAndAnOnion · 11/05/2021 17:22

@vivainsomnia

You don’t know what happened, only what she told you which could be very different to hid version.

Maybe he pulled her hair by accident, running pass, hair stuck in a zip kind of thing. Maybe she did push him hard and maybe he did get hurt.

Why don’t you wait for the call and hear the school position before already concluding that your daughter is a victim in this.

Other statements will have also been taken.

Schools are pretty clued up on what's what, who is the protagonist and previous behaviour goes a long way.

She was defending herself. If the other statements back that up, Id be reminding the dep head that a women's right to be safe is very paramount in peoples minds at the moment, and you would expect your daughter to be protected from assault.

Thisgirlcando · 11/05/2021 17:50

You don’t know what happened, only what she told you which could be very different to hid version.

Maybe he pulled her hair by accident, running pass, hair stuck in a zip kind of thing. Maybe she did push him hard and maybe he did get hurt.

Why don’t you wait for the call and hear the school position before already concluding that your daughter is a victim in this.

Or maybe we should teach girls we believe them.

greymayday · 11/05/2021 17:53

*You don’t know what happened, only what she told you which could be very different to hid version.

Maybe he pulled her hair by accident, running pass, hair stuck in a zip kind of thing. Maybe she did push him hard and maybe he did get hurt.

Why don’t you wait for the call and hear the school position before already concluding that your daughter is a victim in this.*

Horrible post. I would always believe my daughter if she came to me and told me she’d been a victim of any manner of violence, abuse, unkindness etc. We should NOT be making our daughters think we doubt them when they’ve been hurt by men.

greymayday · 11/05/2021 17:54

@Thisgirlcando

You don’t know what happened, only what she told you which could be very different to hid version.

Maybe he pulled her hair by accident, running pass, hair stuck in a zip kind of thing. Maybe she did push him hard and maybe he did get hurt.

Why don’t you wait for the call and hear the school position before already concluding that your daughter is a victim in this.

Or maybe we should teach girls we believe them.

Agreed!
Oilpyii · 11/05/2021 18:11

I had this with my son in year 8, ‘fighting is unacceptable and all parties will be punished’. He was jumped by three boys waiting for him in a changing room. His input was trying to hit and push them off him. He was pretty bruised, they were unmarked. He was little with no history of fighting.
I also found out there were witnesses they’d been harassing him on the bus (for being small) and he’d eventually given them the middle finger on a bus- hence them waiting for him to give him a kicking. They’d been laughing at him in class too, it was fundamentally due to his accent and size.
I was so cross. I kept him off beyond the one day exclusion and formally complained to the governors- stating he’d return when he felt safe (lots of rumours they were still out to get him).

Oilpyii · 11/05/2021 18:16

Remember for your daughter it’s not as simple as defending proportionally to stop him. It’s an unequal position, being hurt or approached as a surprise by someone suddenly in your personal space, fear can make you react a little stronger than you would if rational and calm. If someone is in her space, maybe even bigger and stronger, it’s quite reasonable to push them away assertively to stop it.
Even if she’s facing punishment frankly it’s better than being accepted as an easy victim for being touched when she doesn’t want to be. Good for her.
What’s hair pulling and scaring people if not ‘violence’.

CombatBarbie · 11/05/2021 18:27

If anyone pulled my hair my knee jerk reaction would be to push as well, for me hair pulling is one of those sensations that instantly angers me and having conversations with friends it appears to be common.

If your daughters version of events is true, and I don't doubt it is, the boy hopefully learns the good old lesson "don't give out what you can't take".

Bearnecessity · 11/05/2021 20:32

My son got properly punched by a lad in Year 9 because he couldn't take the ball off my son during football. He got a day's suspension wher he had a lovely time in the deputy head's office and was made a prefect a few years later...

DaydreamsAndWishes · 11/05/2021 21:25

@skirk64

The school have to react in this way because they can't be seen to allow violence, even if the claim is self-defence. Children can't be taught that violence is sometimes OK because it may lead to problems for them as adults.

As an adult you can only defend yourself in a way that is proportionate to the threat. If someone pulls your hair you are free to try to fight them off while their attack is continuing. If someone pulls your hair and then walks off you cannot respond by pushing them to the floor after the attack has finished.

Pretty much this.

I hope that you have heard now from the school and are able to move on.

Hiddenmnetter · 11/05/2021 22:24

As an adult you can only defend yourself in a way that is proportionate to the threat. If someone pulls your hair you are free to try to fight them off while their attack is continuing. If someone pulls your hair and then walks off you cannot respond by pushing them to the floor after the attack has finished.

What rot. If someone pulls your hair, a push back is entirely proportionate. Otherwise if someone just pulls your hair calmly and walks off it's ok? If my daughter told me this had happened I would be livid. I'd wait to hear what they had to say but I would be outraged that my daughter was being punished for being attacked.

Mydarlingmyhamburger · 12/05/2021 14:11

@Hiddenmnetter

As an adult you can only defend yourself in a way that is proportionate to the threat. If someone pulls your hair you are free to try to fight them off while their attack is continuing. If someone pulls your hair and then walks off you cannot respond by pushing them to the floor after the attack has finished.

What rot. If someone pulls your hair, a push back is entirely proportionate. Otherwise if someone just pulls your hair calmly and walks off it's ok? If my daughter told me this had happened I would be livid. I'd wait to hear what they had to say but I would be outraged that my daughter was being punished for being attacked.

Just because you think it should be right, it doesn’t mean it is. I agree very much with you that a boy getting knocked on his arse is a good outcome to them pulling a girls hair. But the school follows the criminal justice act in these situations. A boy pulling a girls pony tail is not an ‘attack’, and the girl shoving him over after he’s performed this once act and then stopped is not ‘defence’, it’s retribution. The school will see it as her acting in an unnecessary and aggressive manner, which is why in my first reply to the op I said to advise her daughter to say that she only pushed him as he went to do it again.
Mydarlingmyhamburger · 12/05/2021 14:14

@Hiddenmnetter

As an adult you can only defend yourself in a way that is proportionate to the threat. If someone pulls your hair you are free to try to fight them off while their attack is continuing. If someone pulls your hair and then walks off you cannot respond by pushing them to the floor after the attack has finished.

What rot. If someone pulls your hair, a push back is entirely proportionate. Otherwise if someone just pulls your hair calmly and walks off it's ok? If my daughter told me this had happened I would be livid. I'd wait to hear what they had to say but I would be outraged that my daughter was being punished for being attacked.

Just because you think it should be right, it doesn’t mean it is. I agree very much with you that a boy getting knocked on his arse is a good outcome to them pulling a girls hair. But the school follows the criminal justice act in these situations. A boy pulling a girls pony tail is not an ‘attack’, and the girl shoving him over after he’s performed this once act and then stopped is not ‘defence’, it’s retribution. The school will see it as her acting in an unnecessary and aggressive manner, which is why in my first reply to the op I said to advise her daughter to say that she only pushed him as he went to do it again.
Original poster
GoodHairDay86 · 12/05/2021 20:24

She doesn't have a ponytail. She has a curly afro . Don't think that is relevant as to most people hair is jusy hair but wanted to state facts. Also to add my husband is a Rasta and im a natural hair stylist so we raised them to be proud of their beautiful hair and Rasta believe hair is a crown. So pulling her hair may have triggered something that poking her or pinching her may not have 🤔

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