To feel sad that the world of work as we knew it has gone forever?

[Youngatheart00]

My work confirmed today we are moving to 100% remote working and will only get together a few times a year for team meetings. I find this so sad. I loved my working life - I know realise so much of that was down to the people. Now all I do all day is stare at screens and give myself a migraine.

They are justifying it by saying ‘most people’ want this despite me never seeing any such survey. It’s a blatant cost cutting exercise.

Anyone else fed up and lonely?

Another thing is that I had to tell my daughter we can’t talk dad is in the meeting, there is no freedom to laugh hard or get in a politic topic with invited guests (if you are at home while working spouse is too) , everyone has to be quiet. Or go somewhere else

Employers bang on about mental health, I wonder if they will update their policies to realise that WFH (where possible) improves mental health in some people.

I hope they also recognise that for others being forced to WFH is detrimental to their mental health.

@CarriesFlower82 I am just pointing out the knock on impact that people wfh has on the wider economy. You have given two very quick examples that if widely replicated will have a big impact.

Take nurseries for example. They pay pretty badly anyway. If everyone wfh cuts their hours nurseries will eventually reduce their opening hours. It may quickly become unviable for people to stay in those jobs, not to mention that those who still have to go out to work may be left with very few options for childcare that work around commuting hours.

This is me sometimes (being over exaggerating)

I completely understand the knock on effect @Kimye4eva - my husband's business has suffered. However, it also doesn't mean I can't be happy for my own personal benefits. And I am.

I prefer working at home. My office was full of toxic people and drama. Only thing is I have no desk at home and I'm working from a kitchen table 🙄

I don't think it's write to go full home work though. Flexie is probably better where a few times a month your expected to go into the office.

I am one of those people who WFH was forced upon unexpectantly, and wish it would stay forever. I am not an introvert, I have work friends who I still still occasionally (those meetings are now far better, we have more to chat about now meet ups aren't daily), my workplace was never too hot or too cold, my commute was easy. So I don't fit the reasons many quote for wanting to work from home. However, I can say zoom meetings have worked fine for me, the social interactions of the meetings is still their as well as the work side. The office politics and the he said she said crap is now all gone. My work is vastly improved as I now have time to complete projects to a higher quality as people aren't just popping to me desk for a chat about nothing.

I'm not sure what Blueberries meant Kim, but I think internet providers will roll out commercial style pricing packages for wfh as soon as they work out how they can best do so. Maybe I'm cynical but I can see it happening!

And to pp who mentioned it, the tax gain on wfh is £1.20 per week (for a 20% tax payer) and that was increased due to covid! It's hardly an incentive!

The long term impact will be huge. Less money being spent and businesses will start to close, such as sandwich shops that relied on lunch time trade.
Peoples fitness levels will go down as all living sedentary lifestyles. People will also eat more because they are at home. Lack of social interaction may seem OK at first but I've been a sahm for many years now and it is completely isolating and you lose all of your confidence in social situations.
I also worry about younger people starting work for the first time. I don't think it's a good idea at all

I love my job, and it's the best team I've ever worked with. We're a small national team based over the country and have got closer during lockdown, as we make time to get together remotely least once a week, whereas before we might not see each other in person for months. I fucking love having 3 hours a day of my life back (no commute, and no lunch hour wandering round streets feeling bored). I'm so happy we are going to continue working remotely, with a plan to all get together a couple of times a year.

But I voted YANBU as I empathise with those who would rather be out at work. I think its particularly problematic for younger people, with regards to training, developing soft skills, just soaking up stuff from more experienced people. And there are those who value the social connections with people every day. Those who have an escape from abusive, unhappy, homes, or uncomfortable living conditions.

I think ideally people should be given the choice.

I’ve had to work from the office throughout despite being at risk. The only good thing was that distancing measures meant I didn’t end up sick 2-3 times in the year from picking up others’ viruses, and the commute has been much better than in normal times. I just keep reminding myself that I am lucky to have a job at all.

I've worked partly from home for 10 years but it was specific to my role. We're now moving everyone to a hybrid model where office bases will be used for workshops/important customer meetings, but on the whole everyone will work from home. This is partially based on cutting office space for cost and environmental benefits which had already been planned over the next ten years but we're now achieving it in two, and partly because the impact on the workforce has been rising productivity in our tech and finance areas, and a preference from 70% of staff to not have to be in an office 5 days a week. Yes many of these have children, but no one I work with disappears at 2.45 for school run and doesn't return to their desk once they're back - that would be jumped on as its unfair to colleagues with no children.

On a personal level I'm saving 10 hours commuting each week to my local office, £50 a week by not having to use breakfast clubs and approx. £25 a week by not buying lunch with colleagues. I also dont have to listen to the two women who sat near me who seemed to spend the entire day talking loudly over my head (genuinely not even sure when they got any work done!)

I do feel for some of my colleagues as they really value the office interactions, and the social activities, but for me as a raging introvert they were an invasion of my working time, and I really resented the stares I got when saying I couldn't go for drinks after work as I'm a single parent. WFH took all of that stress away for me. I am lucky in that I've carved out a work space at the bottom of the kitchen, and I do make sure the laptop goes off at night so we have a good work/life balance.

I think its a swings and roundabouts situation. Some people wont like WFH all the time, and that's ok. Its also ok for those of us who didn't like being made to go to an office all the time for all those years to feel relieved.....

YANBU and I've been working from home for well over a decade.

I've WFH for over a decade. Started when I was living in a flatshare in my 20s. Did it from multiple flatshares, often just in my bedroom. Built up a successful self-employed career in a brand new industry in that time.

That's why I don't have any time for the arguments that it's bad for productivity, networking or creativity.

I networked online. Social media, emails, messaging. Yes, I organised IRL meetings/drinks/coffees as well but it was amazing how much more effective a back-and-forth quipping over email was in terms of getting to know someone and building long-term contacts. This was also a lot less stressful to me than IRL networking events, which usually consisted of me shuffling into a packed room, realising I knew no one, standing to the side and clutching my drink for 20 minutes then just running away.

It had zero effect on me having a formidable social life. Work and socialising are completely separate in my mind, they are two completely different modes of being to me. At work I am in work mode - head down, total focus on the job. I'm only in socialising mode - in my 20s, that was full-on party animal - when I'm not thinking about work at all. And the idea that your social circle is the same as your colleagues is unfathomable to me.

Working from a bedroom in a flatshare may not have been optimal but it was 100 times better than enduring a soul-sucking, crammed commute twice a day and spending the hours in between in an office where I couldn't control the temperature, the brightness, the volume, the people around me... I found that physically intolerable for the few years I did it.

Never found it hard to separate work and home life. It's actually so much easier to organise both around each other. Sometimes I have to wait on a response before I can get on with my work and I don't have to twiddle my thumbs in an office - I can go for a run, do the laundry, read a book instead, then get on with the work in my own time. I also do better work because I do it when I'm in the best headspace to be creative - which might be at 6am when I've just woken up, 2am late at night, whenever. I don't have to wait to be in an office when inspiration strikes. I also work across multiple time zones so being tied to an office would be fairly awful in that regard.

WFH is not bad for work or even most workers. It's bad for a select group of workers, and they seem unable to comprehend how bad office life was for others.

And there are easy solutions to all of their complaints. There's nothing stopping you going to a cafe to work if you crave other people around you. Or from working with a colleague or two if you feel like it - there are plenty of spaces you can use to do this. As a freelancer I'd sometimes just pop round to another freelancer's friend's house to do a morning's work. WFH does not mean you are literally forced to only work by yourself in your house.

I've also successfully worked with multiple international teams and for many international clients whom I've never met face-to-face. Making it work was really not a big deal at all. It's ridiculous to frame WFH as innately harmful to work.

Gosh there have been some 'I'm alright Jack' posts on here!

I enjoy WFH so long as my child is in full time childcare. I previously worked 2 days from home anyway and had a long commute which meant I had to leave my office well in advance of when I wanted to in order to make sure I wasn't late picking him up. I have a spare room that I can use for an office, as does my DH. I have an extended household with my mum so I see her regularly. If everything in life was opened up again so that we could socialise properly with friends, I would be quite happy to WFH the majority of the time with perhaps 1 day a week in the office.

But that doesn't mean I can't empathise with those who don't enjoy it, or don't have the adequate space to do it or for those living alone with no support bubbles. And there have been times, even with all I've said above, when it has been a strain. YANBU to be upset OP.

*But I voted YANBU as I empathise with those who would rather be out at work. I think its particularly problematic for younger people, with regards to training, developing soft skills, just soaking up stuff from more experienced people. And there are those who value the social connections with people every day. Those who have an escape from abusive, unhappy, homes, or uncomfortable living conditions.

I think ideally people should be given the choice.*

^This.
Organisations are riding on existing corporate culture, current work/social connections and people's recognition of the risks of COVID. In 5 or 10 years time it will unravel and permanent wfh teams will be less effective.

@Youngatheart00

I would have been quite happy with a balance between wfh and the office. I understand flexibility helps many people.

I’m curious how many ‘I love my job’ people say that because of the actual work they do or because of the people and teams they worked with

This is a good point. I don't love my job and I only do it to get money. For me, the fact I don't have to rush about and pack into crowded places with lots of people I don't like is a bonus now.

My "career" such as it is ceased to be my identity ages ago and whilst I do understand for some people work is everything is hasn't been for me since at least my 30s and probably longer.

For once this is organisational cost-cutting that suits me - but I won't be so thrilled when they start cutting salaries because we are all saving on commuting costs.

WFH is not bad for work or even most workers. It's bad for a select group of workers, and they seem unable to comprehend how bad office life was for others.

If those who don’t want to work full time from home forever have to suck it up and get another job (which obviously they do but it seems reasonable to be a bit upset about a change beyond all recognition from what they’d actually chosen) then why didn’t those who find office work unbearable suck it up and get another job?

For once this is organisational cost-cutting that suits me - but I won't be so thrilled when they start cutting salaries because we are all saving on commuting costs.

I thought this. If organisations in London can hire someone in Yorkshire who paid £85k for their terrace and has no commuting costs, they aren't going to advertise at a "London weighted" salary the next time someone leaves.

We were discussing this at our weekly team call as we're all working at home permanently now. My company has 3 expensive London office spaces all sitting empty for much of the last year and they're starting to consolidate office space to save money after a year where sales were down. They're already downsizing the workforce to balance the books.
I dont miss the early starts or 3 hours a day commute, but do miss the inperson contact with colleagues. I'm Zoomed out!

YANBU OP. There have been a few of these threads lately, each showing a serious lack of empathy and understanding from other sides.

Some people like WFH all the time, some people like being in the office all the time, and some people like doing a mix of the two. It's as simple as that.

Organisations are riding on existing corporate culture, current work/social connections and people's recognition of the risks of COVID. In 5 or 10 years time it will unravel and permanent wfh teams will be less effective.

I think it’ll be less than that. I’m in an ageing profession and we’ll need a lot of new blood in the next 3-5 years, that’s one of the reasons the organisation have understood that they need to offer flexibility and forcing everyone 100% remote won’t be attractive to potential recruits. Either my organisation is totally non representative or mumsnet is, because staff here were overwhelmingly in favour of at least 2 days per week in the office and a significant chunk wanted full or almost full time.

why didn’t those who find office work unbearable suck it up and get another job?

They're meant to be starting a sucessful business from home in their 20s. That'll be fun in the post-Covid economy.

Employers bang on about mental health, I wonder if they will update their policies to realise that WFH (where possible) improves mental health in some people.

^I hope they also recognise that for others being forced to WFH is detrimental to their mental health.^
Exactly everyone is different, some don't have the space or motivation to get dressed at home.
Costs will rise for companies. Are they planning on paying for heat, electric, Internet usage for staff at home?

@Youngatheart00

I would have been quite happy with a balance between wfh and the office. I understand flexibility helps many people.

I’m curious how many ‘I love my job’ people say that because of the actual work they do or because of the people and teams they worked with

The actual work.

Obviously not all of the actual work is a thrill but it was never because of the people or teams. More likely to be despite them.

Actually, the more boring aspects of my work are the bits I most need to be alone and in my own space for. Head down, music loud, bowl of snacks to hand, and I'll plough through it in a way I could never do with people interrupting me all the time!

This isn't to say I haven't genuinely liked people I've worked with. But the time to chat and socialise is when I'm not in work mode. And WFH in no way stops me organising that.