AIBU to ask for ideas how to help DD9 who hates maths

[mathsmadness]

DD in Y5 (age 9) hates maths and gets very anxious/upset about doing any maths work! She really struggles with the fundamentals and is way behind at school. She has always been like this. While school have been sympathetic, there hasn't been that much support on this throughout infant/junior (covid has obviously not helped with this and, of course, they have 29 other children to think about in the classroom). The learning keeps moving on and I feel like DD can never catch up.

She did have a tutor once a week pre covid but with limited success for the money involved. So I'm hoping to try and fill some of the gaps myself with her. I have had stints of doing this with her before some some successes and some dramatic failures!

I was hoping to draw on mumsneters tips, resources, and inspirations to help me with this. Any ideas from teachers or parents who've been in the same situation would be brilliant.

We use Mathseeds with my kids (reception-year 4).

I think you get a months free trial.

It teaches the maths and then you play maths games to consolidate the learning.

You can do a quiz which's sets the level, or you can start at the beginning.

If your DD has gaps from lower years she'll struggle to do the work at year 5 level, so best to start over from the basics, plus it will seem easy so give her confidence

Good luck!

I’d recommend anything that does a placing test / assessment to start off with - we use Doodlemaths, but from up-thread it seems other apps / websites do the same. The key is to make sure it starts from where you child is, rather than where most children their age are.

I’d also recommend something that follows the National Curriculum (Khan Academy doesn’t, though it’s great in other ways) as otherwise you might find it hard to teach in the same order and way its taught in school, and just further confuse her.

Finally, it really helps if it’s the app / website telling the child they need to do the work daily, rewarding them with games when they’ve done a bit of maths etc. Takes the pressure off you!

Also the site covers early secondary school too - don't be put off by the breadth of coverage. I would tackle it in the following order:
Arithmetic
Numeracy
Algorithms
Fractions
Percentages

See it as a longer programme over months. An hour a week (2x30mins) of 1-1 is a lot for a primary school kid who is anxious - you will be able to see progress in a couple of weeks but after a few months you can really achieve a lot of coverage.

[quote mathsmadness]@Flakeymcwakey I've not heard of the Khan Academy so will have a look at this - thanks.

School do use Times Tables Rockstars but DD gets so frantic doing this she just guesses all the answers and gets quite stressy with it so I don't think that timed activities really suit her very well.[/quote]
This is the same for my dd - any hint of a time limit for Maths and she panics and can't do anything. She is now in year 7, her teachers think she is doing 'ok' (which is fine) but I watched her during lockdown and if the teacher gave them say 10 mins to complete a task independently before reading out the answers, she would fall apart and instantly think she couldn't do it. There are definitely basic skills missing - she just can't seem to hold things like number bonds and times tables in her head, or work out which she needs to use to solve a particular sum or problem.
Well done for intervening at the stage you are - I feel as though we've failed dd by assuming primary school would 'fill the gaps'.

We use White rose maths at our school and parents really like it as well . Because it breaks everything down into simple chunks and the majority of the worksheets are free

whiterosemaths.com/resources/

They have excellent videos and a good Facebook page

@mathsmadness

You've been given some great suggestions. However, I would also go back to school. If she is struggling as much as you say then they should be doing something about it. There are some good interventions they can do daily (Power of 2 being one I've used), they can screen for dyscalculia, they can see if it's a memory/attention span problem, they can see if it's specifics in maths and give you things to work on.
It's an unfortunate position but with all the pressures around and cuts to funding, you have to be a relentless and noisy advocate for your child in order to get the help they need. I would ask for a meeting with the teacher and ask to discuss what they think the issue is and what they suggest. (My list perhaps being a starting point if they don't suggest anything.)

OP i remember watching an episode of Dispatches on how primary maths wasn’t being taught that well in the U.K.

It’s from around 2010 so I hope things will have improved since then. But I remember clearly how it talked about tangible objects being used to learn the basics, rather than just figures on paper (which I see PPs have already recommended). It might be an interesting watch for some tips.

[quote mathsmadness]@romdowa thank you for saying that and reminding me how DD feels about it. In homeschooling I was certainly guilty of saying let me explain it to you one more time - thinking she'd finally get it. And to be honest she'd totally had enough and was getting pretty upset . I didn't help and I feel guilty about it in hindsight.[/quote]
I wouldn't feel guilty at all , you are trying to do your best for your daughter and it's so hard to put yourself in someone elses shoes. Just let her know that it's ok that she doesn't get it , people are good at different things and as long as she tries her best then let her know you will be happy with that.

My DS is the same. We have dragon box apps on the iPad which he enjoys and stmath which is a visual maths program. Minimal words involved and a series of games . I think it's still free at the moment if you're homeschooling.

In homeschooling I was certainly guilty of saying let me explain it to you one more time - thinking she'd finally get it. And to be honest she'd totally had enough and was getting pretty upset

I think PP are right you need to find out where they are not start from where they should be.

I found mathfactor good because it was explination, worked example folowed by 20+ questions - then an alert to me if they didn't get it - then next lesson recap more worked example the question - then third just questions or new lesson slightly moving on - then summer clubs to re-go over all the topics. I think my younger two especially needed that practise - took them ages to learn timetables and number bonds but constantly applying them made them and they are really fast.

It may well be finding a site that suit your child though - I've seen Doodlemaths recommended a lot but when we tried it we weren't impressed but it must work for many.

It does take a long time to catch up and build confidence longer than I hoped but it has paid of eventually for all my children.

Baking and cooking together so she can see how it helps. Board games. Orchard toys do some nice ones - there was a shopping one I recall dd liking.

I think little and often is the best way. 10 mins of maths each day can make a big difference after a term.or two. Also might be worth looking at maths lesson from Oak Academy (free) or subscribing to White Rose Maths.

She sounds a bit like my dyscalculic dd. Basically it is just repetition, repetition and more repetition. She may 'get' something one day but forget it the next. Power of 2 is good (boring but good!) From what I remember it goes right back to basics and may seem too easy - but worth doing.
Make sure she always has concrete aids - number lines, number squares etc.

I remember trying to teach dd fractions - did not go down well!

Thanks everyone - so many great suggestions and ideas. I really appreciate it.

The Humble books on amazon are excellent.

Try Oak Academy on You Tube. Helped a lot with my charge who struggled with Maths.

Just realised it was Plus 1 I used with dd - she actually found Power of 2 too difficult.

Mine did about 15-20 minutes of maths every day clear explination repetition and practise they were all younger than OP DD and managed that with routine and bribary.

They did have numicon sets they could use and there were number squares that could be printed off.

Baking and board games were part of family life from early ages anyway - as we numberjacks and Numberblocks.

If timetables are an issue percy parker CD might be worth buying - though I think some songs are on you tube but we found good as background they could sing along to - it's yet another way of presenting timetables to them.

Get a set of Numicon

There’s loads of ideas on the New Zealand website

Great for showing number binds plus or minus on adding fractions halves etc

You just need a better tutor.
Look for a maths tutor that talks about a mastery approach, use of manipulatives (equipment like numicon, counters etc), concrete-pictoral-abstract approach, white rose maths ...
You don't need to understand all this yourself but it's all best practice maths teaching so you want someone making these kind of noises.
Someone who talks about building deep understanding of number and concepts.
It may be your dd needs taking right back to the foundations of Y1 level maths and building understanding from there. Don't be scared by that, I have to do it a lot for even older children who like your dd have limped through. It doesn't mean it'll take three years to catch up, when you take children back to their last point of understanding and build properly from there, progress can be quick. For example a good teacher working individually with a struggling 9 year old could take them from y1 understanding of a concept to age appropriate understanding within a single session.

Also watch number blocks on cbeebies

@Springingintospring
If I could get a tutor to work with DD and do this I would be delighted. Do you have any tips on how to find somebody good? Where is it best to look?

I did a bit of "tutoring" for a neighbour's little girl next door (it was very informal), and used to do it so it was half table work and half play.

I used to take my old Sylvanians around and we'd do things like putting them into three groups of four, or six groups of two and two groups of six etc. We did fractions by eating apples and toast. We also did number bond hopscotch and played shops a lot. Oh and we planned a day trip for the Sylvanians (bus fares, entry fees, bus timetables etc). Things that were fun but used maths. In summer we'd colour the flagstones outside as well, to do fractions.

Man, the teacher needs to step up. I’ve made it my bloody mission this year to get the 2 girls in my class who hate and fear maths to feel good about it. It’s absolutely worked with one of them who has done a total 180 from the beginning of the year. The other one I think at least feels safe in my maths lessons and doesn’t stress!

I don’t rate TT rockstars that much or timed games etc for children with low confidence as they panic and the fog descends. I would echo other posters with going back to basics and using concrete resources. Does she have a solid strategy even for counting on her fingers eg if you ask her to do 12-5, is she counting back from 12 or on from 5? She should be counting on as it’s much easier and you end up with the correct number of fingers if that makes sense. Identify these things - mental addition and subtraction makes life so much easier so think about bridging through 10 etc, adding together the tens and then the units, strategies like that. (E.g 52 + 23 you do the 5+2 and then 2+3 and get 75. Bridging through 10 would be like 6+5 - 6+4 is 10 and then add the 1 makes 11.)

And yeah, I would scout a better tutor. But tbh I would expect more from the teacher - although this is a big priority of mine due to being the child who hated and was scared of maths (...until I was 24...)