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AIBU?

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Original poster

How do people in public sector jobs afford to live in London/SouthEast?

104 replies

KateSW1983 · 14/04/2021 17:14

Always been curious about how people in public sector jobs can afford to live in London and get on the property ladder? We live in London but earn a good wage between the two of us. Looking around us - I genuinely have no idea how teachers, nurses, policemen, staff in museums, libraries etc manage to live in London. They clearly do and London obviously needs them but how to do they manage to afford living in this city? Clearly not everyone leaves the South East, but I do often wonder why people stay and how they can afford to stay.

OP posts:
MargotMoon · 14/04/2021 21:45

Never mind public sector workers, what about cleaners and care workers and anyone else on minimum wage?

RandomMess · 14/04/2021 22:05

Plenty of public sector job wages are minimum wage these days.

Lab workers needing a science honours degree and experience and expected to manage others on £18k per year.

GreyhoundG1rl · 14/04/2021 22:08

We bought 17 years ago. I probably couldn't afford to buy the house I live in now, despite substantial pay rises since 🤷🏻‍♀️

RandomMess · 14/04/2021 22:16

We bought 19 years ago, house worth 2.5 times as much, DH not had a pay rise in 10 years bar one year 0.5%.

Just no way could we buy now, would just about afford a studio flat rather than a cheap 3 bed/decent 2 bed.

seven201 · 14/04/2021 22:18

We lived as two couples in a tiny 2 bed in a dodgy flat block to save like mad (no holidays, meals out etc). Then bought a basement flat that needed some work in se london and were lucky as the area went up significantly, so then were able to move to a commuter town and buy a small house. We probably won't be able to upsize as my I'm at the top of the payscale now and just can't afford it once you factor in the cost of selling and buying. That said, if I went for a senior leadership post then I could, but I just don't want to!

I have no idea how anyone on minimum wage can afford London/SE.

fiorentina · 14/04/2021 22:19

Many of those I know in those roles are with a partner in a better paid role and didn’t buy a property alone. Or I know of friends buying together.

Neonprint · 14/04/2021 22:23

We moved out of London! My partner works for an arms length gov org and I work in the charity / cultural sector. There was just no way we could get a deposit together. Even though we were paying 1.5k a month rent so the equivalent mortgage would buy a property.

MummyInTheNecropolis · 14/04/2021 22:24

I’m a teacher and live in social housing in London - plenty of others do too. I might never own it but I do have security and affordable rent in a nice area so I’m happy to stay here.

Acovic · 14/04/2021 22:24

@mouse70 NHS here. My london weighting (I'm a doctor)is 2k per annum.

Definitely pays the extra cost of living. Not.

The reality is that my dept - prestigious London teaching hospital actually struggles to recruit - the old guard all have big houses or prime central London flats they bought eons ago. My generation are mostly OK as typically there were two flats to liquidate into one house (I'm single so live in a tiny but affordable central flat on my own). The generation 5 years behind me are fucked.

They didn't manage to buy earlier. Are now consultants with young children and cannot afford a home within the 10 mile/ 30 min radius for their job in an area with good schools. So many of them choose to go and work in Kent, Surrey or other Home County DGHs. Others move further afield eg. Devon!

It's going to become a bigger and bigger issues. Those on agenda for change (so basically most other NHS staff) get a bigger london weighting but their average salaries are lower so they are still priced out. It is really affecting recruitment and retention especially as the young European nurses now don't want to come to do their few years in London as the combination of Brexit/ Covid has made doing so so difficult.

MumofSpud · 14/04/2021 22:25

My DS and his girlfriend bought a 2bed in the South-East (train station 3 min walk and about 40 min direct to Waterloo or 1 change and that will be a bit less to Paddington)
They were both 21 (this was 2 years ago).
How? Lots of o/time - he is public sector, she isn't.
But they also didn't / don't scrimp on nice holidays etc
NO bank of mum and dad either - it is doableSmile

Neonprint · 14/04/2021 22:26

@mouse70

I seem to remember NHS and other public sector workers, get extra pay to work in London(London Weighting) and some areas in South also have this system which could contribute in a small way to the higher cost of living in these areas
London weighting really doesn't go far at all. As wages haven't gone up for a long time it does even less. Often its only another 3k or so. Definitely nothing close to the extra cost of living in London.
Neonprint · 14/04/2021 22:28

@MumofSpud

My DS and his girlfriend bought a 2bed in the South-East (train station 3 min walk and about 40 min direct to Waterloo or 1 change and that will be a bit less to Paddington) They were both 21 (this was 2 years ago). How? Lots of o/time - he is public sector, she isn't. But they also didn't / don't scrimp on nice holidays etc NO bank of mum and dad either - it is doableSmile
I think that depends where you work. Neither me or my partner have ever had a public sector / charity sector role with paid overtime. It's quite uncommon in salaried roles. Maybe in health care roles or police where people do shifts it might be a thing. But never come across it in an ofhuve job.
Hothammock · 14/04/2021 22:40

Me and my husband are public sector workers.
We started off by buying a cheaper property in 2003 with a long commute, before we had children. We then upgraded in 2005 to a bigger property in a cheaper area which was up and coming.
Then we had children and by 2016 our property had doubled in value and so did our salaries following promotions.
We then again up sized. We no longer have childcare costs which frees up a lot of money and makes a larger property affordable. We do still have a long commute and we don't live in a very desirable area but it's good enough for us with access to well performing schools.
I am pretty bored of the complaint that people can't buy somewhere in London or the southeast. The reality seems to be that people can buy but they are unwilling to compromise to get there. You can't expect to choose your preferred location and have your lifestyle just as you want it and buy a property. Property is extremely expensive and so you have to compromise on the other stuff to get it. If you are unwilling to compromise then enjoy life and your choices but don't moan to everyone about it.

Cocomarine · 14/04/2021 22:45

There was someone posting here the other day, with a central London council flat for under £500 a month. There actually are still housing association properties around!

RandomMess · 14/04/2021 22:48

@Hothammock well our jobs have gone up from around £15k each to £20k, we were allowed to borrow based on affordability so on a combined income of £30k and 2DC we were allowed to borrow £120k and had a deposit of £20k (my share from selling a flat as was already on property ladder).

So today that would be a combined salary of £40k at best you would still only be allowed to borrow £120k but the house costs at least £300k so £180k deposit needed.

House costs in the SE have majorly outstripped salary increases in 19 years and ability to borrow gone down. Even a studio flat is £180k which is it really an option with 2DC.

Original poster
KateSW1983 · 14/04/2021 23:13

It just seems crazy that people don't just leave or retrain. I mean if I go by the other thread on salary expectations there are clearly plenty of jobs that pay more and might even be more pleasant.

I have to say that all of our friends who worked in the public sectors, museums, architecture etc all left once they started having kids. Though it must really hollow out so many sectors with lots of people in their 20s , a few in their 50s but not many in their 30s

OP posts:
alltoomuchrightnow · 14/04/2021 23:16

I managed a charity shop on £6 something an hour and lived in social housing by the Thames. This was about 8yrs ago

hibbledibble · 14/04/2021 23:19

In my experience, they usually have wealthy partners and/or parents to help out.

London weighting comes nowhere near close to the additional cost of living in London

Obbydoo · 14/04/2021 23:21

@KateSW1983

Always been curious about how people in public sector jobs can afford to live in London and get on the property ladder? We live in London but earn a good wage between the two of us. Looking around us - I genuinely have no idea how teachers, nurses, policemen, staff in museums, libraries etc manage to live in London. They clearly do and London obviously needs them but how to do they manage to afford living in this city? Clearly not everyone leaves the South East, but I do often wonder why people stay and how they can afford to stay.
What made you wonder about public sector people but not private? Statistically, on average nurses, teachers & police earn more than the average salary across all sectors. Surely the problem is greater in the private sector, not the public?
Lightsabre · 14/04/2021 23:21

.

upsydaisyssinging · 14/04/2021 23:24

They either:

  1. rent a room in a house or flat share
  2. live in a horrible rented basement studio
  3. marry someone who works in tech/the city
  4. live fucking miles away and commute in
  5. live in an ex council flat they got on key worker scheme when labour were in power and had right to buy after 3 years.
SinisterBumFacedCat · 14/04/2021 23:28

My uncle has a housing association flat, he went on the list at 18 and got his first flat early 30’s in the 90’s. I did the same but was never offered a place after about 15 years I realised it would never happen, my DF was living in a house shut down by environmental health and only ended up eligible for social housing after he was diagnosed with a terminal disease. There is literally nothing available now social housing wise, people are paying sky high rents that are subsidised by the tax payer, going straight into the pocket of unscrupulous landlords with multiple houses turned into MHOs. It’s a fucked system that is not going to improve anytime soon if I’m Allright Jacks like a poster on here says they are “bored” of hearing about it.

Original poster
KateSW1983 · 14/04/2021 23:28

@Obbydoo I guess I was especially interested in the public sector ones because their salaries are set by the government i.e. something that I can vote on, unlike the private sector ones. Also, my impression is that certain jobs/professions get paid ok outside London i.e. most of my friends work in the public sector but seem to be ok ish or at least have their own home etc. But London just sees totally mad and I wonder how people live and why dont they leave.

You're right that it's also true for other jobs and professions. But perhaps I wasnt sure how to phrase it - how do people on normal salaries manage to live in London and why dont they leave or re-train.

OP posts:
Ellpellwood · 14/04/2021 23:31

The 2 I know who have bought are couples where one of them is public sector and the other works in banking/finance. My 2 single friends in London are late 30s and both rent (one a studio in Ealing, one a flat share with a friend in Richmond).

I don't really follow the logic of "why don't they leave". Nurse A leaves, to be replaced by Nurse B on the same salary in the same city with the same expensive housing.

Lucysnap · 14/04/2021 23:38

@Ellpellwood thank you for your examples. the question of why don't they leave is i guess in terms of does everyone just leaves once they have kids/cant flatshare anymore. in terms of them being replaced, are they replaced at a lower grade/younger?

I recently looked at a school prospectus and all the teachers were so so young. Am probably misremembering but I don't remember all my teachers being essentially in their 20s