AIBU - England couldn’t care less about Northern Ireland

[ThisThatTheOther]

Northern Ireland has seen a return to violence , petrol bombs etc every night for a week now. It’s dominated the headlines here in Ireland. People are worried as peace up north is so fragile. Listening to the radio yesterday an old advisor of Tony Blair was on to discuss. The radio host read out the top 8 listed stories on all main English sites and the violence of Northern Ireland didn’t even feature. It’s the top headline again in all major Irish publications this morning but not in English publications.

@mrsjoyfulprizeforraffiawork

It seems this may be more an age thing. Those of us over 40 can remember the Troubles all too well, when we were reading very sad news from NI on a daily basis. (I remember also bombing campaigns in England during that time, when I was working in a department store in Oxford Street, being trained in checking for bombs on the shop floor every time it received a bomb warning and the West End being empty of shoppers, like a ghost town. Also, all the more serious bombings in England, such as Warrington). It was obvious, once the EU demanded a border on Brexit that it would cause a problem. I am appalled that, in reality, it has been put between NI and the rest of UK. I am for Brexit and think if EU wanted a hard border, it was up to them to make it on the edge of the EU, ie between NI and ROI (a very porous border it would have been too, as impossible terrain). We didn't want one and should not have gone along with this. Most of all, I feel UK Government is hugely letting the people of NI down by following the ridiculous rules demanded by EU in the agreement when they are so clearly punitive to NI and unworkable. It was obviously going to ferment unrest.

@mrsjoyfulprizeforraffiawork it is an absolute cop out to blame this on the EU. Before even putting a referendum to the U.K. people on Brexit the government should have sat down and said look we have a land border with the EU, in an area where identity is massively contentious and that was recently a war zone. How would it work if we leave the EU.

NI wasn’t even considered. They were a complete after thought and when it got too complex the U.K. media and government just turned it round as the EU’s problem.

I've been "over the water" for a good few years and regularly feel homesick. Not going to lie, I've cried at this. I grew up during the Troubles and my dad was murdered. I hoped I would never see scenes like these again in my lifetime.

My colleagues by and large are aware of what's going on but by and large if it's not affecting anyone I know they don't seem to care.

The UK was happy to have hard borders around the EU when it meant limiting people or goods from non-EU countries, well now it's the same for them.Reaping, meet sowing.

BoJo got to be PM. Some of the ultra rich Tories get to gamble on the pound and strip worker legislation. They got plenty out of Brexit.

I’ve yet to meet a normal person who can explain what they get out of it. I guess being stuck in the two hour Non-EU immigration queues, behind all the US, Chinese and Korean tour groups as you “pop over” to Spain and France is a good way to pick up a new language?

By and large twice = fail

The Bobby Storey funeral as a reason for the rioting is the biggest pile of BS I've ever heard. That was literally in JUNE and it somehow justifies petrol bombing in APRIL the following year? It doesn't even make sense.

@knackeredcat so sorry for your loss. I can't even imagine how your feeling right now.

Politicians repeatedly stamp all over the real people and face no consequences it's disgusting

Issue is it’s not taught in most English schools. I don’t think we even really mentioned N Ireland in geography let alone history.

I also don’t subscribe to live tv so my news is from going online.

I’ll hold my hands up and admit I don’t understand the issues and the need for such violence but I’m not there and it wasn’t something ever mentioned growing up or in school.

It’s the media who decide what gets reported, not the people

The media decides based on what they know the people will listen to. What will sell papers or get listeners/viewers. They don't just decide what they personally want to talk about!!

I have been following it wishing for a peaceful resolution but yes it needs to be MUCH more highlighted in the press. Even though we all assume the people of NI will at some point want to become part of a united Ireland th as people are our neighbours and for the vast majority of us our distant cousins

Thank you, @IsurviveonCoffeeandWinein2021. It's been a bit triggering being reminded of the regular disruption to day to day life. And you're so right about politicians.

I doubt even 1% of those who voted Brexit thought about the effect on N.I
Would that include the 40+% who voted for Brexit in NI?

Hank, DUP pushed for Brexit and many, many loyalists voted for it for the sole reason of putting up a hard border on the island. Nationalists asked for NONE of this. We voted to remain. The GFA would never have permitted it so the DUP gambled and LOST. They made a massive deal of the Bobby Storey funeral purely to deflect.

And as for segregated education....this was FORCED on us when partition took place. Catholic children were to be denied education so we had no choice but to provide our own. Protestant State schools did not admit us and they were funded by the state far more favourably than Catholic schools. This only changed quite recently. Stranmillis teaching college is far and away more advanced and kitted out that St Mary's in the Falls Road.

Northern Ireland was established as a sectarian 'Protestant State for a Protestant People'. Partition only came about to appease unionists...I could weep for my forebears left behind in the North in a deliberately sectarian statelet. Catholics were denied employment and housing and gerrymandered. My own parents were beaten while marching for civil rights in the sixties.

But we need to remember....there are around 100 confused, manipulated youths out on the streets, fighting because the drug dealers who run their communities have told them to do it. The drug dealers don't like their supply being interrupted by the Protocol. There are 1.8 million of us, however, sitting at home and hating all of this.

I agree with pp - it depends where you get your news from. I have R4 on most of the time and it has been discussed at length for the last 4-5 days.

Please don't lump all the "English " together- this serves no one except the politicians who seek to divide the UK even further. They've separated us from Europe and now they want to fracture the UK. It makes me extremely sad as I don't feel that it benefits any of us.

The media are pretty pitiful these days, I agree, but if you rely on your SM feed for news I would imagine there will be a considerable bias to what appears. If you've seen that Netflix documentary about social media it all begins to make sense. Sad times

England does care but it's up to our MP's to help ?

Issue is it’s not taught in most English schools. I don’t think we even really mentioned N Ireland in geography let alone history

That's such a cop out, and I only ever hear English people say it. You can't be expected to know things you weren't taught in school? I'm guessing you are decades out of school and could have learned a thousand times more out of it than you ever did in it. If you can't be bothered, that's not the fault of the curriculum. Read a paper, read a book. Learn!

@knackeredcat I'm so sorry for your loss. I can imagine these are tough days for you

@Rukaya

Issue is it’s not taught in most English schools. I don’t think we even really mentioned N Ireland in geography let alone history

That's such a cop out, and I only ever hear English people say it. You can't be expected to know things you weren't taught in school? I'm guessing you are decades out of school and could have learned a thousand times more out of it than you ever did in it. If you can't be bothered, that's not the fault of the curriculum. Read a paper, read a book. Learn!

I’m under 30 and I even went into further education thank you.

Yes I can and do research things but normally because I know of it and have an interest in learning more about something that peaks my interest or matters in the context of needing to so medically or work related.

In school N Ireland just basically doesn’t exist why would I look for further knowledge on a place that I know nothing of? I don’t look into the history of Bali or china either funnily enough.

@AuntieStella

It was top story on the BBC news yesterday evening, and is the top non-Covid article on the website

But only the FT and The Metro have it anywhere on their front pages

Taken on board the comments above about style of reporting. What's been absent is all the build-up to this, and just generally what's going on in NI politics. Coverage only when there is an exceptional event isn't a great approach by national news organisations.

IME the BBC has dumbed down considerably in recent years, and I watch more by habit than anything else. I sometimes watch SKY, but does anyone have recommendations of any others MSM which cover more current events (and little to no entertainment or sport)?

Glad it's not just me that noticed the Beeb's descent into tabloidness.

They still have SOME reporters working for them who are good at their jobs, but now so many who are just dreadful.

And I also think that the threats to scrap the license fee, and the boycotting of anyone who gave the government too tough an interview has rendered them somewhat toothless and of questionable independence.

Yes I can and do research things but normally because I know of it and have an interest in learning more about something that peaks my interest or matters in the context of needing to so medically or work related

So you're admitting the issue is you don't care and/or can't be bothered then?

In school N Ireland just basically doesn’t exist why would I look for further knowledge on a place that I know nothing of? I don’t look into the history of Bali or china either funnily enough

It's your own fucking country, its not China! NI exists, in your country. It's been a huge issue politically for the last 5 years, and long before that. You are literally proving OP's point, English people don't know about NI and don't care.

In school N Ireland just basically doesn’t exist why would I look for further knowledge on a place that I know nothing of? I don’t look into the history of Bali or china either funnily enough.

But Northern Ireland is part of your own country! It's not Bali ffs.

There was a war in your own country not that long ago but it has nothing to do with you, okay then.

Thanks, @dreamingbohemian. I daresay others on the thread whether posting or lurking who know these scenes only too well feel the same.

I don't think we can say the North of Ireland is the same country as England. That's ridiculous. And offensive to us Irish who had partition forced on us and were brutally colonised. The only country we are part of is Ireland.

@DynamoKev
Would that include the 40+% who voted for Brexit in NI?

Dynamo has a point. It becomes very easy on threads like these to apportion blame in one direction to fit a personal agenda - The "English," Brexit voters, The EU, The Tories. It's never as simple or as straightforward as that. It may be a mix of all these things to lesser or greater degrees, plus the disgruntled youth in those areas taking opportunity to vent after ages spent in confinement with their basic needs for social interactions and social freedoms taken away? I think this also has a large part to play in the unrest we're all witnessing at the moment.

Stating "England couldn't care less" is a sweeping generalization; as pp have pointed out, the spotlight needs to be directed onto the media, (who are reporting on it) if there's more exposure needed.

I do think it's also a bit galling to keep holding "The English" to account for colonial activities; it's an easy argument to keep harking back to but it bears no relevance in finding a solution in real time. Moving forward we now live in a modern world where we hope our politicians all work together to find and maintain peace. Most people are intelligent and educated and compassionate enough to assume a sense of collective, as well as individual responsibility for what happens.

@Totallydefeated

It’s the media who decide what gets reported, not the people.

I’m English and care very deeply about this. The potential for violence was a big part of my worries over Brexit. I don’t want anybody to have to live with violence.

I agree.

I saw it reported a few days ago and my heart sank. One of my first thoughts was a link with Brexit and how the government have treated NI during it.

I'm too young to remember the Good Friday Agreement and what came before, but to risk sacrificing such a hard won peace for money (which is what I believe brexit comes down to) is appalling.

I care, very much.

@Alwaysandforeverhere the difference is NI is part of the UK! It's not Bali or China!
Part of the problem I think is the minimising use of language around what actually happened in NI. There was a civil war in the UK which raged for many many years. Yet the careful language used to reference it 'The Troubles' utterly minimised it. Always making it an 'Irish problem ' too when in fact it was a civil war fought mainly on UK soil...