To really feel for the team at AZ

[andweallsingalong]

AFAIK AZ are the only company in the world to have produced a covid vaccine at cost. Their product is far cheaper than equivalent products, which benefits all of us.

They launched very quickly and it seems put in some extremely long hours, even over Christmas to get the job done. No doubt putting in similar long hours to fix teething problems beyond their control.

They've produced millions of doses of vaccine with no profit and continue to do so making a massive difference globally to the pandemic. They've set up manufacturing plants in other countries in partnership with local agencies, when it would no doubt have been easier to stay local with people who know their processes and are close by in case of teething problems.

Absolute legends in my book, each and every person involved.

Yet, instead of saying "Thanks, you're so much cheaper this will make a huge difference to our economy. We'll pay what's asked and trust you'll reinvest if it comes in cheaper than expected." Some countries haggled over price - whilst paying several times more for comparable products.

Every day there's someone having a go in the press.

I just think if I had worked my ass of to produce a viable vaccine, at cost, made it available globally. No matter what the teething problems with some of the factories if I had all the flack they're getting I'd be wondering if it was worth it!

It really pisses me off, I too work in research for big pharma and the amount of crap spouted by the general public about us is ridiculous. I don't know a single colleague who went into this job for money. They are all amazing dedicated people working their socks off to make a difference and improve lives. Its insulting and depressing and this negative attitude will result in putting people off working in research in the future.
The furore over AZ is entirely political game playing. Politicians trying to save face instead of thinking about the greater good. The Pfizer jab is a US/German effort so both the US and EU will be keen to claim the credit for that one. Screw global humanity as long as the politicians look good eh? This is what happens when you have a bunch of self serving narcissists in control of distribution

@Takemetothebar

Yanbu. Though it must be said, those of us who work in big Pharma are quite used to being demonised by the public. It’s situation normal, from the “fact” that we have the cure for cancer but prefer not to publish, to the “fact” that we intentionally make people ill to sell more drugs.

God I hate this so much. Also work in biotech, my daughter is at Pfizer. The amount of shite she sees on facebook about scientists being power hungry, money hungry demons who want to poison the public for their own gain is astronomical. People have absolutely no idea what we do.

@Fluffycloudland77

I genuinely think that if a company developed a vaccine for all cancers people wouldn’t take it.

The hpv vaccine met with resistance.

When you think the first inoculations were a scratch on your arm and some cow pox pus smeared into it 🤦🏻‍♀️ & people did it because it was better than catching small pox.

I know, we've seen massive regression. Everyone and their dog seems to think they're qualified to talk science based on something they read on Facebook, completely ignoring the fact it takes most actual scientists 4 years of full time education, then years and years of research and experience to have up to date knowledge. It's not as simple as mRNA sounds like DNA and DNA change bad!

I despair at how little trust the public have in the scientific community. I think it stems from a superiority complex and an unwillingness to concede that there are people vastly more knowledgeable and experienced than they are. And that trusting the judgement of the experts is not being a sheep, it's acknowledging that their knowledge and experience of this topic far outstrips your own, assessing their credibility and accepting their expertise.

Tbh (as shown by the actual vaccine takeup rates so far), it's a small but very vocal minority of Dunning-Kruger sufferers.

I know right? It's such an amazing success story, the stats are fabulous, and has such a huge role to play and yet constant negative press. Interesting theory about the money. I absolutely ❤️ astrazeneca and thank them from the bottom of my heart. So glad to see the Spanish are queuing up enthusiastically for it again.

I work in an industry that works with AZ, they're a good company. I'd say this is definitely a case of no good deed goes unpunished.

I had the AZ vaccine last weekend. I was (and still am) very grateful for it.

YANBU, OP. I agree.

If you do something because you want applause and praise then you are doing it for the wrong reason.

The latest US-led tests show it as 100% effective in preventing death in the control group. 100%. That means if you have an AZ jab you are overwhelmingly unlikely to die of COVID. And we are being offered it for free, according to need. I genuinely don’t get what there is to complain about re AZ.

Yanbu. It's ridiculous. I've seen people post on mumsnet. "In my country they are vaccinating teachers early, but we are only getting Astra zeneca" Then a bloody sad face!
I read Le Monde newspaper and have always thought it was a great newspaper but all they do recently is criticise bloody Astra Zeneca. It's put me off the paper.

YANBU. I have a research background myself (but not science) and I look at what they’ve achieved and think bloody hell, that amount of flack for creating our ticket out of this hell. As a PP said upthread, no good deed goes unpunished.

I’ve had the AZ vaccine and feel so lucky and grateful.

@sjfjsnfkdhsbd

If you do something because you want applause and praise then you are doing it for the wrong reason.

yeah but if the options are actually: 1) do something because you want applause and praise and a shit ton of money; or 2) do something because you want applause and praise

option 2 would seem preferable.

And I do think there’s a great deal of ill feeling towards the U.K. post-Brexit. I’m thoroughly pro-EU but think Brexit plus Boris’s general ineptitude and arrogance doesn’t help matters. Not that the Astra Zeneca scientists should be coming under fire because of this at all, but I think it plays a role.

It’s not just AZ. The trials are run by Oxford uni in partnership with the MRA. Loads of nhs staff are participants ( including me), in addition to lots of other volunteers too of course.
The people I know working on the trial and colleague volunteers for it are all watching agog at the EU’s antics. It’s rather depressing!
Would I volunteer again? Hmm not sure...
Same as I would think twice if I did something nice for my kids and they just complained!
But I am very very glad that the vaccine works and it is saving lives here in the U.K. and elsewhere.
Amid all the noise and ridiculous drama that is actually the most important thing

@sjfjsnfkdhsbd I agree with you, but I'm not talking about a lack of praise, I'm sad for them doing something amazing and in return getting an utter pasting on a regular basis. Doesn't seem right to me and I feel particularly sorry for all the staff who worked long hours, particularly over Christmas, reading it all.

I have thought this, especially after Dr Fauci made his recent statement re: the data. Just fucking ridiculous. There’s got to be an ulterior motive because no other vaccine supplier is getting trashed in the same way.

I’d be happy to have the AZ when it’s time.

And just to point out us trial volunteers have done it for free. Not paid a single penny not even for expenses and it has taken hours and hours of time if I added it all up. And it’s not over until June!

There’s another thread proving this point

The level of animosity towards anything U.K. / pharma (esp both) is extreme

It’s an odd side effect of working vaccines that we should all be so relieved to have

Not long ago we weren’t sure we’d have them

That other thread was started by a vitriolic poster and has made me see red. The sheer venom in it is scary.

I had it and I'm grateful , and so are many of us , they are never going to please people who want to make a massive profit .

AZ is being sold at 2.50 Euros cost price per dose. Pfizer at 16.50 Euros per dose!
As you say no good deed goes unpunished!

It is worth remembering ( EU spite aside) that there will also be billions of people like me that will cry with relief when they finally get their AZ vaccine and see them for the heroes they actually are.

All over the world, people will be grateful and humble to get their life saving vaccines, and when they finally hug their Grandmothers and kiss their children and save their livelihoods from disaster they will know it was thanks to the AZ vaccine.

AZ will come good. The EU Commission have waged a dirty war but most people know the truth, and the personal impact as each one is delivered will mean far more than Merkel/Macron's nasty words.

@sjfjsnfkdhsbd

If you do something because you want applause and praise then you are doing it for the wrong reason.

I feel I speak for many of my fellow ex pharma scientists when I say that we would be happy with freedom from abuse.