What do I do about DD?

[cantsleepforthinking]

Back history - I was in a very abusive and controlling relationship, I left nearly 3 years ago. My DD who is 20 suffered at my ex's hands - not physically but emotionally as we all did. He's not her father.

My DC and I only have each other. I left the relationship, I have been working hard on us healing, I got us counselling, but DD refused it.

She went off to uni I am on a low income so she got full assistance. I topped up her money each month for the first 2 years about £120 per month on top of which I pay for her phone every month. My income has been improving. I discovered be default that the extra money I had been sending her she's been supporting herself and her boyfriend - he get less assistance than her as his parents are very wealthy but they won't send him any extra money.

She asked me at Christmas to pay a deposit for her to go on holiday with friends- the agreement was that if I did she would get no extra cash for the rest of the year as she needs to learn to budget - she had a holiday last year, but her siblings and I couldn't due to finances. This was agreed to.

At Christmas we had a huge row. I had started to see someone fairly tentatively, a friend I'd known for a while.
She said she didn't want me to ever have another relationship again. Thought it was selfish of me to consider it. I explained that my relationship was different- I wasn't planning on getting remarried or even moving in together. It was more of a friendship and would have no impact on her life whatsoever.
She then accused me of backing off and not speaking to her very much. I explained that yes I had because I was constantly being told off by her, everything I said was wrong, that she constantly criticised what I said and did and that I felt a need to protect myself from her as I felt like I was back in a controlling relationship. She shouted at me 'Are you suggesting that I'm like X?' I said yes in someways yes. She was angry and I explained that that is how she made me feel at times. She's a very big character and when at home we all tip toe around her - have to have music off at certain times. Buy certain things she likes at the shop. Cook what she particularly likes for dinners.

We resolved the argument, I remained calm and explained to her she would always have a home, she would always come first.

All was fine, until feb - I have to leave our current home - it's too big, expensive and in the middle of nowhere. I suffer with terrible anxiety due to ex breaking in and the horrible things that happened here. So thought a move would be ideal for all of us.

I found a house, showed DD she said I was disgusting and a tramp for looking at this house. That she's never coming home that I need to apologise to her for what I said at Christmas and that I am filth.
The house was nice - I decided not to take it not due to DD. She's cross I'm not getting a house like her BF - with pool etc. I'm a single mum doing my best with no help.
She's blocked me on everything. She unblocks me to send abusive messages- which I can't read, DS reads them so I know she's ok.
I did message her to say sorry. She's not acknowledged it.
I am still paying her phone bill. I sent her money for Easter.
I have had 10-15 abusive messages in the last 48 hours - AND THEN a message last night saying she moving putting me down as guarantor and that I had better not leave her homeless.

Sorry this is long. AIBU in not reading the messages, arguing or engaging. I have had enough of them from ex. I am sick of being her whipping boy.

I have apologised on numerous occasions for what she went through with my ex. I have promised her it won't happen again.

DS says he's shocked that she would demand an apology for what said because what's she's sent to me is absolutely disgusting.

Set boundaries, do not act as a guarantor and stop enabling her to be abusive and manipulative moving forward. You can’t change the past but can work on moving forward to have a more positive and healthy relationship with each other, but only if both want to. You can’t use the financial support to coerce this, and this should just stop now as enough is enough she is independent in many ways and that financial support could better support your other children and yourself moving forward. When she is ready, and wants to build a better relationship with you, she will - and not for reasons to continue getting you to fund her own life decisions, such as getting a place with her boyfriend. Until then your role, which will serve her best in the long run, is to maintain healthy boundaries and space, and role model healthy relationships with those around you, and focus on what you can to keep progressing things in your life positively, and leave the door open to her but with clear boundaries and expectations should she wish to engage and work on the relationship with you, with the underlying right spirit and intent.

Sorry to be blunt, but you do need to assert firm boundaries with her and stick to them, and not let things spiral back to the normal dynamics as soon as she shows anything that slightly resembles an olive branch.

Tell her the financial assistance will stop unless she goes to family therapy.

Terrible advice. This is not how therapy should work. Threatening your child into therapy when they have clearly expressed that they're not ready to go there would be extremely unethical. Any therapist worth their salt would not be willing to collude in such an arrangement.

Following with interest OP. My SD (also 20) speaks to my husband in the same way and there's no history of abusive relationships in the family. You have my sympathy, this bullying is horrendous

Your DD has been damaged by the choices you made. That's the bottom line, I'm afraid. I say this as someone who grew up experiencing abuse with a mother who didn't keep me safe. We left in the end (initiated by me at 17), and over the next few years I went from seeing my mum as my closest friend to being barely able to tolerate being around her. It wasn't a conscious thing, but when I reflect back I can see that once we were away from abusive situation I had the mental space to realise that she was hugely to blame for what I had gone through. I'm sure many people will think this is unfair, but it's the way it it.
How has she learnt to communicate, to get her point across, to get a reaction? From her upbringing. And then you tell her I her face that you think she is like your ex? That is utterly appalling behaviour on your part.
Did you have happy childhood, or was that abusive too? If it's the former, then remember that you had formative years where you could develop psychologically in safety. She didn't have that chance. She is the product of your choices, OP.

exactly what ginger said.

It doesn't sound like you should be getting a new partner at the moment, as you are unable to put boundaries in place and are also unable to protect your son. There seems a strong risk of history repeating itself. Also I think out of respect to your children you should wait until they have all left home and are independent.

It would probably do her the world of good to completely break away from you for a few years, she needs to find out who she is without being abused or reliant on the parent who enabled the abuse.

Her behaviour is awful, but I do wonder if this behaviour is just limited to you.

I'm incredibly laid back and tolerant in normal life. However with my dad and step mum it took me until at least 30 before I could even think about them without a pit of anger and hatred towards them. It was honestly as if my personality completely changed in the face of people who destroyed a large portion of my childhood.

It's very hard transitioning to becoming an adult and coming to terms with what a parent, who is supposed to love and protect you unconditionally has allowed into your life, I imagine the thought of you beginning a new relationship has terrified her after her childhood.

Maybe you can find a way back to each other in a few years when she has processed it all.

She clearly has deep resentment and trauma from what you put her through. I don’t think you understand this. Your boundaries seem exceptionally poor, in particular with how you allow her brother to mediate this.

Her comments are horrendous and unacceptable, however they are coming from a place of unprocessed trauma. You have to separate them out from who she is. What you said to her is the single most disgusting thing I have ever heard. It’s beyond unacceptable in any situation but to say this to a girl who has been traumatised because her mother didn’t protect her is so bang out of order it’s unreal.

I don’t think this relationship is working like this for either of you. If I were her friend I would tell her to go no contact, start processing her trauma and avoid you because you are making it worse. And you need to start improving your life and learn to enforce these boundaries. You also need to stop exposing your son to this—again showing a lack of judgement ans vilify to protect your children.

What a hugely distressing time for you both. Here you are OP having made a brave move out of the abusive relationship only to find that things are still so difficult.

You say that you have been giving in to all DD requests to make amends and have suggested that the household revolves around her. This is the kind of behaviour that people often show towards abusers and may be what you were doing with your ex (giving into demands, apologising, backing off, etc.). I can see why you would have done this with both your ex and DD, however children need more boundaries to feel safe. They need to see that their parents can be strong and firm enough to say when enough is enough, because usually boundaries are put into place when parents are trying to keep children safe and help them learn. These actions, putting in boundaries, are therefore the actions of parents who care for and love their children.

I wonder if, in trying to make up for the past with your DD, you have inadvertently shown her that not much has changed in yourself, that you may still back off, apologise and give in when a stronger personality challenges you. I wonder if that’s why she is so fearful of a new relationship. How will you cope if you keep ‘being a doormat’? How would she? She may be worried about you both as well as hurt about the past, as pp have said. Anger is, after all, often the bodyguard of anxiety and hurt.

Perhaps to make tracks in your relationship you need to do something different. Don’t give in, back off, walk on eggshells around her. Start putting in boundaries firmly, but lovingly and with plenty of warm communication. Show her that you are strong enough to stand up for yourself and protect those you love. She may start to feel more confident in your recovery from the past, which in turn, may help her anxiety level come down.

Also people who said the maximum grant is enough to comfortably life off: you’re talking bollocks, especially in an expensive area like London or Oxford. It’s enough with a job and if you can go home for holidays. And when you’re private renting, you do need a guarantor. So telling OP to cut these off is telling her to push her child to drop out of uni, especially as part time uni work is so hard to get at the moment. After the difficulties of her childhood, ensuring she can at least get an education is the least you can do. Phone etc are unnecessary, but a monthly sum and guarantor should be continued.

Also, I think if you enforced some boundaries with her here she would feel much better in the medium term. I imgiane she has a lot of guilt about moving out to uni, worried that you are vulnerable and about to be victimised again. Your passive behaviour and lack of protection of your son is enforcing this fear, plus your new relationship has set all the red lights flashing.

Because of the abuse as a child she is probably far younger than her years in social development, while also feeling responsibilities beyond her years. If you can grow up and be a parent here it will make her feel infinitely safer.

I agree with PPs that putting in boundaries, although initially difficult, is the answer.

Her BF is not getting funded and your funding is inadvertedly funding him. You are not wealthy and this is not right.

Your DD did not like you getting abused but she has by default become the abuser. She thinks you are a doormat but when you step out of this role, she abuses you. This is unacceptable. She refused counselling so she has to accept some responsibility.

You cannot live with the guilt of being in the awful relationship forever - we all choose how to live our future lives but she seems to have a foot firmly in the past to punish you.

Stop paying for the phone, stop sending money - and do not be the guarantor - you cannot afford to be made homeless when she defaults - which she will as I think she is going to try and punish you more.

Perhaps compose a letter regarding what you are doing and explain that you can no longer afford the expenditure and hope that as she is now an independent adult with no dependents she will be able to manage her finances as such.

As much as your ex was awful, and you stayed whilst he was like this, her behaviour is not right and she should not treat you like this, OP.

I’m so sorry you’re going through this, it must be heartbreaking.whilst I do not condone her behaviour and people saying she’s an adult, she is 20, which means her prefrontal cortex and frontal lobes of her Brian are not fully yet developed yet and they don’t until mid 20’s- These are parts of your brain affects behaviour and balancing emotions amounts other stuff. Being subject to abuse/ trauma at an early stage can change the way these develop too, for the worst. So whilst a lot of people are saying ‘she’s bullying/ abusing’ - she probably hasn’t got a fully developed, healthy working brain to be able to act any differently. Yes she needs therapy, she will not be able to get over this herself.

This is copied from a site about the brain development and abuse/ neglect -Children who have experienced abuse and neglect are therefore at increased risk for a number of problematic developmental, health, and mental health outcomes, including learning problems (e.g., problems with inattention and deficits in executive functions), problems relating to peers (e.g., peer rejection), internalizing symptoms (e.g., depression, anxiety), externalizing symptoms (e.g., oppositional defiant disorder, conduct disorder, aggression), and posttraumatic stress disorder (PTSD). As adults, these children continue to show increased risk for psychiatric disorders, substance use, serious medical illnesses, and lower economic productivity.

Whilst I know that paragraph is about children, it also relates to teenagers because they simply do not have that part of the brain developed yet.

It might be worth just looking up what abuse does to your brain before your frontal lobes/ precortex has developed. It might give you a better understand of why she is the way she is. Don't get me wrong, it’s not on how she is acting and my heart feels for you, but whilst people are judging her, it might be worth looking a bit deeper.

Oh bless you this sounds so awful. What a horrible time both of you have been through. However, she is now abusing you like your ex did. Send her one message clearly saying if she continues to abuse you then you will not send her one more penny and if she does it again stick to it.

Many thanks for all your messages. I have read and reread them all.
It's a very difficult situation to be in and we are both hurting a lot through this.

I have received a number of abusive messages today and she has rung me and left messages.

I've done as many suggested, I've told her no more to the abuse. I've said I will support her by paying for counselling.
I've told her no more to the barrage of texts.
I've told her o won't look at what she's sent as don't think that will help either of us.
She's not been reading my messages and her anger has built and built. She's apologised and has now read what I had said.
The worst thing is she thought I had not reached out to her in the last month - but that was because she'd blocked me.
She can now see I have.

We have tentatively trying to speak. It's early days. But I will stand strong.

This has given me more of an opportunity to look at all of my Children and what I want our relationships to be like.
All of which need work and improving.

So I take from this a positive. We will all use it to get better relationships, to heal and do better. Particularly me.

So many thanks for all of your help. Even those who were harsh. It needed saying and I have listened.

@MiddleParking

I suspect this story could sound very different from her perspective. It’s not at all okay for her to be abusive to you but I think you are unreasonable to say things like you’re not engaging with her messages because ‘you’ve had enough of them from ex’. I really wouldn’t see it like that if I had been abused by a boyfriend my mother chose. And pulling back from her at the same time as getting a new boyfriend that she’s upset about...I’m not saying her behaviour is okay, but it definitely sounds like there could be a very different side to this story.

My first thoughts too. Op bad relationship choices have damaged this girl and made her very angry and so many people advising to just cut her off?? Not helpful

@Skatastic

Oh bless you this sounds so awful. What a horrible time both of you have been through. However, she is now abusing you like your ex did. Send her one message clearly saying if she continues to abuse you then you will not send her one more penny and if she does it again stick to it.

She is “abusing” her mother as it’s learnt behaviour. Her mother allowed a man into their home to do that. Why is this site all about giving a woman a free pass when they’ve allowed their kids to be around this shit???

She is “abusing” her mother as it’s learnt behaviour. Her mother allowed a man into their home to do that. Why is this site all about giving a woman a free pass when they’ve allowed their kids to be around this shit???

This. Fully appreciate OP has had a tough situation but her daughter is a victim too and clearly massively traumatised by what she was forced to go through. She may be 20 now but we have no idea how old she was during the abuse and how long it went on for.

@Skatastic

Oh bless you this sounds so awful. What a horrible time both of you have been through. However, she is now abusing you like your ex did. Send her one message clearly saying if she continues to abuse you then you will not send her one more penny and if she does it again stick to it.

Let's rewrite this, shall we? "Your behaviour towards me is what you learned from a man that I brought into your life, that you had no choice but to live with and take the abuse that he dished out. Well, missy, now you are an adult at 20, I expect you to treat me with the respect I deserve as your mother and until you do this, I'm going to banjax your chance of finishing your education and forging a better life for yourself out of the ashes of your appalling childhood (that I was responsible for".

@ILoveSlipperss

Having an abusive upbringing doesn’t give your daughter the right to be abusive little bitch. Stop being a pushover, stop saying sorry and stop sending her money. Give you time and money to her siblings, it’s not exactly fair she’s getting everything is it? Then acting like a total brat. And for goodness sake DO NOT be her guarantor, she sounds spoilt and irresponsible. If my daughter EVER treated me like that even once I’d tell her to fuck right off until she learnt some god damn respect

This.

I saw my mother abused as a child - doesn't mean I grew up thinking "Yeah, i'll do the same! No bother."

I've been the daughter in this scenario. Infact, what you describe is exactly how my mother would describe. My mum would pay for things all the time and said she tiptoed around me. She also would say that my sister was so much calmer and I would come along and wind people up. She compared my sister and I all the time.

Basically. You're her mum. You're meant to be the adult in this situation. Yes, I agree, stop paying for things like her phone. Set boundaries. But you have a role to play in her behaviour. She's hurting deeply without a doubt and she needs help. Apologizing is all well and good, but there's no point doing that if your behaviour doesn't change.

@ZiggyBaby the moment the OP told her daughter that she was like her abuser was the point of no return. Many people on this thread have told the OP that she's making this all about her. She's talked about her other DCs too who don't behave the same way as her DD. Well as you're testament to, children react in different ways to situations such as this, but they'll all be damaged in one way or another.