Disgusted By Dentists Behaviour!!!

[Windchangeface]

We moved home week before the pandemic and then non of the dentists were taking on patients.

This made me very nervous, I kept an eye out to jump as soon as they opened up.

Well...as of a few weeks ago 3/5 practises within a 15 mile radius of us put up notices on their websites ‘taking on new patients’ great I rang to register me, DH and small DS. But oh no, they aren’t taking on any NHS patients only private or Denplan! (Would cost us a minimum of £50 per month and I’m currently pregnant so should be free anyway). The receptionists at all 3 massively tried to sell me Denplan and actually made me feel like a total sponge for asking about NHS.

‘Most families prefer Denplan’ erm sorry Shannon but I highly doubt ‘most’ families prefer to spend £50+ per month on something that should be £20 a visit for them and free for their kids!

One of the receptionists even told me (in a very snooty tone) ‘no we aren’t taking NHS patients we’ve got enough of those) another stated ‘we’ve met our quota for NHS so are only taking paying patients’.

Given DH is a Dr who spends all day looking after hospital patients free of charge I’m at a loss to understand why dentists feel they’re above the NHS.

Horrible, elitist attitude excluding people who can’t afford to pay from adequate healthcare and forcing those who can to pay high premiums they shouldn’t have to!

@NanFlanders

I really don't like the flak the OP is getting. I think NHS dental services should be available to and accessed by all - similarly GPs, state education and SureStart Centres. Higher rate taxpayers pay additional contributions, and NHS dental and prescription charges, so it's not like they are getting stuff for free. I also think that the standard of social provision rises if the middle class are users of it, as they are more likely to have the confidence and clout to demand a good service - services for poor people tend to be poor services. And we might not all have the same income, but it helps build a cohesive society if we are all, at some point in our lives, in the same nurseries, schools and hospitals.

I think this is a good point. It would involve increasing taxes though. Personally I would be happy to pay much higher taxes if it meant state funded services as you mention. This is how some Scandinavian countries operate I believe. The only issue we have I suppose is high population numbers and higher rates of unemployment in comparison.

Totally agree NanFlanders

Given DH is a Dr who spends all day looking after hospital patients free of charge I’m at a loss to understand why dentists feel they’re above the NHS.

Surely if your DH is an NHS doctor then he is being paid by the taxpayer via taxes, unless he doesn't charge anybody anything and doesn't earn a salary then he is getting paid by the taxpayer.

But I don't think you should have to pay for private dentistry. You are just as entitled to NHS care as anybody else and you pay taxes so pay towards it.

Honestly I have the same issue - I moved 2.5 years ago and have struggled to get into any NHS dentists. I finally got an appointment in March 2020 (after over a year of ringing up every month) which was obviously then cancelled.

I've tried to ring up again a few times but have been told their waiting lists are now months long but was told I could get a private appointment in 2 days time. I found their attitude on the phone was very much the same as you've described.

I've ended up booking a private appointment at another dentist closer to me. I can't really afford it but I think I might need a filling and don't want to leave it to get worse.

@Holly60

I think the reason many people prefer denplan is because certain treatments, such as white fillings for example, are not available on the NHS. To be honest (and I am a massive advocate of the NHS) I feel that if one can possibly afford it, then one ought to pay for dental care, and alleviate that burden from the NHS so that it can treat those with life threatening illnesses. It’s a little like optical care - when I was young all optical care was also free on the NHS but I am more than happy to pay for it now.

I also enjoy having a choice of treatments, rather than just the basics, when it comes to my teeth so I am happy to put money into an affordable private dental plan. That’s just me though.

Thats because you can afford it.

Millions cannot, they go without, then when they do need urgent dental care, they go to AE and have operations costing many '000s.

By your logic, the NHS should become an emergency service only, with all other treatments paid for by the wealthy.

....which to be fair will be what happens over the next few years... GP services will be the next where the "choice" will be NHS GPs or Private (but there won't be any NHS ones)

I used to have a corporate membership of Denplan and it didn't pay for itself if you only needed 2 check-ups and 2 hygienist visits a year. It was only any good if you needed treatment which I hadn't had for years. I managed to get in an NHS practice eventually but it was my only option when i first moved to this area.

GP services will be the next where the "choice" will be NHS GPs or Private (but there won't be any NHS ones)

Gp’s are already “private”. They are private contractors who have NHS contracts to provide services.

If the NHS stopped or reduced funding, they would go the same way as dentists and likely need to bring in private patients to balance their books.

In Denmark, all adult general dentistry is paid by the patient. Kids get the absolute best dental care though free.

My kids had their early March appointments cancelled as the practice had run out of NHS money for this financial year. If you try again in April you might get a different approach from them. Worth a try

Given DH is a Dr who spends all day looking after hospital patients free of charge I’m at a loss to understand why dentists feel they’re above the NHS.

Well, no, it's not "free of charge" - it's free at the point of access. How do you think your DH has his salary paid?

But they are not required to take NHS patients and if they do, they can chose to take only a certain number. So, you can try to find an NHS dentist or you can chose to pay private/join denplan etc.

Why are you disgusted by it?

Here is the number to call to find out the NHS dentist closest to you who is taking on patients:
0300 311 2233

There’s no such thing as an NHS dentist. All dentists are self-employed. Some may do some work for the NHS under contract.

Dentists are taking to mick and have been for years - it is ridiculous that it is so restricted as tooth care is health care like any other. And all it means is that people end up needed emergency care and those services are overwhelmed. I dont understand why there is not more done about this. Apart from the fact that hte NHS is being systematically dismantled and starved of funds, and that was a good place to start.

[quote Windchangeface]@StepOutOfLine

no I just grew up in a very low income struggling family and therefore feel social injustices like stopping ‘poor people’ having access to dental care is horrible and should be highlighted![/quote]
I agree with you OP people who don’t have a problem paying for dental care are people who can afford to pay for it.

For me British dentists well and truly fucked my teeth up, filled my mouth full of fillings as a child and removed perfectly healthy teeth. Did root canals badly. I’ve spent over $15000 over seas saving the damage they have done. My first dentist overseas said even if he hadn’t heard my accent, one look in my mouth would tell him I’m either Indian or English. Thankfully times have changed. After moving back to the uk with small children I couldn’t afford to go private. I was lucky though I found a nhs dentist straight away, in fact I found 2, so there are dentists taking on nhs patients. I think it completely depends on location, I didn’t move into a big town or city. All my family live in big towns and cities and they really struggle finding dentists.

I definitely think dental care should be part of nhs care. If the nhs was actually run properly and efficiently then this wouldn’t even be an issue.

@Babygotblueyes

Dentists are taking to mick and have been for years - it is ridiculous that it is so restricted as tooth care is health care like any other. And all it means is that people end up needed emergency care and those services are overwhelmed. I dont understand why there is not more done about this. Apart from the fact that hte NHS is being systematically dismantled and starved of funds, and that was a good place to start.

Do you work for free, @Babygotblueyes?

And you can contact NHS (there is a number somewhere) to find your nearest dental surgery which is taking NHS patients. They might not be as close as the others, but that might be the compromise.

I don’t think dentists have to provide NHS services- it’s not about being “above” anyone. I know that NHS services are not particularly well funded, and the paperwork involved with payment processes is apparently a bit of a nightmare, as can some of the rules/changes which come in at short notice. Because of lower/fixed funding via nhs, many dentists often use private services to remain profitable. There aren’t huge numbers of dental surgeries that are 100% NHS funded now- there is a reason for that.

@MissLucyEyelesbarrow I just came to say that I agree with your long answer earlier, and also, that I really like your username. It’s one of my favourite of her stories.

If the nhs can not fund dental care then surely it should just pull the whole system and change it to those on no income and kids free, everyone else paying a low and reasonable rate.

🤨. That’s how it does work?! There have been patient charges since nhs dentistry’s inception. Children and those on certain benefits/pregnant etc are exempt from paying those charges. And the charges are extremely low and reasonable. To the extent that many EU dentists were gobsmacked at the complexity and number of the treatments they are obliged to provide under the bands when they first came to the UK. Many have returned home and/or moved to private practices ASAP

Because we as a nation cannot afford to subside the amount of services we are, quite simply.

Because we live in a society in which so many people won't take personal responsibility for their own dental care to pay £50 per month (if they can afford it) because they prefer to pay £20 per visit and for all of their brood to receive free dental care. Huge numbers of people with this attitude, is a major part of the problem.

Many families are indeed in dire need of it and fully deserve this care.

But look, there is a large amount of the population needing help due to no fault of their own. Then there are people who don't strictly need the help, but take it anyway because they can. It's the latter that make it difficult for people in genuine need to receive that help, as you've clearly seen.

And unfortunately there are far, far too many people in this country having children they already know they can ill afford, but it's OK because they get 'free' this and that, and government will help. There is not enough being paid into the system, to support the amount coming out. And it's going to come crashing down because of this.

I hate to sound like a tory and all, but there's not enough taking responsibility for ones own families. And I do NOT mean people who genuinely have found themselves in ill health even long term which means they can no longer pay into the system, or tricky short term situations in which they need support. And I think such folk need far more support than they get, they still live in poverty even with help and 'free this and that'.

But there really is far too many people taking out of the pot than putting in, and it's been going on for too long. It's only going to get worse.

[quote NormanStangerson]@MissLucyEyelesbarrow I just came to say that I agree with your long answer earlier, and also, that I really like your username. It’s one of my favourite of her stories.[/quote]
Thank you - she's my favourite Christie character and role model, though I can only dream of her unflappability, let alone the First in Maths from Cambridge. At least, as a doctor, I do come across the odd body

Because we as a nation cannot afford to subside the amount of services we are, quite simply.

Yes, we can. But the majority of voters prefer a system where they pay lower tax to get inadequate services, leaving the poorest and most vulnerable to suffer.

Loads of areas don't have NHS dentist places any more, unfortunately :(

Yes I agree that children should be able to receive NHS dental care.
Op, I have been trying to register my 1 1/2 year old since last year and have been told the same thing by around 5 practices. I think it is awful to have to pay for the appointments of a toddler whether you are the wife of a doctor or otherwise.

@MisgenderedSwan

Which plan are you on? I need to find a good one 🤞🏼