Is it me or is SIA movie 'Music' depiction of Autism HIGHLY offensive?!

[Mum2prince]

Ive just seen the trailer in YouTube, ive yet to research more about what in earth possesed this woman to cast maddie ziegler a NT person to play the role of a young autistic girl.

I am gobsmacked at all the stereotypes the have used to depict autism and i honestly felt horrible watching it. As someone who was concerned my ds may have asd, this is exactly the type of representation i did not like. Regardless of how much info about asd is out there and the awareness raises, there is still a large group of people who do not fully understand Autism and this movie makes things worse imo.

The icing on the cake is the movie trailer is a sensory overload for me, let alone someone neurodiverse who may want to watch it. Bright colours, flashing lights and breaking out into song regularly. Yikes.

AIBU?

*EDIT - Just watched and interview Sia did and she used offensive words like "low functioning" and even claimed she had an original Autistic girl cast for the role but she couldn't handle it. What?!

Yes I'm aware of that I was pointing out that when restraint was needed in acute mental health and only ever as a last resort ,it was drummed into us during C&R training how dangerous the prone position is and how necessary it was to move a patient onto their backs asap ,they constantly updated holds etc too, I assume team teach is taught in an equally safe manner .

@x2boys

Yes I'm aware of that I was pointing out that when restraint was needed in acute mental health and only ever as a last resort ,it was drummed into us during C&R training how dangerous the prone position is and how necessary it was to move a patient onto their backs asap ,they constantly updated holds etc too, I assume team teach is taught in an equally safe manner .

Yeah it is. That's what I was getting at with my post. Its probably very similar to what nurses etc are taught.

Im sure there are many elements of this film which would bother me if i saw it.
Having said that I'm not sure how my son gets to have his life represented on screen if only an actor with autism can do that. Would an actor with autism be happy acting a 'pretend' meltdown or portraying some of his behaviours if they feel such behaviours are so very awful - stereotypical, offensive and demeaning?

And if an autistic actor able to act out his behaviours was prepared to do so why should that be better and less problematic for me (or him) if the person able to portray his behaviours is horrified that low functioning autism is mentioned let alone 'performed'. why is that preferable to an NT actor.

Id probably prefer an NT actor trying to do a realistic portrayal than an autistic actor ashamed by the association.

Im enjoying the idea that those that think his behaviours and presentation are shameful simultaneously think they can speak for him though. Thats interesting to me

How can you use high function is low functioning is taboo
His cognitive ability is high functioning 94% no learning disorder, not his autism he is severely impaired by his ASD diagnoses, he is intelligent but that doesn't stop his daily struggles and sensory social and behavioural issues.

Who says this?

The educational psychologist who assessed his cognitive skills during his multidisciplinary assessment with 5 professionals over two years.
He is very clever.

I'd probably prefer an NT actor trying to do a realistic portrayal than an autistic actor ashamed by the association.
Definitely. Dustin Hoffman played the role well for it's time.

@Emeraldshamrock

The educational psychologist who assessed his cognitive skills during his multidisciplinary assessment with 5 professionals over two years. He is very clever.

Is this in the UK or Ireland?

(I'm not in either)

@Pagwatch

Im sure there are many elements of this film which would bother me if i saw it. Having said that I'm not sure how my son gets to have his life represented on screen if only an actor with autism can do that. Would an actor with autism be happy acting a 'pretend' meltdown or portraying some of his behaviours if they feel such behaviours are so very awful - stereotypical, offensive and demeaning?

And if an autistic actor able to act out his behaviours was prepared to do so why should that be better and less problematic for me (or him) if the person able to portray his behaviours is horrified that low functioning autism is mentioned let alone 'performed'. why is that preferable to an NT actor.

Id probably prefer an NT actor trying to do a realistic portrayal than an autistic actor ashamed by the association.

Im enjoying the idea that those that think his behaviours and presentation are shameful simultaneously think they can speak for him though. Thats interesting to me

I don’t think anyone, autistic or otherwise has said that these “behaviours” are awful or demeaning or that they are horrified by them.

Well except for the head of year at the school my son used to go to but that’s a whole other story.

I can’t speak for all autistic actors but my daughter graduates this year and she would never be ashamed by the association. She does understand the triad of impairments and would be able to portray them without resorting to clown like grotesque (I’m using the term grotesque in an acting sense, not a subjective feeling sense).

@TomPinch Ireland. Afaik it is similar breakdown of comorbidities alongside ASD in both Ireland and England through dmv5 scale assessments. I'm not a psychologist just a mother with lots of labels on DS.

Comefromaway

I appreciate that is your interpretation but I’m afraid it is not mine. I’m not sure what else explains the horror the OP describes at the film if it’s not that it portrays severe/low functioning autism? Why else is it not positive and awful?
I’m any event the horror at the character being non verbal and having meltdowns and therefore being incredibly negative has been all over Twitter etc so it’s not an uncommon view. I was first alerted to the outrage when my eldest son called me really upset that people like his brother were being talked about as a problematic image of autism.

I’m sure your daughter would do a good and respectful job , as my daughter who is not autistic would too. I wasn’t talking about them but the people insisting that only they should be allowed to play such a role while simultaneously describing the role of a non verbal low functioning girl offensive

(I’ve used low/high functioning because while we dont all like the terms I think everyone on here knows what I mean. Apologies to people who don’t like the terms. I’m trying to be brief and clear)

Level 1, 2, 3 is used to label the severity of Autism.
Some see low functioning as derogatory like many of the words in the past used in medical terms are not longer acceptable on a person and their character.

This level 1,2 or 3 is bunkum and I’ll only ever refer to my son as having a diagnosis of Classic Kanners Autism and when people say what does that mean I’ll continue to say he’s severely/profoundly autistic, about as bad as it can get.

After I’ve said the above I’ll then mention the other things that have developed over the years.

Much is made of terminology that was used previously but the reality is that they were a better description of what was going on than level 1,2 or 3.

Yep agree @pagwatch , incidentally did anyone watch " There she goes " on BBC ? A non disabled actress potrays a young girl with severe learning disabilities,non verbal etc and imo she did a brilliant job ,my son has very similar disabilities and it made me laugh and cry at the realism.

No I haven’t seen ‘there she goes’ but I’ll add that on to my list to watch, thanks for that! @x2boys

Have you watched the film or even the opening scene Pagwatch?

Maddies portrayal is akin to a child on the playground mocking autistic traits. It is neither realistic or sympathetic. It’s a parody of the worst kind.

And as I said earlier in the thread. One of my son’s favourite TV shows has an autistic character played by a non autistic actor. Not an issue but the huge difference is that the creator of the show is autistic and therefore the character is written and directed with realism and nuance.

A big issue for autistic actors (& there are some incredibly talented ones around) is that they are regularly discriminated against and so when they see non autistic actors portraying them (& badly) it hurts. Just before this film was released there was a controversy over Spotlight where casting directors were able to filter out disabled performers before having even seen them.

@Comefromaway

And as I said earlier in the thread. One of my son’s favourite TV shows has an autistic character played by a non autistic actor. Not an issue but the huge difference is that the creator of the show is autistic and therefore the character is written and directed with realism and nuance.

A big issue for autistic actors (& there are some incredibly talented ones around) is that they are regularly discriminated against and so when they see non autistic actors portraying them (& badly) it hurts. Just before this film was released there was a controversy over Spotlight where casting directors were able to filter out disabled performers before having even seen them.

As so many have pointed out here, a severely impacted autistic person would not be able to act in a film. So who should portray them?

*or direct a film

Comefromaway.

I’ve already said I haven’t seen it and that I may well have issues with it when I do do.
And all my comments have been around the way criticisms have been expressed - specifically that no non autistic actors should be allowed to portray an autistic person and that portrayals of low functioning autism are offensive.

I’ll be happy to discuss how awful it is when I’ve seen it but how well the role is acted is nothing to do with my points

I haven’t seen anyone say that portrayals of low functioning autism are offensive.

@Pagwatch

"I’m not sure what else explains the horror the OP describes at the film if it’s not that it portrays severe/low functioning autism?"

I dont know how anyone can feel how you described people think of your son or autism. Thats not me, and that's by no means what i meant.

I have a severely autistic niece and thats just how we describe her autism. As a family we would never say low functioning but thats just us maybe. The character music herself although sia described her as 'low functioning', after watching clips seeing her dress herself and go to the shops alone, she also seemed to have echolalia that she used appropriately, she also sang at the end though the characters autism is profound she is doing great.

I didnt like the restraint scene, the fact that sia had the opportunity to bring awareness about important issues like restraint and did the complete opposite does baffle me. Also the stunning in the choreography did not look genuine to me and seemed like mocking. The meltdown itself was not the issue nor is the stimming.

I feel sia is benefitting from the movie financially and also putting her music out there and could have done alot more things correctly and respectfully. The fact that majority of the autism community is hurt by it is enough for me to also not want any part of it. I dont think its fair. I am however glad you feel there is nothing wrong with the film.

Imo the autistic. Community really don't want to be associated with anything that doesn't show autism in a positive light which I find highly offensive,when my own child is significantly impacted by his autism

The autistic community hate people like my son because he's autistic and also severely learning disabled they like to shout down my voice because my son doesn't have his own voice

@x2boys

'Community really don't want to be associated with anything that doesn't show autism in a positive light which I find highly offensive'

What do you mean 'positive light'? I actually think the character Music was shown in a positive light imo. And i still don't think its right to dismiss all those people who don't feel its right for many reasons myself and others have stated. The one scene where Music characters meltdown was not violent at all, infact she looked overwhelmed and scared.. when the male actor egged on her in screen sister Kate Hudson to put her entire body weight on her and pin her down?!! Wtf?! They made that a triumphant scene where her sister had finally stepped up to look after her sister. At this point i feel im being repetitive. But like i said to @pagwatch, since the storyline resonates with you both and you think its not offensive in my eyes thats great. I wish nobody was offended tbh, though imo i feel they have a right to be.