To ask if anyone here is a SENDco or has experience with SEN in school?

[Leviooosaaah]

I’ve posted before about my eldest DS who is about to start secondary and has SEN; I got some fantastic advice and I’m going to contact his secondary school next week when they open to discuss support. I want to be prepared so I’m turning to you lovely lot again.

We have the following:

He is selectively mute and receiving SALT for this.

He finds it impossible to make new friends (he has friends but these friends are starting to outgrow him so I don’t think they will last much longer).

He has daily explosive meltdowns including throwing things and banging things as he is so wound up from school.

He is unable organise himself, find his own clothes or socks, or regulate his own homework. It causes arguments if we try to encourage him to do this.

He is unable to get himself out of the bath or shower and get himself dried; he relies on me to do this and it has to be done a certain way. Any encouragement to get him to do it himself results in crying and shrieking.

He will not leave the house and hates to go out.

He will not enter a shop but also does not like to be left to wait in the car . If I walk out of sight in a park or outside of our home , he gets upset and feels like I’ve left him.

Has no desire to play out with his class mates and is impulsive , easily persuaded to do the bidding of others and does not act upon road safety.

He could never (at this stage) get on a bus or buy something independently in a shop.

He refuses to engage in homework on any level and is unable to pack his own school bag.

He can only make a basic sandwich of cheese spread or such like; he can not make toast and needs a lot of supervision. He is unable to “find” things he needs.

He can not describe or verbalise his feelings and has a way of thinking that I can not comprehend at all (I try!). If something goes wrong , his version of events in the way he sees it sounds completely irrational (but is rational to him).

He can not not deal with unexpected changes to his routine and even a minor upset can change his mood for the whole day.

He has to be encouraged, bribed and argued with to conduct simple basic hygiene such as washing and brushing his hair. This causes hours of meltdowns.

Academically he is clever but is attaining average grades and I feel this is hindered by his anxiety and emotional immaturity.

He will categorically not talk about school; even the mention of the word sends him in to shut down and he will not engage in any conversation to help him.

If you are a SENDco , what would you come back to offer us in terms of support?

EHCP appeal is under way but is unlikely to be in place in time for secondary . EHCP aside, would you feel as a school you could meet his needs?

CAMHS can take years - could you approach your GP? I have seen wonders worked with medication.

There is large variations in mainstream provision. But the majority are not equipped or set up for such complex needs. Which, by implication, need specialist and individually tailored support - and schools are general places. Large amount of pupils through the doors, set timetable, lots of different teachers (some who will get it/some who won’t), out the door. Like a whirlwind and repeat.

Does your school have a ASD resource base?

If you want my unfiltered opinion the gap between your son and his peers will increase. It could be okay in Year 7 but as his peers mature, without an inclusive space in school - like an ASD base, he may struggle.

Large schools, with lots of people are highly stressful. He will be expected to get around school independently.

Without an EHCP - it’s likely that he will get general provision of help. Which could be patchy. Your Senco in the first instance will probably match him with a child with an EHCP so he can benefit from their support. The SEN department will continue with the SALT relationship.

From your description a special needs school sounds more appropriate, smaller class sizes and a child centred approach that will support your child through the whole of his secondary years. But the at only is an option if there is a space and you have an EHCP. I would not give up on this and take it to tribunal if you have to.

I am sorry, having a child with complex Sen, and accessing support that ‘should’ be obvious - in main stream- is a very arduous and bureaucratic endeavour. Join a local Sen advocacy group if you have one in your locality, if you have one.

If you have a different experience you are very lucky.

First things first, meet with the Senco.
Join advocacy group.
Keep going with the EHCP process to give yourself options.

Ok, so based on working with lots of children very similar the accommodations that we would start with were:

1. No homework in any subject to start with and then building up to Core subjects only by the end of Year 7, this takes the pressure of both him and you at home. (some of our students don't do a language or have a lighter timetable and they do the homework in this lesson.

1. Supervised breaktimes to start (in the SEN hub), and there will likely be others similar here for him to make friends with, he would also get support in making friends etc.

1. Support with changing of routines (e.g. our students had social stories about covid testing)

We have a few students with selective mutism who need very little actual support aside from making sure that they are sat with people that they can speak to - or always grouped in a three or a four so they don't have to participate in a discussion in case they feel they can.

Visits to the school beforehand (this might be implicated due to COVID) but something that may help him, our high level SEN children do at least 5-10 days in school getting used to it in the summer term.

If you need any help after or before the meeting feel free to PM me.

Under these conditions it's not so uncommon to ease the return to school, but in a place where your son thrives he shouldn't need to be on a reduced timetable. I worry that it can be a slippery slope towards being told that the school can't cater for his needs, so as you rightly suggest, he really needs his EHCP to be allocated a suitable school for secondary. I do think the specialist schools I know are built for exactly the needs your boy presents. The staff ratio will allow for much more time to allow him to feel comfortable and a greater amount of time will be allocated to social skills pitched more specifically to his needs.

Tbh I don't think mainstream secondary school is right for him....push for the ehcp and then look at SEN schools

I am a primary senco, but I have also worked in sen provision at secondaries in the past.

One key difference that secondary tend to offer is some kind of safe space for children such as your son to socialize at break and lunch. Ask if secondary have something like this. They may also have or be able to begin a homework club, which would allow him to do homework after school but in school, which often eliminates the "school is for school" thing. If he wouldn't cope with longer days or they don't have a club, ask about homework exemption.

If he is having explosive meltdowns at school, what is relayed to you after? It's hard to advise without knowing his triggers, but I get the feeling you're not being kept in the loop. if they had done ABC charts, you might know what was triggering him.

To be honest (sorry, the wording sounds cruel but I do mean if from kindness), he sounds expensive to have at secondary, so they will be very motivated to get him the EHCP (more than the primary). Is the secondary SENCo aware of the situation with the EHCP? They may be able to get involved, though this varies by county.

Just to clarify, is he Y5 or Y6? And when you say selective mute, does he speak at all in school? Or is the mutism only in specific circumstances?

He sounds quite similar to my DD. She had an EHCP in time for Year 7 and lasted one term. We are now looking for a special school and are appealing the placement.

I think that you would be better off looking for a specialist setting for the long term. One that encourages the child to take GCSEs but also has therapeutic input.

Our view was that if she couldn't cope in year 7 then it's not going to get any better.

@sd249 that’s very helpful thank you . I’ve made a note of your username in case I need to PM for more advice

@Onceuponamidnight I agree with you. I am having serious doubts about MS for him but I am tied with no EHCP. Our local authority refused to assess him in spite of multi agency approach trying to support him .

@amy85 I agree

@Solidaritea they do have a designated break and work area for SEN children but when I asked how he could access it , they were a bit vague and mentioned it’s based on high need so I’m unsure if he will be permitted to go there but I’ve noted to check .

It is very difficult to work out what is triggering him as he is unable to recognise his own feelings and why he is feeling a certain way. He just explodes and we have to pick apart his day to try and work it out.

If lea have refused to assess, have they refused echp?

@Solidaritea I agree he may well be expensive

@FlipFlapFlop1980 ideally this is what I would want but currently it is not an option as he has no EHCP

@Hankunamatata I am not at that stage yet . My appeal is to get them to assess .

I'm wondering if a special school would meet his needs most effectively. SaLT ( speech and language therapy) would be regular and the timetable would be built around communication, with regular sessions of structured interaction with peers. A good range of assisted technology for communication would be well-understood by staff and there would be therapists and specialists calling in frequently.. There would be sensory rooms for pupils to go to in order to chill after feeling agitated. Of course, class size would be small - maybe ten - with high levels of staff support.

All staff working in special schools would be trained in de-escalation techniques and the correct ways to physically guide learners to a safe place, if they are throwing things or risking injuring themselves or others.

Melt-downs are at home at the moment, but if these were to start happening during the school day, you would be happier knowing that all staff have the training to help and calm.

I do think that the average or above academic functioning may make a special school seem less obvious as a choice, but you are describing a range of behaviours and, during the early teens and hormonal changes, anxiety can increase, before calming down.

DD1 has ASD. Is she selectively mute.. I'm not sure if it would be called that, as she will talk to a teacher if they make her. But she won't volunteer information and won't ask questions. She won't tell teachers she has a problem. So functionally, I think she comes close.

Things she has in place at school:
~She has an invitation to the Sen block and the school dog. She doesn't often use that now (y9) but used to.
~She has a '2 minutes early' pass, which means she can get to the hall at break time before the rush.
~She has special permission to spend break time in the hall, which is only open to a few form groups - she is an 'honorary member' of a different form group at those times, so that she can be with her friends, but school can stay Covid secure.
~She has been invited to a well-being programme (1:1 sessions)
~She has 'tutor mentoring' - she is working on targets of saying 1 good thing that happened the day before and to say something in any class in the day (it can be a comment or a question).

Aside from that, I email any teacher if she's struggling with something but can't talk to them about it. They are fantastic about responding and fixing issues discreetly.

Having said that, DD2 is very passive and would rather die than do anything that might draw attention to her, so she wouldn't be making noise/throwing, etc. That might be a tricky thing for a mainstream school to manage.

As a teacher I know of one school I’ve worked in, out of maybe 20, which would support his needs. I think he’d still find it overwhelming.

I think he’ll struggle with the sensory and social aspects so much that he will learn very little. If I were in your place, I would consider homeschooling in some way (doesn’t have to be formal schooling) until you find a small specialist setting.

@DonkeyKong2019
Sorry poor choice of words.. what I meant was recognised EP. If you pick any old person they can be disregarded. Sorry it happens. OP is not at a further on stage she just needs someone to review him in school that hasn't happened yet as he's been refused an EHCPNA. But take your point.

@lougle I’ve made a note of those adjustments to request from the SENDco.

@Greenmarmalade homeschooling is not an option as I work out of the home during the week. It is something I’ve considered but I don’t think that would be right for DS either.

Secondary SENDCo here. Do you have a local specialist school that you feel could meet his needs? Many students like your son who might find a mainstream setting difficult but are bright/progressing academically struggle to get places at specialist provision. We had a nightmare with one particular student (also ASC) as they were achieving in line with their peers, but not coping with school day to day and it was awful to see. Local specialist wouldn't take him even with an EHCP as he was so far ahead of the other students with Eng/maths etc, and it was felt that other mainstream schools would mean the same challenges so no point looking there. In the end we managed to get the student provision at a mainstream secondary with a specialist ASC unit. They are much happier (as are the parents!)

As SENDCo I would do absolutely everything possible to help your son - including supporting you with finding the best place for him if that was not my school (though obviously I would try everything possible to settle him if he were placed with me & try my best to make it work). Please speak with the secondary SENDCo as soon as you can.

Primary SENCo here. I commented on your other thread too.
What reason did the LA give for refusal to assess? You’re not going to get an EHCP before he goes to secondary school now, even if they agree to assess after Easter, and I think I said on the other thread that you’re much more likely to get them agree to assess after a term in secondary if he is not able to manage.
One think that I’ve seen, you said he was very bright but only achieving average. You’ve also said about having to ‘unpick’ his day when he comes home if he’s agitated. Could it be that you’re subconsciously putting pressure on him? He may well feel a failure if he knows you’re thinking he’s under achieving, or maybe he doesn’t think he’s a bright as you do. When he comes in from school, he may just need some breathing space and quiet. After all, he may be experiencing sensory overload throughout the day so some peace and quiet may be what he’s craving. Having a ‘meltdown’ isn’t necessarily a negative thing, if he is able to get some release from the stresses of the day this way.

I agree you need to build up a good relationship with the new Senco, try not to discuss the new school too much with your son, it may just add to his anxiety. Don’t discuss special school with him - again he may not want this but can’t articulate it. It sounds like you’re doing everything you can for him, and it’s hard when these things can take such a long time.

@Soontobe60 they refused to assess as they said he has no learning needs.

I meant I need to unpick his day with him to try to identify why he’s so upset ; this is usually done at bedtime when he’s calmer and more sad than angry . There is no talking to him when he’s angry. I take his lead and try to help him work out what has upset it , I don’t pounce on him as soon as he’s through the door

In respect of his grades , I’ve only mentioned that he’s bright but achieving average on here to outline how he is struggling. I never discuss his grades with him unless it is to praise him for good work . I tell him how proud I am of him for just even attempting something out of his comfort zone so there’s no pressure on him.