To have taken my baby to emergency

[NeedingAGoodNap]

Our 8 month old daughter was feeling very unwell. She had a temp of around 40.3 and her breathing was very fast. It was 2am in the morning and we didn’t know what to do so we jumped in the car to take her to emergency. The triage nurse did some tests and found that her temp, breathing and heart rate were all very high so she admitted us straight away.

The doctor seemed confused as to why we were there and thought it was obvious that it was a virus and we should have just treated at home. They monitored and gave her pain relief for 4 - 5 hours until her heart rate we back in a normal range and then sent us home.

Where we unreasonable to take her in? It’s not like she can talk and tell us why she is so upset and unwell

@sheepisheep

Doctor was probably trying to figure out if you had deeper concerns and phrased it badly. Doctor was probably also exhausted, it being the middle of the night and not completely on their A game communication skills wise. You're fine OP.

To those PP calling some doctors twats, just stop it, eh?

But some doctors are twats. There's twats in every profession under the son.

I was badly patronised by a junior doctor last week, telling me DD wasn't ill she just had a mild reaction to an insect bite. Thankfully the senior doctor looked at her properly as it was rapidly advancing cellulitis and she needed admitting for IV antibiotics. I know people can get it wrong, but I also know when I'm being patronised and looked on as a 'typical neurotic mum', and this was the latter. (He looked bloody sheepish after the senior doctor admitted her).

Anyway OP it is usually a good idea to try paracetamol with babies, as a pp said it brings down the temperature and discomfort which slows their breathing and heart rate. My younger child got a lot of nasty chest infections as a baby and toddler so we learned this the hard way! Hope your child is OK. Don't feel bad for seeking advice.

Absolutely not. When my son was 4 months he was admitted with the same and it was sepsis. Trust your instinct and never apologise!

@Graphista

I think it's an experience/confidence thing. I'm guessing this is your first child and you don't have a huge amount of experience with babies? If so perfectly fine and sensible to err on the side of caution and no hcp will say otherwise really

That said I personally wouldn't have taken to emergency for a slightly raised temp and increased breathing (that's normal for babies btw and even adults on occasion it's the body trying to cool itself) I'd have stripped baby to nappy, given calpol, a cool drink if they'll take one or increased bf if bf and cooled the room they were in slightly - the weather is getting warmer and it takes some babies a while to cope with that.

BUT I've a LOT of experience with babies inc sick ones. My own dd runs hot and in her early childhood had febrile convulsions. Very frightening but normal for her at this point. First time I did call ambulance as it was first one and a bad one, but after that and getting advice on prevention and treatment (a refresher/update for me really) I didn't always call someone if it was a fairly mild one but would get her checked at gp next morning as an urgent appointment

What you may find helpful - and frankly I think all new parents should do this if only to help them stay calm - is doing a baby 1st aid course. I'm out of touch with who does the best ones now and if they're available to do online with covid but the Red Cross, St. John ambulance, st Andrew's ambulance here in Scotland from memory were always pretty good on this stuff

Some links

https://www.redcross.org.uk/first-aid/learn-first-aid-for-babies-and-children##

https://www.sja.org.uk/get-advice/first-aid-advice/paediatric-first-aid/

Always better to learn this stuff BEFORE you need it if only so you're not stressed and panicking! Kids can be buggers for accidents/illness that scare the bejesus out of us

My dd it much later turned out has a disability. It makes her more prone to accidents (she's had some SPECTACULAR ones over the years that could have been written for "some mothers do ave em"!), more susceptible to certain infections and it's why she tends to run hot too - so a high temp for others is normal for her, that took us a while to learn/get our heads around.

I'm sure she will be fine but it's hard not to worry

(Doesn't get any easier as they get older dd is 20 and I worry more about her now!)

You aren't that experienced by this post!

NHS advice is NOT to strip baby down as they can go into shock.
40.3 is NOT a slightly raised temp, it's extremely high. A slightly raised temp is anything from normal to 38. Over 38 is a fever. Over 40, can cause a febrile seizure and be fatal.

Please don't give out this kind of advice when it's so so wrong!!

Honestly, I wouldn't worry about it. After having two kids, I've soon realised that my previous belief of everyone in the NHS being caring and approachable to be completely naive.

I've had some incredible care. Some absolutely fab midwives, a lovely doctor at our local GP surgery, and my first HV was an absolute angel. But, I've also had some complete arseholes. Lazy, incompetent, patronising and rude. A few I, on hindsight, 100% should have filed a complaint about. I didn't, but they should not be working in a caring sector. I regret not doing so.

You did nothing wrong. The doctor was a bit of an arsehole and shouldn't be taking out the fact they may have had a bad night/aren't enjoying their job/whatever other reason out on you. It's unprofessional, especially when little babies are involved. As you say, they can't tell us what is wrong and any good parent is overly careful when it comes to their child's healthcare.

If they were particularly rude, I'd put in a complaint, but if they just seemed a bit arsey I'd probably just try and forget about it. You didn't do anything wrong.

Doesn't really matter what the Dr thinks. He/she is just one person in the NHS system. If you feel that you should utilize the system for which you pay taxes and it is warranted then that is all that matters. you should err on the side of caution with a young baby as was evidenced by the action of the hospital so you did the right thing.

@Greenbks

It may be obvious to a dr but you’re not medical professionals and as parents you want to do the right thing and keep your child safe.

Better to be safe than sorry.

Agree.

I hope she is better now.

A nurse told me to ALWAYS err on the side of caution when it comes to infants when my baby had a tremor at 2 days old and I told her I felt silly for bothering her about it. And I was told to ALWAYS consult with a doctor or nurse if the temperature is over 40 and not coming down after calpol or neurofen.
You aren't a paediatrician. You are a parent and a newish one at that. You did the right thing.

You did the right thing. Only a doctor could diagnose whether it was viral or whether they could find a bacterial reason for the high temp. If they had found a bacterial reason (eg strep throat) she would have needed treatment, possibly with antibiotics. So you did the right thing

Follow your gut. DS was about 9 months, high temp and just not himself. We spoke to GP who said he would be fine and would fight off whatever it was but he just wasn't right. Really lethargic and flat so I called out of hours that night. They saw us and he needed antibiotics. Out of hours doc said we had definitely done the right thing. Worst case is that they're fine and you take them home.

At 2 am in A and E , a non-emergency patient is highly likely to be examined by a doctor who is relatively inexperienced, dog-tired, or both.

Drs may have already worked a full day shift the day before, followed by being on-call all night with very little sleep.

They're the same with 83 year olds OP.

I took my mother into A&E twice with raging symptoms of (what turned out to be) campylobacter. She'd been suffering for 2 weeks, getting so weak she couldn't walk and was vomiting and shitting herself all day. I didn't know what to do with her and couldn't cope. GP was just prescribing boxes of imodium.

On the 3rd week i tried again - A&E dr? ''Take her home and give her some nice chips without sauce or vinegar''. Dismissive and snotty.

2 days later she was finally admitted, through A&E, into hospital in a barrier nursing room. She nearly died during the first week in there (we got the 2am call at one point) and spent 5 further weeks being intensively nursed and another week in physio and rehab there.

I used to be a bit in awe of Drs in hospital.
Not any more.

My 18 month son was taken by us to see a GP THREE times and we were dismissed as being inexperienced parents. Eventually we were so desperate (he'd been vomiting for days and was visibly losing weight and becoming really weak) that we took him to A and E. Where he was admitted for 5 days and initially put on a drip and NG tube. Some DRs are rubbish at diagnosing children. Others take parental concerns and intuition seriously. Guess which ones are better?

How horrible for you all. Hope she is ok now.
You absolutely did the right thing.
Don’t let this stop you from doing the same thing if it ever happens again.

I think when it’s your first you absolutely panic as you’ve never experienced it before so it’s frightening so you don’t the right thing op. It’s fine fur drs to know all is well, but you’re not a doctor so you need their reassurance!

It gets a bit easier with experience and as they get older but there’s nothing more worrying that kids!! I’ve got grey hair to prove it

done the right thing I mean

With babies it is completely OK to do this. Most out of hours are very sympathetic to parents as with babies and young children, things can happen fast and they are a bit more vulnerable. So better to be safe. We don’t want to be the ones who ignored something serious. The doctor may also be right in the sense that it would have been OK at home - but that is because he was able to check for any other worrying signs - something that you were not qualified to do.

Doctors in A & E can be very overworked with many serious cases so I’d also cut them a bit of slack - they are not perfect and it could have been the end of a very long shift. What seemed like reassurance to him maybe have been felt as dismissal to you.

I've got two kids, been through all manner of bumps illnesses and hospital visits. I think I have shares in calpol at this point. But if either of mine had a temp over 40, I would be taking them to the doctor/hospital immediately. You did the right thing op, don't doubt yourself because of a lack of professionalism from one probably overworked and shattered junior doctor.

Some doctors have no bedside manner.
I once took my son in to an A+E at our local children's hospital. He was three, with a temperature of 40.1. He had a rash as well. We phoned the hospital before hand and they told us to bring him in.
When we got there, a truly rude junior doctor started shouting, "oh he has only had a temperature for a few hours and you are already running to the hospital, you mothers are all the same".
Then she took his clothes off to examine him. The rash had got much worse since we had left home. So she started shouting again "what on earth? Why did you not bring him in earlier? Do you not see how bad the rash is?"
So I asked her whether I was a panicky mother or a negligent one? She didn't answer.
Then she diagnosed it as Scarlet Fever and gave him a course of antibiotics. A week later we had to go to for a check-up and another doctor took one look at him and said this is Hand, foot and mouth disease and not Scarlet Fever, so he had taken a course of antibiotics for no reason.
I was so cross, but that experience taught me that never again would I put up with any patronising judgemental commentaries in a medical setting.

You’ve done the right thing. I would’ve done the same. Babies can deteriorate quickly.

You did the right thing, doctors like this are why some parents doubt themselves, don’t take their children to hospital when needed and then the consequences can be dire. There was a woman in one of the baby classes we did whose toddler nephew died because he was struggling to breathe and the mum doubted herself as to whether it was serious enough to go to the hospital. Her delayed reaction meant he didn’t get help quick enough. It would have been someone like this doctor previously which would have made her think she was being melodramatic and then make a fatal mistake like this.

@FizzyApricot

They wouldn't have monitored her just for fun either, if they thought you didn't need to be there they would have discharged her.

I've had a number of sick babies and never has one been admitted at 6 months old to watch and wait. Your baby was ill, don't hesitate to do the same thing in a different occasion.

Doctor was probably jaded, possibly dealt with some very very ill kids that day, may have seen others that weren't ill at all. Not saying thats an excuse to be off with you, Im just saying you didnt do anything wrong and its likely his manner had a lot more to do with himself, than you.

I think that some Junior Doctors can be so patronising.

DD1 was sent to the hospital by the GP, so after registering her, we waited and waited. I mentioned to a junior doctor that DD1 had very low O2 sats, and was told that she, 'appeared well...'

The triage nurse took her SATs and quickly turned into an emergency situation rather rapidly.

Trust your gut, and if any doctor infers that you are anxious about bringing a child in, ignore.

A high temp and breathing issues is definitely cause for concern!

If you were worried you did the right thing. You're not a doctor, you can only go by your instincts, and the NHS says to get advice with fast breathing & high temperature. I'm glad she's OK now.

You did the right thing

I think it’s always better to be safe than sorry with babies and small children. YWNBU.