Photo ID needed to vote? Please no.

[flashbac]

The government are bringing in (photo) voter ID meaning you'll need to show your passport or driving licence when going to cast your vote.

By all means reform the postal voting system but not this. Not everyone drives or goes abroad and this will bar many people from voting. Driving licences and passports are not cheap.

amp.theguardian.com/politics/2021/may/10/queens-speech-photo-id-future-elections-social-care?

But anyway. How would you feel about this? Voter ID is requested and if you cannot provide it you have your finger dipped in semi permanent ink, or a hand stamp?

Do none of the ID card sceptics want to answer this?

@grantoderek

Same in Qatar. ID cards are only an advantage which save time and means we have a vast amount of freedom during Covid and a decent infrastructure. Unlike the UK where you have to fill in paper forms and post them

Qatar? Vast amounts of freedom? 😳

@SunflowersAndLavender

Without your ID you cannot vote. This prevents you from your right to vote if for some reason you don't have that ID card on you at the time.

Okay. Fair enough. I have a sneaky feeling that the same people objecting to showing voter ID with a photo are also the same people opposed to national ID cards, which we would soon get used to carrying with us in the same way that we carry our keys and our bank card.

But anyway. How would you feel about this? Voter ID is requested and if you cannot provide it you have your finger dipped in semi permanent ink, or a hand stamp?

How many people against voter ID cards would support that? And if not why not?

I think that’s certainly preferable – can’t see any issue with it.

However they won’t opt for this. If there really were any significant voter fraud, then the beneficiaries, apparently, have been the Tories.

@SunflowersAndLavender

Without your ID you cannot vote. This prevents you from your right to vote if for some reason you don't have that ID card on you at the time.

Okay. Fair enough. I have a sneaky feeling that the same people objecting to showing voter ID with a photo are also the same people opposed to national ID cards, which we would soon get used to carrying with us in the same way that we carry our keys and our bank card.

But anyway. How would you feel about this? Voter ID is requested and if you cannot provide it you have your finger dipped in semi permanent ink, or a hand stamp?

How many people against voter ID cards would support that? And if not why not?

Inky fingers could be a solution.

However if I was determined to fraudulently vite, it wouldn't take much to get round it. I could vote at 7am, go home, scrub my hand clean and go back to the same polling station,claim I was Sam from next door and take their vote.

ID cards won't prevent voter fraud. Let's pretend it's an actual issue.

Who is training the poll clerks to correctly identify genuine forms of ID? These poll clerks that maybe clerk less than a handful of times a year.

Then you have to start introducing electronic measures...how is that realistically going to work when the polling station is a small side room on a remote village hall?

I'm not against ID cards as a viable alternative to passports for ID. But I am opposed to the need to have ID to vote in the UK, as there's no need for it, will prevent people from voting and will cost an absolute fortune.

@kalokagathos

In Poland this has been the case for 50 years but like in most European countries we have National ID cards. All 18 years olds look forward to getting one proving they are now mature adults to be reckoned with:) No biggie IMO.

We got our at 15 😁 Ha😁

@00100001

I'm not against ID cards as a viable alternative to passports for ID. But I am opposed to the need to have ID to vote in the UK, as there's no need for it, will prevent people from voting and will cost an absolute fortune.

They could have been an alternative. I traveled on mine. Within EU...

@SchrodingersImmigrant

These and many others are the reasons I don't want the government (via some badly awarded and executed massive IT contract) to manage my identity thanks - I happier managing it myself.

They are though. Unless you live off the grid totally and was born that way, they are. The only difference in the end is taht you have a card with basic info in your hand.

'A card with basic info in your hand'.

Define 'basic info'.

2019 turn out of 67.3 so around 32 million votes

Out of that around 550 were investigated for possible fraud and only 6 prosecutions.

So they couldn't have made their decision based on this - and voter fraud is the only argument for ID.

The question we should be asking is why is voter turn out so low? And how can we improve this ?

If the government are going to provide "free" ID the money they will spend on this could be used to fund a campaign to encourage voter participation?

If the id isn't taxpayer funded then it's nothing but a cynical move to suppress
Voting from the demographic more likely to vote left wing.

Also we can't justify more than a 1% increase to the salaries of the nhs but we can find the money for additional bureaucracy this change will create?

Shame we can't protest about this anymore as that's been pretty much banned now too.

Still millions of people vote for these clowns though ....

@SinisterBumFacedCat

What other options for photo ID are acceptable? Are they readily available, cheap, well advertised?

For the record, I was never against mandatory ID cards, for this exact reason, but funnily enough, the stories, particularly Brexit loving David Davies campaigned heavily against them.

Tony Blair 1995 "instead of wasting hundreds of millions of pounds on compulsory ID cards as the Tory Right demand, let that money provide thousands more police officers on the beat in our local communities"

A card with basic info in your hand'.
Define 'basic info'.

Name, DOB, address. We also have nationality on it, which is bit since it's obvious and place of birth. Doesn't have to be same. Some other places have less or different info. Basics

Literally everything government already knows about us.

That was not proper English 🤦
Meant that it's all info gov already has

It's straight out of the Republicans' playbook in the US and it is a disgusting policy.

@DynamoKev

To be clear - I think Windrush was despicable and inexcusable. To me its the embodiment of the entire reason I don't want the government to issue me with an ID card. Because, time and time again in this country, government agencies fuck things up and then try to lie their way out of it.

^^ wot Kev said.

How sweet that we imagine any competence in our government agencies, when it comes to issues of national importance.

Normally I do believe in the adage 'Never ascribe to malice that which can be explained by incompetence'; and I am not smearing the individual people who go into work each day in their government agencies as being incompetent; it's just our systems are set up in ways that guarantee failure, because our politicians switch briefs faster than a tart's drawers. They have no handle on their briefs (like Boris 😂😂😂) before they move on, damage done....

But a government with this majority and apparent popularity promoting ID cards to 'prevent voter fraud'?

I think not. Agendas or wallpaper purchasers are at work here.

@SunflowersAndLavender

Without your ID you cannot vote. This prevents you from your right to vote if for some reason you don't have that ID card on you at the time.

Okay. Fair enough. I have a sneaky feeling that the same people objecting to showing voter ID with a photo are also the same people opposed to national ID cards, which we would soon get used to carrying with us in the same way that we carry our keys and our bank card.

But anyway. How would you feel about this? Voter ID is requested and if you cannot provide it you have your finger dipped in semi permanent ink, or a hand stamp?

How many people against voter ID cards would support that? And if not why not?

Its the same thing - a ridiculous over reaction to something that is a tiny problem. As with all these ideas, the vast majority (well over 90%) who are behaving properly shouldn't have to put up with stuff that will only apply to a the tiny minority. We could stop all road traffic accidents by making everyone walk everywhere at all times and banning all powered, horse drawn vehicles, bikes scooters etc. It would be highly effective, but stupidly impractical. Far better to seek out and prosecute people who drive irresponsibly.

We were a trial area for this a couple of years ago.

People without photo id could apply for a special card or something like that to allow them to vote.

I have id so it wasn't that big an issue for me. I know though that it did put some people off voting and some were actually turned away from polling stations because they didn't have id. I think possibly that was actually illegal because id is not currently a legal requirement even in a trial area.

Part of me thinks it's a good idea and actually it's actually quite strange that people can vote without proving who they actually are. The other part of me thinks it will generally disadvantage poorer and older voters who are less likely to have the necessary documents or organise a voter card.

@SchrodingersImmigrant

I know😂 I didn't even look into it since itbwas called "citizen's card"😂 I deserve this outcome then. My ID collection shall remain at 3 for now😂

An Australian government of 30-35 years ago tried to persuade its populace how great national ID cards were.

However, knowing Australians' natural antipathy to authority, they called it the Australia Card.

read this

Australians weren't that stupid.

But given the flag-shagging now upon us, maybe we are....

@LindaEllen

I agree that ID should be required to vote. However, all citizens should have ID issued free of charge. I hate the fact that we have to pay for passport, driving license etc - why not have ONE identification system that holds all info?

All info? 🤔

@megletthesecond

Do we know which Tory donor chum is likely to get the contract to provide free of charge cards? Follow the money...

Chooses a nice wallpaper, though....

@MissAmandaLa1kes

The National ID card was proposed and almost pushed in by the Labour government. It was the running dog in the manger fascist capitalists who stopped this.

Tony Blair, 1995 instead of wasting hundreds of millions of pounds on compulsory ID cards as the Tory Right demand, let that money provide thousands more police officers on the beat in our local communities

@Tealightsandd

It's a good idea. Voter fraud, whilst for the moment confined to some parts of the country, is a real and growing problem.

Would be very useful in many other areas of life too. I couldn't even go to a concert without photo ID a few years back.

Of course photo ID cards should be very cheap or free - but so long as that's the case, I'm all for it.

Can you justify your claims about voter fraud please? What form does it take? ID cards cannot possibly be "free" - guess who'll end up paying?

However if I was determined to fraudulently vite, it wouldn't take much to get round it. I could vote at 7am, go home, scrub my hand clean and go back to the same polling station,claim I was Sam from next door and take their vote.

The ink doesn't come off for a couple of weeks I think. That's the whole point of it. They use it in places where they don't have official electoral registers to make sure each person only votes once.

@kalokagathos

In Poland this has been the case for 50 years but like in most European countries we have National ID cards. All 18 years olds look forward to getting one proving they are now mature adults to be reckoned with:) No biggie IMO.

Poland isn't exactly covering itself in glory as a paragon of democratic freedoms right now, is it?

But is that also 'no biggie'....?