Employer says I must return to office

[Dishmatic]

I’m currently wfh. A lot of people at my company are in the office and have always been.

Last year I wrote to HR and requested to wfh due to a health condition which makes me vulnerable to Covid.
This was approved and i’ve been wfh since.

I have my Covid vaccine this week. I told my work colleague that I’d booked it and yesterday I had an email from work asking for a catch up about retuning to the office.

I spoke to them this morning and they’ve said that now I’m being vaccinated I will be expected to return to the “Covid secure” office.

I didn’t say anything on the phone but I’m really not happy to go back in.

There’s over 70 people in my office building.
14 in the room I work in!!

AIBU to not go back in due to risks?

Being ill? Based on what? What exactly are you afraid of? You refuse to say.
Your chances of getting it are slim. Your chances of getting it badly, making you so severely ill that you'd require hospital treatment, now that you've had your first vaccination are even slimmer.

Do you have severe anxiety?
Is there going to be a huge drip feed re your crippling anxiety, that you refuse to address?

@Bluenightowl

Can you tell them you haven’t had the vaccination? Just say they didn’t do it when you went as you weren’t well/had the flu vaccine a couple of weeks ago or something?

You're advising OP to lie?

Sorry but you’re not shielding and your employers want you back in the office. You choose if you want the job or not.

Being office based is not just about your workload, clearly I don’t know what you do but perhaps your expertise is helpful for younger less experienced staff. Perhaps the team just work better as a team or perhaps people are complaining that you are getting different treatment.

Eleganz I think it's the other way around

OP was employed to do a job in an office. Other employees with the same job are presumably doing it from the office. It's for her to prove why she should be allowed to stay at home and not for the employer to prove why she should come back beyond providing the COVID secure risk assessment that all offices had to do.

They agreed voluntarily to vary her T&Cs for a while but they can require her to return to her original working pattern unless she can give a reason why it would be unsafe or unreasonable to ask her to.

If she wants her T&Cs permanently varied she could put in a flexible working request.

I think realistically you can only insist on wfh until 2 weeks after your second vaccination. After that what reason would you have to refuse to return to the office? You will be as protected as you can be. Are you going to continue to avoid everything else forever like non essential shopping or days out? But I would say you were not happy about returning until 2 weeks post your second vaccine.

If you aren’t on the shielding list they are entitled to say they want you back.

Rather than fighting a battle you may well loose, could you talk to them about working somewhere where fairly isolated within the office until 3 weeks past your second dose?
They should at least try to make that happen.

I'm curious why you see yourself as CV but the NHS/Government don't.

I don’t think I’ve seen the OP say the NHS/government don’t see her as CV.

The CV people aren’t shielding. That’s CEV. The CV people were told to work from home, avoid public transport and to be extremely stringent about social distancing, including avoiding contact with people outside their household indoors where possible.

2 weeks after your 2nd vaccine. Simple as that.

Advise them of that and if they still ask you to return then put in a request for flexible working.

At some point everyone has to return to normal

I think 2 weeks after your second shot is when you should return back to the office

I can see your concerns but 8th April is over a month away. Hopefully covid cases will have fallen further by then and we can expect at least another 5 million people to have been vaccinated including hopefully some of your work colleagues With one vaccine they are reporting up to 80% protection but we all have our own comfort levels. If you are still really concerned take it up with Human Resources

If the OPs employer says it isn’t possible for her to WFH then she will be expected to attend.

But why isn’t it possible? Why was it possible up to now? What has materially changed that makes it ‘not possible’?

Surely if government guidance is wfh if you can, an employer has to have a pretty good reason why someone can’t?

After that what reason would you have to refuse to return to the office?

The fact that government guidance says wfh if you can.

Better work/ life balance.

Reduced carbon footprint.

"I teach in a room that doesn’t even have a window to even open for ventilation"

We've proved that education is best delivered in school, so although I feel for you, teachers presence in school is necessary. However, your classroom ought to be ventilated properly to minimise your risk. I also think that teachers should have been vaccinated. Many office jobs can be done very effectively from home and I don't think employers should be allowed to arbitrarily decide that workers come in. OP has been working at home for many months, so a change now is not justified.

@HoboSexualOnslow

I don't understand why employers want people back if they're working well at home.I'm NHS and we've had several office outbreaks, so we've been told to stay and wfh. More people in equals more risk

^This, this, so much this!

OP... You don't mention how old you are... Have you actually looked at your chances of being admitted to hospital? Even though vulnerable... Its very low.
Many clinically vulnerable people have been working outside the home throughout this period.... Including me... Despite the fact I also have other risk factors that also make me higher risk... Have a look at the risk assessment, ask for an update on covid controls, read the HSE guidance on covid controls in offices...ask if you can pop in sometime as anxious....

I get you are anxious but you need to get over it if you want to keep your job. Your company have been very considerate allowing you to be home for so long... Don't push that back in their faces and make them regret being helpful to you.

To be flippant... Everything in life is a risk... Flu kills, flu makes people sick... Do you refuse to go into work every flu season...

@IceCreamAndCandyfloss

Are you or no one else on the household not going anywhere at all?

It’s not an unreasonable request from your employer if you have had the vaccine and are not shielding on medical advice.

@IceCreamAndCandyfloss

Nope. We don’t go anywhere. DP wfh.

Which bit of "work from home if you can" don't they understand?

They're a bunch of fuckers.

@Oblomov21

Being ill? Based on what? What exactly are you afraid of? You refuse to say. Your chances of getting it are slim. Your chances of getting it badly, making you so severely ill that you'd require hospital treatment, now that you've had your first vaccination are even slimmer.

Do you have severe anxiety?
Is there going to be a huge drip feed re your crippling anxiety, that you refuse to address?

@Oblomov21

What do you mean what am I afraid of?
Covid! Being severely ill or death!

No, I don’t have severe anxiety.

I’m anxious, yes, but as are most people about Covid.

You probably won't die is quite a low bar for employers' health and safety obligations.

@happytoday73

OP... You don't mention how old you are... Have you actually looked at your chances of being admitted to hospital? Even though vulnerable... Its very low.

32

@happytoday73

Do you refuse to go into work every flu season...

No...

1. I have my flu jab, 1 dose, which we have years of data to show its effectiveness.

1. Flu cases are not rife at flu season, and if they are then it’s certainly not enough to lock us down or the need for masks / distancing.

You’re over reacting massively.

At 32, your risk will be minimal even with a health condition (say somewhere just below 1%)

After one vaccine the odds of you catching it drop by 85%

Taking you down to perhaps 0.05%

And that’s even you even catch it - rates are down massively, and you’ll be distancing.

Net chance - close to 0. More likely to be hit by a car on your commute.

@Bluenightowl

If you are able to WFH effectively, then I am baffled as to why you are being asked to return to the office. 'Because others are' is not a reason. Demanding 'presence' in the office is a sign of very poor management.

Absolutely this! My whole company can effectively wfh, due to the nature of the business. But old fashioned management hates it and prefers praising presenteerism. We are already expected to come it the office, despite government’s advice. 2 people already left the company (for that reason) and more will, I am sure. We are working with a global, multinational corporation whose employers are a bit more forward thinking (or afraid of being sued) and everyone there works from home and will be until it is safe to do so. I am actually not worried for my health at all, but I am extremely pissed off at bosses like mine, who just don’t care and insist the old way is the only good way. If the government had any sense, they would enforce the guidance and fine companies like mine. But no, much easier and petty to fine individuals whilst hundreds of companies ignore the guidance because they are f*ing backwards and don’t give a rat’s arse about their employees. Hopefully, they will stay behind whilst all the talent goes to flexible employers who can see benefit of both and move on with the times.

I’m anxious, yes, but as are most people about Covid

The majority of 32 year olds aren't as anxious as you around covid, never mind the vaccinated ones.

I work in a school full of non vaccinated teachers in their 30s who have no choice but to have contact with 150+ students per week with little PPE, no social distancing and not much ventilation.

I think you do have an "above normal range" level of anxiety.