To wonder when this somehow became acceptable and how we can change it?

[Fvje]

I had this experience today, and it made me reflect on all the recent news coverage about attitudes to women, and wonder has it always been like this? And how do we stop it?

What happened was I went to the petrol station for some diesel and to put some air in my tyres.

I had to wait for the air, as there was a lady in front of me. No problem. A bloke drives up, past my car, to try and go into the space, as lady is reversing. I say 'excuse me, I'm already waiting' and go in front of him.

These things happen, it wasn't a problem. I wasn't angry, I just asserted I was next. I thought that was that.

But instead he started shouting at me, swearing about how would he know I was waiting, that I was a stupid fucking woman waiting in the wrong fucking place. His face was red and contorted with anger. All because I'd dared to challenge him.

I asked if he thought it necessary or appropriate to speak like that, if he thought I should have just waited mutely and let him go in front. And he shouted and ranted that yes it was and yes I should.

I wasn't scared. I wasn't even that surprised. I was sad that he felt he had the right to speak to me like that, and also that 3 other people nearby who could all hear him ranting didn't in any way intervene (because I know if I heard a man shouting at a woman like that, I certainly wouldn't have stood silently by).

When did this become accepted? How do we stop men feeling entitled to act like this, and worse? I appreciate this is in the grand scheme of things no big deal but it's kind of like the tip of the iceberg.

Firstly,sorry that some angry man had a go,all too familiar. Hope you’re ok
I don’t think we all think it’s acceptable, but I think in the moment there’s a dynamic risk assessment.
If I intervene will he get more agitated
Will it make it worse
Often people will keep an eye from a distance see how it pans out
I think there’s a judgement and safety issue about any intervention

Luckily I'm fine. Depressingly I think I may be so used to stuff like this it doesn't upset me.

He was an an older bloke, late 50s or early 60s, average height and build. I didn't feel physically threatened or intimidated thankfully.

I just couldn't believe how angry he was, about something that was so minor, and which was a simple misunderstanding.

He sounds ghastly and obviously it’s a disproportionate response,so angry

Yes I have noticed this more and more op. I’m in my 40s and people just seem so much more angry than they used to be. A lot of people seem constantly on the verge of having a meltdown and nobody admits they are wrong, especially when driving!

Are you sure it's not lockdown making people angry at small stuff..?

To be fair, I’ve witnessed women kicking off fairly frequently too.

I agree it wasn't necessarily because he is male and you are female; just that he was one of the 'entitled' people.
It is sad that some (more and more seemingly) people in our society have a 'me first' attitude.

I think male privilege consolidates over a man's lifetime so by the time they're late 50's they've had years of striding through with women coming second and scurrying out of the way.
By the time a woman reaches middle age she's had a lifetime of scurrying out of the way and is not prepared to do it anymore. I think this enrages men more as we're no longer "hot" so have literally no value.
I've had many similar experiences to the one you describe OP. It's not acceptable and never has been.

I would have taken the registration of his car, and possibly video footage of his rant and/or a photo of him if I felt safe to do so, and reported him to the police. I would also make clear where this happened for CCTV footage.

I have done this before - I know the police get a bad rap for not dealing with these things but on the most recent occasion the police couldn’t have been better. I had been threatened in a car park because a man blocked me in and I told him he was an idiot, so he chased after me and threatened me. They not only sent officers to his house to warn him (I don’t know if a formal caution was given) but also came to my house to get a statement and reassure me that it was being taken seriously. They said that this would also go on record for if it happened again.

Having spoken to the police about a different matter that had the potential to escalate, they said that as soon as there is threatening behaviour call 999.

On other occasions where the police haven’t been able to do anything, they’ve still logged it because it gives a pattern of behaviour.

It’s a pain but report, report, report.

As for why it happens, I suspect there is a group of men who are angry at everything, and they see women as “lesser” and therefore an easy outlet for their rage. Like all bullies, they try to make their sad little lives better by picking on someone else - problem is, women are increasingly not accepting that shit, which makes them even more resentful and angry.

Many people just seem to be simmering most of the time, entitled driving behaviour and queue jumping etc, etc

Well done for challenging him, I would have done the same

Some people must have a really tricky life behaving like this all the time

People act like this because they know they will get away with it. For every time someone like you have (rightly) called this man out there will another 100 times he has got away with it.

I don’t know what the solution is but it is bloody depressing to live in a world with people like this.

People act like this because they know they will get away with it
No,not necessarily. They act like that because it’s their demeanour,their habitual pattern of behaviour. I’m not sure it’s under voluntary control. I think there’s a trigger...and BOOM off they go

@HeelsHandbagPerfumeCoffee

People act like this because they know they will get away with it No,not necessarily. They act like that because it’s their demeanour,their habitual pattern of behaviour. I’m not sure it’s under voluntary control. I think there’s a trigger...and BOOM off they go

I agree, some people just flip when they get confronted about anything.

My DH once politely confronted a guy who had repeatedly been parking in our buildings private parking spaces. The guy got so angry! He tried to open DH car door several times (DH was still in the car), then pretended he hurt himself to lure DH out of the car. When that did not work he left and never came back. No idea what he thought he could achieve with the outburst.

Sorry that happened to you OP.

Sadly I think a lot of men simply hate women. That hate and anger comes from feeling inadequate in some way and wanting to vent, women are an easy target.

Happy people, confident in themselves, don't act that way.

I think people's behaviour (men's and women's) in general has got much worse over the last year.

I've worked in my current job (public facing) for over 20 years and this is the first year ever we've had to employ a security guard and wear body-cams and attack alarms.

@DanielRicciardosSmile I agree

I'm quite amazed by how angry people are over nothing, there is so much rage!

I'm sure lockdown has made it worse, but tbh people were pretty unpleasant beforehand too.

Sorry you experienced this today

I’ve somewhat resigned myself to getting hit some day, by a random furious man. Unless I have my DD with me, I tend to hold my own in these altercations. I just got so sick of it.

Two memorable ones from 2019:

I said to him (ranting purple man-toddler) who had smacked my car with his hand, for the crime of driving too near him, at 2km/hr on an actual road- ‘Boy, you must be a real joy to live with, if you’re this outta control in public?’. His female partner looked shocked, then laughed and said ‘Spot on!’. To his (tiny) credit, he looked ashamed and shut up. Stuck his hands in his pockets and slumped off.

Another one was when I intervened at my local (small) supermarket. Purple shouty man (30’s) was tearing strips off a staff member, for some tiny imagined offence. Using sexist and racist words, knowing she couldn’t answer back at work. I took my phone out and pretended to film him. When he turned on me....seamlessly on the sexist rant, but I’m white so he dropped the racist bit... I calmly said ‘When I saw who you were, I knew your Mum would want to see this for herself.’ He went grey and sweat beads rose before our eyes. He practically ran out of the shop. Of course, I had no idea who he was. Only works when you’re willing to bet he still has a mum. Plus I usually use my own Mum voice to speak to them. The combo seems to work. I figure if I get it wrong, I’ve still changed the subject and the dynamic of the moment, which is sometimes enough. If they start ranting about me being a mad woman, I can take it. Mad middle aged women are scary. Or at least discombobulating! It’s our superpower.

Not strategies I’d try somewhere without a lot of witnesses around though...

@OhamIreally

I think male privilege consolidates over a man's lifetime so by the time they're late 50's they've had years of striding through with women coming second and scurrying out of the way. By the time a woman reaches middle age she's had a lifetime of scurrying out of the way and is not prepared to do it anymore. I think this enrages men more as we're no longer "hot" so have literally no value. I've had many similar experiences to the one you describe OP. It's not acceptable and never has been.

This. Our corresponding lack of value coincides with loss of oestrogen which leads to more not giving a fuck moments. So we take less bullshit at the exact time that people want to hand us more of it. And while it can happen to anyone, I do think middle aged women are particular targets. Sounds like you handled it brilliantly OP. Sorry it happened though.

I don't think it's new

I think I might have seen more as a teen or in my 20s. Perhaps they thought I'd be more likely to back down? I don't think being small helps.

I've had it happen to me where a man blocked my car in, demanded I wound my window down and shouted and screamed at me.
If my partner was in the car, or was the one driving he would never have acted like that. He did it because I am a woman and I couldn't escape, he knew he was bigger and stronger than me and I couldn't drag him out the car and batter him. He knew he was the one with the power, not me.

I think this has always happened, but previously women didn't challenge, we let them go in first, or we backed down.

Continue to challenge OP and continue to fight for change.

What a dickhead

In a similarish vein I remember driving to work some time ago and a car pulled out in front of me when I was on a roundabout. I tooted my horn, as a warning. He came off the roundabout onto the road and was in the next lane mouthing obscenities at me and blasting his horn and giving me the finger. I mean?....I was OK but so shocked that after HIM being clearly in the wrong he thought it was OK to do that? And I thought at the time if I was a man or had a man with me he wouldn’t have done that

I don't drive any more but there seems to be particular aggro with that

A friend with blonde hair stuffs it into a hat for every drive. Started more than 20 years ago.

Another friend drove a vintage car she'd repaired herself and got men telling her she "shouldn't be driving that, it's a man's car".

I think it’s never been acceptable. It never can be. I’m not good at letting things like that go, so would have to have told him that I thought his behaviour was inappropriate. I find the word silly can be quite deflating.

I had a man shout at me and called me a ‘fcking c**t’ for briefly parking in a way that slightly inconvenienced him. Yes it was a mistake on my part and I hadn’t realised it would make it slightly harder (but by no means impossible) for him to get out of his space but in that situation I would probably roll my eyes to myself at someone else’s thoughtlessness rather than go on a full on sweary rampage. I wonder what it’s like to be some who is so angry and rude that they blow up at that kind of situation, life must be so stressful surely?