To ask if free school meals should be abolished?

[SphJC]

As above^

I have my own opinion on this but keen to hear others before I share my own.

@Zig4zag as a foster carer myself I know that the system is not there to shore up poverty. Children are not taken into care because their parents are poor. We don't have enough foster carers as it is and I cannot even begin to imagine how a social worker would convince a judge that removal of a child because the parents are poor would be in the child's best interest. Your attitude stinks and you clearly know nothing about the costs of removal or fostering (way more than a free school meal per day per child).

Poverty does not make people poor parents.

I think it should be means tested to include low income working families too. I’m worse off in work than on benefits when I include all the perks like FSM and council tax benefit. I’d never give work up though.

Loving the birth control message(s). Yep, when dd was conceived, I totally knew that I would suddenly realise how dangerous her dad was and have to run for my life.

No absolutely not. The children who get them need them for a reason.

This is a very sad thread. Im sure parents hate the thought of their kids having FSM but some aren’t afforded that luxury. When I was younger living with DH, he was unemployed for a couple of months I wasn’t hardly anything but too much to claim. Some days we lived off 60p a day. I can’t imagine having kids in that situation but for some it’s reality.

How low do you have to be to begrudge a child a free meal when parents can’t afford it

the government is failing individual families on a huge level - not just the very poorest but often families who are on what would have been considered a very liveable income for the typical 2 adults/2 children family up to 15-20 years ago

I don’t think it’s the governments fault at all. Adults are free to make their own choices in life and to understand the impact that it will have on their budget at the time and in the future should things change. We all know nothing in life is guaranteed.

I don’t think our current system helps though, it doesn’t really encourage personal responsibility.

I think maybe if you earn so much per year no free meals for all kids regardless. I think the do it for everyone up to year 2 now? But of course free school meals for children who's family earns under a certain budget. They are a life line for some children.

Yes because no parent should be so poor that they can't feed their children. The levels of poverty in the UK are shameful.
No because unfortunately there is real grinding poverty in the UK and some children would go hungry without fsm.

@WhiteSquare so true! I remember in primary school I didn’t really know why I got a free ticket (I don’t know how other schools worked it but in my school, kids who were on free meals got a ticket that they would give to the dinner lady instead of money) but I just took the ticket and got a tasty meal each day. When I got to high school, the judgement was real. It was incredibly embarrassing. Kids can be so horrible.

Actually most families prioritise their children ken

Of course some don’t but most do.

No certainly not! It’s the difference between some children staving or getting a hot meal, I’m really not interested in other peoples shitty comment either saying the parents get enough benefits to feed there kids, unfortunately bad stuff happens kids get neglected and go hungry so no Yabu

I don't even know wealthy families with 5 children. Of course you're going to be poor if you have 5 children and, a low income.

Plenty of them in the media. The circumstances where a family has more children than they can afford is usually not as simple as you imagine it is either.

It's amazing the number of people who think the parents of poorer children are feckless, don't know anything about contraception, have never had a job / can't hold down a job and have several children with different partners. And ye olde 'you shouldn't of had kids if you can't afford them' (sic).

It never crosses their narrow minds that even in carefully planned lives circumstances can suddenly & unexpectedly change. Surely the current situation has taught us that?

@IceCreamAndCandyfloss

the government is failing individual families on a huge level - not just the very poorest but often families who are on what would have been considered a very liveable income for the typical 2 adults/2 children family up to 15-20 years ago

I don’t think it’s the governments fault at all. Adults are free to make their own choices in life and to understand the impact that it will have on their budget at the time and in the future should things change. We all know nothing in life is guaranteed.

I don’t think our current system helps though, it doesn’t really encourage personal responsibility.

@IceCreamAndCandyfloss I don’t want to be mean, but your post comes off quite narrow minded.

You imply that we should budget for things that may happen in the future. Are you telling me that I (a band 2 NHS post) should avoid having a baby because should my DP suddenly die, I couldn’t afford to raise a family on my own rubbish wage? I think that’s an appalling outlook. Your post implies only the wealthy should have children.

No. I’m well off now and to be frank can buy whatever the fuck I want but in my late teens I had to claim benefits for a bit due to being in a bit of a pickle with my mental health. I don’t care if my taxes go towards food for children whose parents could prob afford it as long as no child whose parents are struggling goes without.

I would like to see high quality meals available for free for all children in an ideal world, we know that being hungry can have a negative impact on ability to learn. In an ideal world I would extend that to breakfast being available to all too.

But we certainly shouldn’t even dream of taking away FSM. Even if the reason they are needed is poor parenting (which in the vast majority of cases it isn’t) then it isn’t the fault of the child anyway

ikll

I agree but I also feel the attitude that the children who receive FSM are starving Dickensian urchins a bit patronising if I am honest.

In my experience, without FSM, most would continue to have lunch, because their parents would go without if needs be.

It is good they don’t have to.

But MN also has a tendency to assume all children who receive FSM are from chaotic, drug ridden households. They aren’t.

@bp300 I live in an area of them and it occurred to me I actually know one quite well....

Incidentally the 2020 birthrate has been very low and as I suspect you want a state pension/other benefits plus things like a health services when you are retire you don't want it this low.

@bp300 that is large wealthy families.

For who? All infants get free lunches. Do you mean that? Or the children who get free lunches because their parents are low earners? No they shouldn’t be stopped.

Dd gets free lunches being an infant. we pay for DS’s school lunches. Costs us nearly £59 a month.

Whilst I definitely don’t think they should be got rid of. I do think that the system is a little unfair on occasion. I know a child who had free lunches but the lunches weren’t enough for her large appetite so her mother would send her with extra money for more food! So if the mother could afford to do that maybe she shouldn’t be entitled to free lunches.

What is the point of universal infant FSM? My DD gets these, but we definitely don't need them as a family.

If they were scrapped, could the threshold for means tested FSM be increased enough to make a difference?

No - aren't they the only decent meals some children get?

@Arbadacarba

No - aren't they the only decent meals some children get?

In some very rare cases yes.

Mostly though poor parents buy food and give it to their children, strange, isn’t it? Almost like they love them.

I bet bp300 volunteers in a food bank so that they can make themselves feel morally superior to the feckless poor.

As others have said i would support the expansion of a decent nutritional prepared on site not for profit lunch for all children- year R to 19 college.

If we can afford to pointlessly buy more nuclear warheads we can afford to feed our kids at school everyday without fail.

Politics IMO doesn't have a place in this argument - like I say- it's basic common sense.

I don't buy the whole "it's the parents responsibility" argument. It's not about the money it's about the children.