To start trying to implement rules with 2yr old and eating?

[Pethaireverywhere]

My DD has just turned 2, she has never been easy when it comes to eating and meals, she has a very small appetite so won't eat big main meals which is fine and prefers to snack. She is also still breastfeeding and fills herself up on milk alot which doesn't help when it comes to mealtimes regarding appetite etc.
She used to love fruit and fairly healthy snacks e.g rice cakes, yogurt, raisins. I'd say in the last 3 months she refuses most of these and has become much more aware of food like sweets, crisps, chocolate etc which she was offered as treats sometimes but now wants them all the time.
It's got to the point where she will refuse all main meals, she will look at the plate of food and either try one bite and spit it out or just refuse it without touching it.
Throughout the day she will ask for food and I have a basket of her snacks for the day which is fruits, baby/toddler snacks like organix and kiddylicious but shes even starting to get fussy with those now.

I have an older child (late teen) who was much more fussy than this and I dont think I handled it well, they are still to this day very fussy and I dont want to repeat history.
My question is, would I be unreasonable to start implementing some kind of rules now or should I wait until she's older? I don't want to send her to bed hungry but for example last night she refused dinner, it was left on the table for an hour untouched incase she wanted it and then she went and got a packet of crisps. I said no and she cried so I offered fruit and yogurt which she said no and so she went to bed with just a breastfeed. I feel horrible but i can't just let her refuse dinner and then give crisps when she asks can I?
Despite this she is visually a healthy weight (not been weighed lately) she's not chubby but she isn't skinny, but she probably gets alot of her calories from breastfeeding which is a whole separate problem as I think if she wasn't feeding she'd have more appetite!

Sorry it's long, anybody have any advice?

There's no right or wrong way, really. In your position I would probably gradually cut down on bf or at least get into a routine so that it's not interfering with mealtimes. And I would quietly remove all unhealthy food from the house and keep it for the occasional treat in a cafe or whatever instead. She doesn't need it, and it's so much easier to stand your ground on offering healthy alternatives and model good eating habits when the junk food literally isn't there to be eaten on an everyday basis. As long as she isn't underweight or losing weight then I would also be quite relaxed about it if she doesn't want to eat sometimes, especially if there are a range of foods on her plate. They need to push boundaries at this age. If they see that they have the genuine choice to eat or not eat then often it can stop food becoming such a battleground.

Hi, I'm in a very similar position! My DS recently turned 2, a good weight, also still BF more than he should, and he loves his treats... just like you, it did start out just an occasional treat and now he is obsessed and it is getting out of hand.

Things I have done which are helping:

1. refuse to BF before meals, this is a really difficult and important first step. I let him BF before his nap, before bed and if needed during the night. He gets really desperate and angry and I literally can only sit on the carpet as if I sit on the sofa he climbs on me and starts trying to get into my top! But you are right, appetite is better when he hasn't been BF.

2. i reorganised my kitchen. The drawer he likes to rummage in for snacks, now only contains healthier food - bananas, dried apricots, breadsticks, crackers, cereal etc. He has another drawer with his plastic plates, bowls and cutlery. He loves to choose his own snack, so while he rummages in the drawer I will offer alternatives like fruit, cucumber, toast, cheese or whatever.

3. I let him have a treat once a day during the school run. The rest if the time when he asks for a treat, I tell him he has to wait until we go to collect his sister from school. And then I say, "oh dear, all gone" if he wants more later.

4. I don't eat treats in front of him, and insist my DD eats any treats in her room (she is 10 so she understands).

5. I've found leaving dinner on the table is pointless. Once he's decided he isnt eating it, he won't eat it. Interestingly, he often happily tucks in to exactly the same meal just before bedtime, by stealing from my DH's identical meal when he is home from work a few hours later. I suggest therefore, try feeding him off your plate rather than his own, about an hour or so after you first offered dinner.

6. store any treats somewhere new so you can prove to DD that your cupboard is empty and the treats are all gone. Just keep one single treat somewhere you can easily access it.

Obviously we would all prefer to live off unhealthy food, the difficult is trying to explain to an irrational toddler that we have to eat healthy food too and that a treat is something you can only have on special, rare occasions.

It’s not rules so much as just stop with the junk food.
Raisins and sweet yoghurts/fromage frais is unnecessary too.

I always let mine have plain yoghurt and/or fruit after a meal but if they choose not to eat then that’s fine.

This is a very common problem with long term breastfeeding unfortunately, and one that is rarely mentioned as people are so quick to try encourage you to bf for as long as possible. You’re certainly not alone. Currently it seems like her main source is milk and solids are just optional snacks for her.

I would look to really cut down or preferably stop bf ASAP, the benefits at this age are very minor over another milk (cow or soy) and behaviour wise it’s clearly enabling her to barely eat solids as she’s filling up on her preference, breast milk.

No more snacks, she doesn’t need them and they’re leaving her not hungry for meals. Three meals per day, you get to choose what and when and she chooses if and how much to eat. If she chooses not to eat that’s fine, she can have water until the next mealtime (which you can bring forward a bit if you like). The grazing from a basket of snacks has to stop. If you really feel she needs a snack you can have a regular planned snack time at the same time each day with a very small healthy offering (hummus on a rice cake, some pear wedges etc.). You’re going to have to just stop giving her the treat sweet foods she has a preference for as as you’ve identified now she’s aware they’re an option that’s all she’s going to want.

Provide healthy varied meals each day and have confidence in the fact that you’re giving her the right nutrients she needs to grow, you’re not a chef there to keep trying various things until you hit on the right menu item she’s in the mood for.

Will likely take a few weeks for her to adjust but it’s the only way you’re going to nip this in the bud. Also see your GP and ask if it’s worth a referral to a paediatric dietician. Tough love but you’re the parent and you know what’s best for her, you know what she needs nutritionally and while you can’t make her eat you can ensure you’re not shooting her in the foot by tempting her daily with nice snacky treat foods and endless breast milk meaning she isn’t hungry for or learning to rely on good nutritious solid foods.

@SeventhRaccoon

There's no right or wrong way, really. In your position I would probably gradually cut down on bf or at least get into a routine so that it's not interfering with mealtimes. And I would quietly remove all unhealthy food from the house and keep it for the occasional treat in a cafe or whatever instead. She doesn't need it, and it's so much easier to stand your ground on offering healthy alternatives and model good eating habits when the junk food literally isn't there to be eaten on an everyday basis. As long as she isn't underweight or losing weight then I would also be quite relaxed about it if she doesn't want to eat sometimes, especially if there are a range of foods on her plate. They need to push boundaries at this age. If they see that they have the genuine choice to eat or not eat then often it can stop food becoming such a battleground.

Great advice too.

Nonchalance is the name of the game with toddlers and food. You choose what to give and when, and it’s 100% in their control whether and how much to eat. No pressure, no ‘just a bite!’ ‘Wow look at the yummy broccoli!’, just put it down and let her decide what she wants to do with it.

She won’t starve herself. Don’t make it a power battle and don’t panic thinking she’ll waste away if she skips a meal.

Raisins aren’t healthy by the way. They’re absolutely hellish for teeth decay.
It’s recommended that the child eat cheese cubes while eating raisins followed by proper brushing 20 minutes later.
I wouldn’t give a toddler raisins.

I absolutely advocate nonchalance and very little snacking at this age - i gave a mid morning and a mid afternoon snack at this age if they asked for it, otherwise nothing. 3 meals, they could eat them or not as they chose, I didn't encourage, just ate with them and enjoyed my own meal. I also asked them not to start eating until I had got my own food and was sitting at the table with them (basically because I didn't want to feel like a servant!). I talked about other stuff with them, didn't point out the food at all except to tell them about bits of it that I liked.

I know different kids have very different approaches to food, and mine have their odd fussinesses still, but then so do I. Meals are more about getting together and chatting for us, we can eat if we want to and not if we don't.

But they don't get to leave the main course and still have pudding - pudding is only if you're still hungry after eating your veg and protein, can do what you like with the carbs! Very frowned on I know, but it's worked well for us and the kids are open about the many things (including veg etc) that they like, and the things they don't!

Thank you for the responses, I think I'm worried that at 2 she's not old enough to understand if I say no to things etc but clearly she is and I'm just finding it hard not to be soft!

When she was about 1 and on 3 meals a day I was really good about not snacking as she has always had a small appetite for food and she used to eat a reasonable amount of these 3 meals when she didn't snack all day but slowly and surely the snacks have crept up and the meals get left.

The breastfeeding is an issue, I try not to feed her too close to meals but she just literally jumps on me and helps herself similar to what you say @rainingzen. I often wander around finding things to do in the house because as soon as I sit down that's what she wants.

I agree that I need to make a plan and stick to it, it's just getting everyone else like my DP and relatives who provide childcare to agree too otherwise it's never going to work.

I do not like the sound of rules around food at all, there was an excellent thread on here a few years ago about this and My own DD is also fussy so I paid heed

The long and short of it was, simply provide more tapas style meals with little pics of everything so maybe carrot sticks and humous, cucumber sticks, apple, grapes, chicken pieces, jacket potatoe or whole meal pitta bread, things they can help themselves too and a wide ish range at one meal, rather than one meal and thats it.

Also distraction is actually helpful when it comes to fussy eaters or DC who cant sit still, put TV on, ipad...read a book to them, so they concentrate on that and not the food as much.

nothing wrong with small meals either, as long as they are healthy ish, some people do better on grazing.

Different needs at different ages,I would urge more flexibility and less rigidity.

My DS is the same age and is also demanding treats constantly! He’s not breastfed though and not too interested in milk at all. He’s not very fussy food-wise, I would say a normal level of toddler fussiness.

Like others, I have a box of healthy snacks that he can choose from. I have a secret stash of nicer stuff that I don’t even go near if he’s in the kitchen. I let him have a treat twice a week when we are out so he knows we don’t have treats at home (I’m such a hypocrite - I have chocolate every night after he goes to bed).

I’m pretty relaxed about whether he eats meals or not. He has a good breakfast and usually eats a big meal at lunchtime so I make that his main meal. Then he has a lighter evening meal and some toast or weetabix before bed. If he doesn’t like something I offer an alternative - so if he doesn’t eat his protein for example, I might give peanut butter to make sure he gets some protein. I know that approach isn’t for everyone, but I don’t mind and DS doesn’t make a habit of it.

I agree that breastmilk is probably filling her up. I only took DS off the bottles at 20 months and until then he was eating very little. The sucking action is very comforting - once he didn’t have to suck for milk anymore he lost interest in it and his appetite increased dramatically.

Also, I agree with everything @Puttingouthefirewithgasoline says - tapas style meals are the way to go with toddlers. I’m a grazer too so I’m guessing my DS is taking after me.

Similar to @Puttingouthefirewithgasoline, I personally advocate for more flexibility not less.

I also think rules around food do more harm than good. The same with the whole “bad” food and “good” food categories. For example, nothing wrong with raisins! You don’t ban them, you just make sure you have good dental hygiene. I also see no problem with grazing during the day, toddlers don’t have large stomachs so 6-8 small meals a day might suit them better than 3 large meals.

I do agree that less breastfeeding would lead to more solid food. Breastfeeding is a mutual thing. If you feel you are done, then time to wean child.

I would wean her immediately.

There is absolutely nothing wrong with a two year old child continuing to gain a large proportion of their nutrition from breastmilk. Breastmilk doesn't suddenly lose its benefits at any particular point, be that six months, twelve months or two years. Here is a short list of some of the nutrients found in breastmilk at between one and two years:

In the second year (12-23 months), 448 mL of breastmilk provides:
29% of energy requirements
43% of protein requirements
36% of calcium requirements
75% of vitamin A requirements
76% of folate requirements
94% of vitamin B12 requirements
60% of vitamin C requirements
— Dewey 2001

(Note the energy requirements are the thing provided in the lowest proportion, so scaling up if your child IS meeting their energy requirements you can see they're getting plenty of everything else too!)

As long as you are OFFERING a selection of healthy foods you can allow your child to breastfeed as much as they want (there is a major developmental leap around the se ond birthday which may explain why they want to feed to much right now) and not worry about what they actually CHOOSE to eat. Snacky trays as described above can be good, for breakfast you might offer cold omelette, banana, yogurt, then for lunch crackers, cheese, ham, cut up grapes, apple slices, then for dinner breadsticks, hummus, carrot and cucumber sticks etc.

Remember the division of responsibility: it is your job to decide what to offer, but your child's job to decide what to eat

I would really recommend the book My Child Won't Eat by Carlos Gonzalez (a paediatrician). It covers lots of different things including historical attitudes to weaning - basically, we now wean (in both senses, starting solids and finishing breastmilk) significantly earlier than the historical norm, when most children were weaned around age 3.

think I'm worried that at 2 she's not old enough to understand if I say no to things

At 2 she doesn't need to understand the reasons behind every single thing. You need to be able to say no to all sorts of things whether she understands or not! If you cut down on snacks, hopefully she'll be hungrier for her meals. But if she needs something in between, make it something that she doesn't see as a treat.

Assuming NT and not additional needs/ health issues/ allergies etc:

A parents job is to offer a nutritionally balanced diet, with regular meal and snack times. A childs job is to eat, or not eat as they see fit.

So you say what is on the menu and when it is provided and they say whether or not they'll eat it and how much. If the diet is genuinely nutritious and varied and the meal and snack times regular enough (no more than 3 hours between meals/ snack and less if younger) then you shouldn't worry about how much they are or are not eating and if they skip meals etc.

I would say in addition to the above, always ensure that a meal or snack includes something they like and introduce new/ unusual things one at a time.

Babies/ children are born with a natural sense of what they need to eat and listen to their bodies regarding this and also listen to their bodies when they are full. We as a society do not listen to children listening to their bodies and encourage them to clean their plate or give them multiple different food options when they are not hungry because we feel the should be hungry (usually because we are). All that does is encourage children to go against their natural instincts and encourages eating for the sake of it.

There's increasing scientific evidence for the above as well as that children have natural levels of their metabolisms, so some children will eat significantly less than other children and both will be healthy weights for their bodies - so long as both children are being provided with nutritionally balanced diets.

Watch out for raisins, yoghurts and organix snacks. Those are all quite high calorie and easy to fill up on and also have a lot of sugar. Those organix oatbars have more sugar than a rich tea, shortbread or malted milk biscuit, it's just in the form as of fruit juice concentrates or honey - still sugar.

There is absolutely nothing wrong with a two year old child continuing to gain a large proportion of their nutrition from breastmilk

Actually this isn't wholly true. Children who derive too high a proportion of their total calorie intake from dairy are at risk of iron deficiency. The iron in breastmilk is quite well absorbed but it's still not enough.

I am reading through all replies thank you. I dont want to end up being strict and having proper 'rules' around food as I know that's likely to do the opposite to help and I want to encourage meals to be fun and stress free but at the same time i need to have a general plan in place so that DD doesnt just think she can refuse a meal and then get whatever she asks for.

My older child was very very fussy from weaning and I now realise they were sensory food issues which have not changed much over the years but I dealt with it by bargaining e.g eat this and you can have pudding etc or by taking away privileges if the meal wasnt finished. I know it's not an excuse but I was young i can honestly say I'd never heard of sensory issues with food so for years I just thought he was picky and stubborn.

My DD tried a wide range of food from being weaned and she was nowhere near as fussy as my eldest so I'd hoped things would be different this time!

Regarding the breastfeeding I think mostly the only reason I haven't cut down or quit is because I cannot offer an alternative she likes, she completely refuses cows milk/plant based milks, hot or cold in a special cup I've tried it all.

She has a vitamin D and calcium supplement because she certainly doesn't eat the recommended portion of dairy a day.

I'd stop with the 'baby' snacks. They're expensive and not necessary and honestly my toddler is such a better eater since we ditched them. She also improved massively once we reduced her milk intake - not saying that you necessarily need to, but it's likely that is having a big impact on her appetite.

Sorry, just seen your last message. My daughter also only really started drinking cows milk when I stopped breastfeeding at 16 months. However I do have friends whose children won't drink milk so appreciate it's a bit of a gamble!

I stopped breastfeeding my eldest at about 14 months and he never drank cows milk. He had yoghurt, cheese, custard etc so never needed to actually drink dairy.

SR Nutrition on Instagram (has website too) gives brilliant advice on fussy eating