To ask for advice re: child maintenance from ex

[spectreroblox]

Hi all

I left my ex on bad terms two and a half years ago and we have two children together. He has been paying me £200 pm for both kids most of this time, which I had to fight for, it was £100 pm at first. He NEVER has the kids, ever. He's not had them once since I left and he's not bothered about them unless it's to criticise me about something. He was a complete waste of space when I was with him too which is partly why I left.

When we arranged the £200 pm thing he said he was also giving his parents £200 pm, as they have them three days/nights a week for me to go to work. I was a little shocked that they were asking for this money considering it's their (only) grandkids but that's that, I didn't question it any further as they are good to me to have them when I work. If they didn't, I'd have to leave my job since it involves shifts, nights and weekends and I trained for years to get where I am now.

There's been some debacle recently over the school dinners money. My kids have school dinners maybe once or twice a week if there's something they fancy so money is put on as and when. My ex asked me why I was not putting money on the machine a few months ago for the days that his dad takes them to school and that he's having to give his dad the money back for it. Of course I questioned why he was giving his dad extra money when they're already having the £200, the same amount as me, and I'm not getting any extra. His response was 'you know what my dad is like'. I asked him for an extra £50 a month at the time so then his dad wouldn't have to worry about the machine and, as is usual for him, he ignored me.

So fast forward to yesterday, my son comes home and tells me that his grandad had said about me putting money on the machine 'as she's the one who gets the money, not us' so clearly he's lying to me about giving them money. He's always been very selfish and money mad, he works 70+ hours a week and earns I would say just under 50k at a guess. When I've asked him for more money in the past, he tells me 'it doesn't cost £200 to feed two kids' (yeah because that's the only cost related to children!) and that he's having to work all these hours just to keep ends meet bla bla bla yet he was able to part ex his car and put the other 10k outright towards his new car a few months ago so that he doesn't owe anything on it and he's forever bragging about buying new gadgets that cost a few thousand pound each, and I know they're not on credit.

So he's doing damn well alright and while I earn a decent wage, I'm paying out a lot in bills and the usual stuff and we do struggle sometimes but he's not interested in making sure his children are well looked after. The kids are with me all the time unless I'm in work and I do my best but sometimes I just don't have the money for things they want and it really upsets me. I have around £80 pm from universal credits which doesn't go very far.

My current partner has told me to go down the CSA route but I am afraid this would muddy the waters between me and his parents and while myself and my ex don't have a great relationship, we get on decently enough.

Does anyone have any advice for me please?

Anyone?

Yes, CMS!

Cms. He isn't reasonable. He never will be. Use the money to pay for childcare that isn't so rude about you

Or CSA Or whatever it’s called.
Why would that “muddy the waters” with the grandparents?

Csa.

"amicable" arrangements never work and he could stop paying anytime.

The less interaction you have with your ex about money, the better, it's just unnecessary stress.

Hang on, so you have the kids four nights and his parents have them three?

Tbh I'd wonder if the csa would class his parents having them as them not being in your care and therefore award you less money than you currently get (unless your ex is a high earner maybe)?

I mean I don't know, don't take my word for it but it would concern me.

Just call the child maintenance service. Seriously. Just call them.
They arent always great but as long as he is not self employed then it should be a straightforward case.

Regarding your worry about his parents. Just tell them, "sorry about the dinner money confusion. Ex told me he would only pay £200 towards the kids because he was also paying you £200 a month for looking after them and also reimbursing you the cost of the school dinners. I've just found out that this doesnt appear to he true so have involved CMS to resolve it in a single, unbiased way."

Are they sleeping at their grandparents 3 nights week?

For maintenance it doesn’t matter who else they’re with for overnights as long as they are with you for the majority of them.

Go to CMS and ask them to get you a calculation and put him on direct pay, if he doesn’t pay them it’ll go to collect and pay. It won’t muddy the waters, the less you have to talk about money with him the better. Let someone else handle it for you.

He is paying child support and childcare so I wouldn’t expect him to pay lunches on top. If you go down the CSA route you’ll likely lose your free childcare I would imagine as he won’t pay that on top if you take that route.

If he’s paying £400 and you match that amount plus CB and UC it should easily cover the costs of food, clothes etc for them. Your other bills you would have anyway.

I’d be very grateful that childcare, especially overnight, was only £200 and certainly wouldn’t expect the grandparents to cover lunches on top of the huge commitment they are already doing. That’s a huge amount of time and just because they are their grandchildren doenst mean they need to do it whatsoever.

@Lachimolala

Overnight do matter because they reduce the payment.

The ex can say he has them 3 nights a week, and they often visit the grandparents. He can still say that that is his time with the kids, so his family see them during his time.

When my kids stay with my parents, it doesnt reduce my maintenance because it's my days with the kids and my choice who they stay with. If my ex has them but takes them to his parents, it doesn't mean he has to pay me more. It's still his time and the kids are still away from me.

If the ex has nothing to do with the arrangement with his parents and the OP deals with all the handovers then she could argue that it isnt his time with them, but it suspect they may reduce her payments.

@Lachimolala

For maintenance it doesn’t matter who else they’re with for overnights as long as they are with you for the majority of them.

Go to CMS and ask them to get you a calculation and put him on direct pay, if he doesn’t pay them it’ll go to collect and pay. It won’t muddy the waters, the less you have to talk about money with him the better. Let someone else handle it for you.

That's not necessarily true. It's based on shared care as well and because they're his parents I think it would be possible he could say they're doing his care for him. Whilst that isn't true I don't see how you could prove it, so they might base it on him having the kids 3 nights a week which would bring the payment right down wouldn't it?

And I disagree that it won't muddy the waters, if they're loyal to him and he kicks off are they going to carry on having the kids?

If they are sleeping at the grandparents then that counts as him having them. You may actually lose money if you go through CMS

Speak to the grandparents directly.

I think the first think you need to do, is be honest with the grandparents that your child has mentioned the money going to you, and you want to understand how much each of you is getting. They might be getting nothing.

I think you need to adjust your attitude before you speak to them though! They gave these kids 3 nights a week?! Why wouldn’t they get money for that? Even if you don’t think they should get a profit, it is costing them money.

Once you’ve cleared up where the money is going, then think about CMS. But as others have said - I’d get professional advice about overnights. If I were him, I’d absolutely argue that the kids were with me 3 nights, but my parents helped out.

What a shit he is 🤬

@IceCreamAndCandyfloss

He is paying child support and childcare so I wouldn’t expect him to pay lunches on top. If you go down the CSA route you’ll likely lose your free childcare I would imagine as he won’t pay that on top if you take that route.

If he’s paying £400 and you match that amount plus CB and UC it should easily cover the costs of food, clothes etc for them. Your other bills you would have anyway.

I’d be very grateful that childcare, especially overnight, was only £200 and certainly wouldn’t expect the grandparents to cover lunches on top of the huge commitment they are already doing. That’s a huge amount of time and just because they are their grandchildren doenst mean they need to do it whatsoever.

I think you've misread my OP. He DOESN'T give his parents any money, he lied to me and said he gives them £200 alongside my £200, using that lie to get out of giving me what he knows he should be.

Wow another deadbeat that leaves all the funding his children to the mum. Good luck

The thing is op he'll argue that you don't have the kids almost half the week. And you don't (don't get my wrong completely understand why) so I don't know that cms will award you anything like 400 a month.

You could ring them and ask before opening a case?

Presumably he meant you get the child support not them, there payment would be for childcare and food when with them not school lunches.

@IceCreamAndCandyfloss

If he wants to pay for childcare during his time with the kids then that's his choice, but it comes out of his own pocket, it doesnt come out of the maintenance amount. The OP needs to check the online calculator and see what the amount would be with him having the kids 3 nights a week.

So a quick cms calculation suggests that if he has an income after pension of £40,000, the OP would be entitled to £530 a month. This assumes he has them 'never. If I change it to he has them 3 nights a week it comes out at £303 a month.

Assuming he has a salaried income I think I'd be talking to the grandparents and let them know what he's telling you. I'd then agree with them whether you claim the full cms and pay them a fix amount, or hither you claim the lower amount and they claim the rest from him! Cheeky Sod!

I had a look online even if he claimed he had them three nights it would be 360+ a month. Get on cms

The same calculation on a salary less pension of £35000 would.meant he owes £265 a month for 4 days or £465 with no overnights....

Yeah definately get onto the cms. Write his parents a letter if you need to!

@Wishitsnows

Wow another deadbeat that leaves all the funding his children to the mum. Good luck

He does give her money, she gets universal credit and presumably child benefit so while he might not be doing his share it isn't true to say he leaves all the funding to the mum.

Shocking he doesn't give his parents any money, but I am surprised you haven't had that conversation to confirm that given they have them 3 days a week. He is playing you all. Go the CSA but I think his parents should be given some contribution.

Does his parents have the DC on what should be "his" nights (aka providing childcare for him)
Or on what would otherwise be "your" nights? (Aka providing childcare for you?)
If its your nights then you need to speak to the GPs directly about paying them, or not if they are happy with that. Ex would then owe you maintenance based on him having no overnights (assuming he doesn't have them any other nights)

If his parents have them on what would otherwise be his nights then CMS would reduce the amount due accordingly. But what he pays (or doesn't pay) them is irrelevant