Who is BU regarding 17th may rules?

[Iremembertheelderlykoreanlady]

Ok so not really unreasonable, more who has it right?

Due to go on a family holiday which was originally booked 2019 for 2020 and then postponed to 2021.

Holiday is booked for after 17th may but before 21st June, in the UK

Family A - Parents
Family B - Adult child, partner and 2 children
Family C - Adult child, partner and 1 child.

The rules state that 2 households can share holiday accommodation so current plan is Family A and Family C are going to stay at the holiday home and Family B will be staying in different accomodation nearby but socialising/eating outside at the holiday home with the two other families, and obviously meeting up for walks/beach/day trips.

All been sorted to everyone's satisfaction.

However, Family A are in a childcare bubble with Family B.

So, due to the childcare bubble would it be legal for the children of family B to stay overnight at the holiday home?

2 families think it's fine, 1 family thinks it's against the law/guidance which will (hopefully!) Be in place from 17th May

Why complicate things by staying over?
I would say it's against the rules as they are not bubbled with family c.

Honestly this wouldn't matter at all to me, what difference does it make?

It isn’t really childcare if you’re on holiday is it? Childcare bubble is for work etc and not the same as being in the same household. I’d keep things simple and stick to the two households / rule of 6 for indoors. I hope the weather is good for you!

I think against. You are not supposed to mix bubbles. Eg a support bubble shouldn't mix with a childcare bubble.

I would say you can't stay over.

Why would you want to anyway?

If you're bubbled you're one household aren't you? So I think it's fine.

In terms of the rules, no it would not be allowed as not needed for childcare.

In terms of any logical sense, it won't make any difference if you're all spending all day together anyway.

@Tinydinosaur

If you're bubbled you're one household aren't you? So I think it's fine.

They aren’t bubbled. Two households cannot generally bubble. A hi cod are bubble is for looking after children, not for adults to socialise with children present.

Not sure on legality as not looking that far ahead currently.

I suppose if those were the rules and you were wanting to follow them to the letter it would not be legal, as the childcare arrangement would not really be needed, but that seems a bit nit picky if you’re all away together and are going to be in close contact anyway.

If A and B are already linked by a bubble it would probably make more sense for them to stay together? But to be honest I’ve never really got my head around childcare bubbles as we have managed without one (just about). I always thought they were to allow the parents to work, and it was childcare only, but loads seem to have used it as a way of getting around the rules.

Hope you manage to get away!

Otherwise the plan would be for the children from household B to maintain 2m from their cousin and grandparents. Which seems cruel. And if you're not social distancing the kids then they may aswell stay over.

Childcare bubbles don't count as one household as they're only allowed to provide childcare for each other - the adults can't mix as one household. So this definitely wouldn't be within the rules.

Not legal no - there would still be 3 households staying at the holiday home. Would be different if it was a support bubble.

The holiday home might also not be keen on you doing this.

Surely if A and B are bubbled for childcare reasons then they should stay togther and C stay somewhere else.

And also I suppose you need to think about what is fair for the owners of the place you are staying.

They will want to keep things as covid safe as they can, and we need to support these places to enable them to keep open after having enforced closure for so long.

Childcare bubbles are only supposed to be used for childcare so that should be disregarded in terms of sleeping overnight etc.

I think it would be easier to keep in two separate residences.

To clarify in case it wasn't clear, only the children from Family B would be staying over. They are in a childcare bubble with grandparents who are family A. The parents from family B would be staying in the alternative accommodation.

Reason for doing it would just be because it would be more fun for the children. Also the travel between the 2 accommodations with young children late at night. Rural area crappy roads. Pain in the arse trying to get them to sleep again if they've fallen asleep in the car etc

ChocOrange1 In terms of the rules, no it would not be allowed as not needed for childcare

In terms of any logical sense, it won't make any difference if you're all spending all day together anyway

^ This

A childcare bubble is to provide childcare when the parents are not there
As both parents will be there, a childcare bubble is not required, therefore normal sSD rules will apply to the group

Don’t forget the childcare bubble will be A and the children of B, not A and the whole family of B

Surely if A and B are bubbled for childcare reasons then they should stay togther and C stay somewhere else.

Only family B have access to the alternative accommodation so it has to be that way round otherwise I agree that would make more sense.

I think you are family C. It looks like you are getting dumped with family Bs kids while they get a few nights alone, whereas you thought you were getting some time with your parents as your kids have missed out due to other childcare bubble. Therefore it upsets you and you don't want to do it.

Personally if that's the situation I'd say A and B can have (and pay for) the accommodation and you will holiday elsewhere - and remember where everyone loyalties lie!

Who cares? Just do it if you want? I don’t think people are examining the rules that closely.

I think you are family C. It looks like you are getting dumped with family Bs kids while they get a few nights alone, whereas you thought you were getting some time with your parents as your kids have missed out due to other childcare bubble. Therefore it upsets you and you don't want to do it.

Personally if that's the situation I'd say A and B can have (and pay for) the accommodation and you will holiday elsewhere - and remember where everyone loyalties lie!

You're right that I am family C but very wrong about my motivations. I'm one of the families who wants the kids to stay overnight, and I thought because overnight stays are allowed with a childcare bubble it would be legal.

Looks like I was wrong though

Bold fail!

Seems a bit silly for one family to think it’s not ok when it won’t make much difference

Of course the other point to note is that we are actually all guessing because the legislation for May doesn't exist yet (and the date is not confirmed either).

One thing that might easily happen is that childcare bubbles cease to exist entirely - after all if 2 households are allowed to mix indoors anyway, there's no need to define a particular instance of this that allows care for children.