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Original poster

Is it me or is SIA movie 'Music' depiction of Autism HIGHLY offensive?!

199 replies

Mum2prince · 04/03/2021 19:38

Ive just seen the trailer in YouTube, ive yet to research more about what in earth possesed this woman to cast maddie ziegler a NT person to play the role of a young autistic girl.

I am gobsmacked at all the stereotypes the have used to depict autism and i honestly felt horrible watching it. As someone who was concerned my ds may have asd, this is exactly the type of representation i did not like. Regardless of how much info about asd is out there and the awareness raises, there is still a large group of people who do not fully understand Autism and this movie makes things worse imo.

The icing on the cake is the movie trailer is a sensory overload for me, let alone someone neurodiverse who may want to watch it. Bright colours, flashing lights and breaking out into song regularly. Yikes.

AIBU?

*EDIT - Just watched and interview Sia did and she used offensive words like "low functioning" and even claimed she had an original Autistic girl cast for the role but she couldn't handle it. What?!

OP posts:
TomPinch · 05/03/2021 02:37

[quote Emeraldshamrock]@TomPinch ASD can be diagnosed with a host of comorbidities which can include oppositional defiance, Global development disorder, language disorder, emotional disorder, learning disorder, sensory processing disorder it is rarely one issue.[/quote]
Since when and who is doing this? Not that I am disagreeing with you, I'm not a medic, but I've never heard of this, or that low functioning autism is an outdated term.

ISTM that what you describe is bracketing out the autism, and that's misleading if the other conditions are a consequence of it.

Sapho47 · 05/03/2021 02:48

@Emeraldshamrock

Since when did "low functioning" become non-U? GDD LD global development disorder or/and learning disorder they are separate from the autism diagnoses. My DS has high cognitive functioning no learning disability but social emotional attachment issues.
How can you use high function is low functioning is taboo.
Sapho47 · 05/03/2021 03:05

@Branleuse

How has Sias film hurt me as an autistic person??
It hasn't but all the self siagnosed NT people don't like any depiction that doesn't say autistic people are brilliant minds but rude/poor social skills.

As they all see themselves as brilliant and want an excuse for being an ass

Sapho47 · 05/03/2021 03:09

@Ponoka7

"But you only want autistic people to play autistic people.

So you're always going to be incredibly limited in options."

Are you? Without thinking I know of four theatre groups, two specifically for young people who have additional needs, but all four have people who have autism in them. All local to me and one group is part of a nation wide project, so that gives lots of options. That could be because my autistic DD went to a SEN school and so I'm aware of what's about.

This film has been universally criticised. It doesn't help young people who have autism, it feeds a stereotype and sets people up with preconceived ideas. My DD's work colleagues were amazed that she went to a SEN school and is autistic, because she was nothing like they expected. She started as a college placement and I'll always be grateful for her manager giving her a chance. It's disappointing because this could have made a positive difference to people's attitude to autism. I like everything else that Sia and Maddy have done, I don't know why this has been got so wrong.

Lol I'm sorry but there's local theater groups everywhere, they're not filled with Hollywood level actors.

Theyre filled by the people who aren't that level.

At the top for a big budget film there's limited options to begin with for any part.

You kind of proved my point by your "options" being a community group for children with special needs, instead of say a few Oscar winners.

The % of people with the talent look and upbringing to be a high level actor is tiny, just fortunately we have millions of people trying for it so we can take the few dozen good ones.

"This film has been universally criticised"

Well except for the autistic people in this thread.

Skippingabeat · 05/03/2021 03:25

@Anne1958

Many people in those autistic groups don't like to admit that there are loads of autistic people who are low functioning which is also highly offensive to those of us who love and care for our low functioning son's and daughters

Yes.

There are also those that are autistic who insist parents who are NT can’t possibly understand their children (or advocate for them) because you have to be autistic to really understand it.

My son is almost 30 and is at the very severe end of the spectrum and because of how hostile some of the people I’ve come across online have been to parents I gave up listening to many of those on the spectrum years ago.

I always think of that as me saying I can understand the struggles of children who are completely blind better than their parents because I have myopia
Skippingabeat · 05/03/2021 03:30

@TomPinch

A quick Google suggests that "low functioning autism" is a current term within the medical community. I also found criticism of it, but it was from support groups, not medical journals etc
The current terms as per the DSM-5 are level 1, 2, 3 with the classification depending on the level of support (3 requiring very substantial support)
TomPinch · 05/03/2021 06:53

According to whom?

AndErgo · 05/03/2021 07:12

*To me, the most offensive thing isn't even the restraint scenes or the way Maddie acts in a way that feels a little too much like she is imitating the autistic kid on the playground. My main issue with this film is that it is touted as some kind of love letter to autism, yet isn't really about autism at all. The film isn't about Music, it's about her sister. Music is just a plot device used for the main lead to become a better person, it's inspiration porn. In one of Sia's interviews about this film, Sia and the interviewer both refer to low-functioning autistic kids as 'inanimate objects', and that is exactly how the autistic kid is being used in this film. They are a prop.

I'm autistic, I do not care if the person playing an autistic character is on the spectrum. Similarly I don't believe murderers can only be played by people who have killed someone, or that we should cancel How I met your mother because Neil Patrick Harris is playing a straight guy. What I do care about is quality writing, and that is completely absent from this movie. It reminds me of this, even though it's only loosely related.

youtu.be/T_RTnuJvg6U

The other thing that offends me about this film is Sia as a person in the public eye. She made a complete tool of herself on Twitter to be honest, and no amount of good intentions is going to change that she told people to f off and whatever else she said. She is a grown woman throwing a tantrum on social media and it is embarrassing. People keep bringing up the autistic actor thing and I know that there are those who care about that, but it's a red herring imo and takes away from the actual issues.

I do have issues with the depiction itself, but that has been mentioned already by plenty of posters.*

^This with bells on. Perfectly put.

megletsecond · 05/03/2021 07:22

The film does sound pretty dire.
Has Maddie Ziegler said she is NT? There's no reason she necessarily is.

itsgettingwierd · 05/03/2021 07:27

Mum2 why don't you think they should have used stereotypes of atoms for the character?

What's wrong with them showing an autistic person stimmjng?

Are you yourself autistic or do you have an autistic child?

SenecaTrewe · 05/03/2021 09:11

Sia is weirdly obsessed with Maddie Ziegler. If I was Maddie's mother I would be concerned.

Comefromaway · 05/03/2021 09:26

Maddie is reported to have been upset by what she was asked to do. She felt like she was mocking autistic people (and the portrayal does come across that way). Sia told her not to worry about it.

fightingSmiths · 05/03/2021 09:36

What is offensive about using the term 'low functioning'?

Comefromaway · 05/03/2021 09:40

I don't think low functioning is offensive as such, but many think putting into two distinct categories isn't helpful, especially when there are co-morbidities.

Mumofsend · 05/03/2021 09:47

This reply has been deleted

Message deleted by MNHQ. Here's a link to our Talk Guidelines.

apalledandshocked · 05/03/2021 09:55

@Branleuse

How has Sias film hurt me as an autistic person??
It is unlikely to hurt you, as an independant adult. But the restraint bit "Im crushing her with my love" (it literally says that) does encourage a form of restraint that has killed people in the past. Although I guess someone would have to be pretty stupid to do something just because they saw it in a Sia film. Although actually people are pretty stupid a lot of the time.
Comefromaway · 05/03/2021 10:00

It is a film that advocates an adult putting their entire body weight onto a child to hold them face down on the floor because the child has become upset in public.

Something not dis-similar killed George Floyd, who is was a fully grown adult.

x2boys · 05/03/2021 10:08

I probably should watch it then ,I used to be a mental health nurse,and we were taught control and restraint we had yearly updates I worked on acute mental health wards ,can I just point out , restraint was only ever used as a last resort and it was drummed into us that the prone position was incredibly dangerous and if somebody had to be restrained than they needed to be moved on their back asap ,this was the UK though,I know they use team teach at my child's special school.

apalledandshocked · 05/03/2021 10:10

@Comefromaway

It is a film that advocates an adult putting their entire body weight onto a child to hold them face down on the floor because the child has become upset in public.

Something not dis-similar killed George Floyd, who is was a fully grown adult.

Yes but you see the police weren't doing it "with love". THAT is what makes the difference apparently Hmm (and yes sometimes restraint might be necessary for children/young persons to stop them hurting themselves or others. But there are safe ways of doing it and the technique shown in the film.... isnt)
apalledandshocked · 05/03/2021 10:11

@x2boys cross posted but, exactly!!!

Emeraldshamrock · 05/03/2021 10:14

Restrain safely never adding weight to crush a person.
My health nurse taught me how to restrain DS safely if absolutely necessary.

Comefromaway · 05/03/2021 10:24

I used to find that ds responded well to being held very tightly when in meltdown. But it was always in an upright position and his airway was never restricted. When he was little I would hold him on my knee. Now he is 17 it would be sitting next to me. My daughter sometimes will ask for a crushing hug as a sensory stimulation thing for her. Usually she's the one crushing me! But again never in the prone position.

As x2boys rightly said, prone restraint should only ever be used for when there is immediate danger of the person causing significant harm to themselves or others AND there is no alternative. And the person should be got onto their back as soon as possible.

AndErgo · 05/03/2021 10:58

Sia Talks Directing Her First Feature Film 'Music'

babbaloushka · 05/03/2021 17:28

I know someone did not just compare EDS to autism... I have EDS and the fact it's a disability is about the only similarity it has to autism. White-Knighting at it's absolute finest...

itsgettingwierd · 05/03/2021 17:41

@x2boys

I probably should watch it then ,I used to be a mental health nurse,and we were taught control and restraint we had yearly updates I worked on acute mental health wards ,can I just point out , restraint was only ever used as a last resort and it was drummed into us that the prone position was incredibly dangerous and if somebody had to be restrained than they needed to be moved on their back asap ,this was the UK though,I know they use team teach at my child's special school.
There is no restraint in team teach that requires body weight on top of another person. In fact no U.K. taught restraint would use that technique.

A prone or supine restraint actually only uses holds on the arms - mechanics not weight.