Photo ID needed to vote? Please no.

[flashbac]

The government are bringing in (photo) voter ID meaning you'll need to show your passport or driving licence when going to cast your vote.

By all means reform the postal voting system but not this. Not everyone drives or goes abroad and this will bar many people from voting. Driving licences and passports are not cheap.

amp.theguardian.com/politics/2021/may/10/queens-speech-photo-id-future-elections-social-care?

@SchrodingersImmigrant I would imagine it would still be accepted for things like buying age restricted products even if out of date, but I don’t know about as ID for travelling. I’ve definitely bought alcohol with an expired driving license

@lurker101 possibly. But still I would expect the standard 10 years.

@SchrodingersImmigrant if only you’d applied before 7 Jan then it would never expire - excellent value for those people 😆

support.citizencard.com/Knowledgebase/Article/View/when-does-my-card-expire

I know😂 I didn't even look into it since itbwas called "citizen's card"😂
I deserve this outcome then. My ID collection shall remain at 3 for now😂

it's not the point. You shouldn't be denied your RIGHT to vote, because you didn't receive your ID card, or left it at home by accident, and you wanted to vote on the way home and by going back home you'll run out of time.

Lots of disorganised people (especially the young and transient) don't appear on the electoral register at all. Should they still be granted their 'right' to vote? With rights come responsibilities. At some point people need to accept that and be prepared to take responsibility for themselves instead of always expecting exceptions to be made for them.

@SunflowersAndLavender

I'm still waiting for someone to explain the basis on which free voter ID cards for disadvantaged or marginalised people results in voter suppression.

Exactly this. Free ID card and everyone can vote. Legitimately. Cuts down voter fraud. I don’t understand the problem.

@SunflowersAndLavender

it's not the point. You shouldn't be denied your RIGHT to vote, because you didn't receive your ID card, or left it at home by accident, and you wanted to vote on the way home and by going back home you'll run out of time.

Lots of disorganised people (especially the young and transient) don't appear on the electoral register at all. Should they still be granted their 'right' to vote? With rights come responsibilities. At some point people need to accept that and be prepared to take responsibility for themselves instead of always expecting exceptions to be made for them.

No Because as I said you could be the most organised person in the world,but get mugged...and now you CANNOT VOTE.

I agree that ID should be required to vote. However, all citizens should have ID issued free of charge. I hate the fact that we have to pay for passport, driving license etc - why not have ONE identification system that holds all info?

@SunflowersAndLavender

it's not the point. You shouldn't be denied your RIGHT to vote, because you didn't receive your ID card, or left it at home by accident, and you wanted to vote on the way home and by going back home you'll run out of time.

Lots of disorganised people (especially the young and transient) don't appear on the electoral register at all. Should they still be granted their 'right' to vote? With rights come responsibilities. At some point people need to accept that and be prepared to take responsibility for themselves instead of always expecting exceptions to be made for them.

Plus it's their choice to vote or not.

Taking the choice away is not a good thing...

There have been six cases of voter fraud - it is hardly a major problem. Even if the gov do provide free photo ID to all, isn't that just spaffing a load of money to solve a problem that doesn't exist? I'd rather they spent that money on increasing pay for carers and nurses ... or maybe on schools ... or maybe on their levelling up programmes.

@SancerreSunsets

There have been six cases of voter fraud - it is hardly a major problem. Even if the gov do provide free photo ID to all, isn't that just spaffing a load of money to solve a problem that doesn't exist? I'd rather they spent that money on increasing pay for carers and nurses ... or maybe on schools ... or maybe on their levelling up programmes.

Quite!

@SancerreSunsets

There have been six cases of voter fraud - it is hardly a major problem. Even if the gov do provide free photo ID to all, isn't that just spaffing a load of money to solve a problem that doesn't exist? I'd rather they spent that money on increasing pay for carers and nurses ... or maybe on schools ... or maybe on their levelling up programmes.

100%

Do we know which Tory donor chum is likely to get the contract to provide free of charge cards? Follow the money...

This might back fire on the tories, going by recent elections, its the poorer voter they are attracting, perhaps the very people who don't have a passport?
Nor would take the time to keep up to date with any voter card (in its self easily forged) unless they go down the hyper expensive biometric data route i.e. an ID card.

I think this idea will whither and die, like much of BJ's ideas

This might back fire on the tories, going by recent elections, its the poorer voter they are attracting, perhaps the very people who don't have a passport?

Yes, exactly. Which is why some cooked up conspiracy theory that it's all a plan to sabotage people's right to vote is utter nonsense. The elderly are also among the least likely to have photo ID, but usually more likely to vote Tory.

And I'm tiring of saying this, but they won't need a passport. Or a driving licence.

Free ID card and everyone can vote.
Legitimately.
Cuts down voter fraud.
I don’t understand the problem.

How can it cut down on voter fraud when there isn't any to start with?
The issue, as we all well know, is that adding any barrier to voting - even one that can be overcome for free - will stop people voting. And the people most likely to be affected are those that i) do not already have photo ID, and ii) are less politically engaged.
If the expect result was not to supress votes against them, the Tories would not be doing this.
And ID cards are a completely separate issue. The government is not suggesting bring them in, and Johnson repeatedly voted against them when Labour passed legislation to introduce them. Which was repealed by the Conservative led coalition in 2011.

Which is why some cooked up conspiracy theory that it's all a plan to sabotage people's right to vote is utter nonsense. The elderly are also among the least likely to have photo ID, but usually more likely to vote Tory.

So explain why the Tories want to do this, then? It is not to reduce voter fraud. That does not exist.

How can it cut down on voter fraud when there isn't any to start with?

As has been explained several times on this thread, you can't possibly know whether there is or there isn't. All we do know is that the current system leaks like a sieve and the potential for fraud is huge. Just because very few incidences have been proven so far doesn't mean it doesn't exist.

Your logic is like not bothering to lock your door because you don't know of anyone in your street who has been burgled.

And ID cards are a completely separate issue. The government is not suggesting bring them in, and Johnson repeatedly voted against them when Labour passed legislation to introduce them. Which was repealed by the Conservative led coalition in 2011.
Indeed.
Tony Blair 1995 -
"instead of wasting hundreds of millions of pounds on compulsory ID cards as the Tory Right demand, let that money provide thousands more police officers on the beat in our local communities"

Because there's very little biter fraud...

Because hardly anyone actually bothers voting.

There's no fool proof system. Even having ID cards won't work. Because they'll be easily faked, because there can't be any electronic checking systems in place due to the logistics of it all. Abd again electronic systems potentially remove the right to an anonymous vote.

So it's all just a bit if a waste of time really.

Your logic is like not bothering to lock your door because you don't know of anyone in your street who has been burgled.

Nonsense. We know burglaries happen all the time because they are reported. There is absolutely no evidence that voter fraud occurs in any significant numbers. This is very clearly voter suppression and you know it. You don't care because it doesn't affect you.

@SunflowersAndLavender

How can it cut down on voter fraud when there isn't any to start with?

As has been explained several times on this thread, you can't possibly know whether there is or there isn't. All we do know is that the current system leaks like a sieve and the potential for fraud is huge. Just because very few incidences have been proven so far doesn't mean it doesn't exist.

Your logic is like not bothering to lock your door because you don't know of anyone in your street who has been burgled.

And your logic is akin to demanding id from everyone in the street each time they arrive home, since the "system" of just using your keys to enter your home potentially leaks like a sieve.

What fraud is this supposed to cut down on?
Personation?
If Personation was widespread, we'd know, because large numbers of people would turn up at the polling station only to be told they had already voted.
It's also pretty difficult to organise in a way that would allow political gain, even in a theoretically vulnerable system such as ours.

I think it would be helpful for many things - look how many times you need a letter with your address on, that people no longer have, for example.

However, it must be free to all; not another Tory money making scheme.