To think this is unbelievably shit from the police?

[TheLostDiadem]

Six weeks ago my elderly mum had her house burgled while she was asleep upstairs. Not a lot of valuable things were taken as she doesn’t really have much but my (deceased) dad’s medals were taken, her laptop, a box of jewellery belonging to my grandma was taken and her cat was found downstairs with a broken rib where we assume he was kicked (but obviously can’t be certain it was the burglar).

She phoned the local police number and was told to report it online. I came round to do it and help her tidy up and make sure she was ok etc. 48hrs later and still heard nothing from the police so I called them to be told they were incredibly busy and responses can take up to a week. Finally, 8 days after being robbed my mum gets an answer phone message from the police saying they’ve received her report and given her a crime reference number so she can claim on insurance. If she has any further queries she can email them and they’ll get back to her. No enquiry, not welfare check, nothing. Just a crime reference number over a week later.

I live with my dc in the same town. In the garden of my house is an outhouse that is currently being renovated so that when my dm becomes less independent she can live there. It’s nearly finished and has been separated off from my house and has a separate entrance and drive. The electricity had finally been connected last week so last night I decided to do a sleep over there with dc, just for something to do. At 12.15 I was woken up by police hammering on the door. They immediately asked me my address and what I was doing there. I said I lived next door, was sleeping over with dc, had something happened, was dm ok as I assumed something bad had happened. They wouldn’t tell me anything just asked for proof of address. I said it was all next door and they demanded I go and get it. I wasn’t happy leaving dc alone with the police so had to wake them up and drag them over and back again while I got my driving license. It was only then that I realised they thought that I was breaking lockdown rules (very touristy area). I gave them driving license and got a lecture on how we weren’t supposed to leave home unless absolutely necessary, fancying a sleep over wasn’t necessary and I wasn’t to do it again. I asked if it was any different to camping in the garden and was that allowed, what possible harm am I doing sleeping in what is basically a garage and was asked “are you sure you want to do this? You have your children with you and I’m sure you don’t want a scene”. I found this genuinely quite frightening as it was two big, male police officers and I was alone with two young dc. They then left after telling me to make sure I stay at home from now on and that they wouldn’t take further action this time.

TLDR - my mum was burgled and police responded a week later with a crime reference number and nothing else

I slept in the converted garage in the garden with 2dc and was woken in the night by 2 police men to be lectured firmly about lockdown rules.

If I’m not being unreasonable do you think a complaint would be warranted? I’m one of those people who have never really had any dealings with the police and sort of assumed they’d be on my side. Really shocked at what I’ve experienced the 2 times I’ve actually dealt with them though.

It is derogatory. It stems from grock the clown in the 50s and the charming residents compared tourists to the clownish antics and generally boorish behaviour. If it wasn’t offensive you would simple call them tourists.

If things actually happened the way you described, which seems very unlikely, then report it I’m not even sure why you would need MN to tell you that.

A lot of people struggle to admit they were wrong - the police certainly aren't unique in that - but it's a serious problem, given their power and authority.

@AGirlCalledJohnny

People policing the term grockle on a thread about heavy handed policing is peak Mumsnet

Policing... or pointing out that language is offensive and derogatory. I suspect you wouldn’t be swooping in to make such a point if other derogatory language was being used but crack on thinking you’re making a point.

@TheLostDiadem

Grockle isn’t derogatory, certainly not where I live anyway. It’s just another word for tourist or holiday maker. Is tourist a derogatory word now too?

As I said, in my experience it is always used in a derogatory way. You say it’s just a word for tourist, I say it isn’t. No point arguing the toss.

smallprawnenergy you’re right, I just made this entire scenario up

Negligence and nonsense respectively, on the part of the police. I would definitely complain. for your poor mum.

I think a serious letter to the police commissioner is needed. A genuine attempt to allow him to get his house in order.

And the local press/a FB campaign to see if you can gry the medals back.

I suspect you wouldn’t be swooping if other derogatory language was being used

Like Culchie? Micks? Mainlanders?

Get on with yourself and being professionally offended 🙄

@UhtredRagnarson

Fucking hell! That’s quite disgusting. Threatening you. And yes, that’s exactly what they were doing- threatening you by dangling the suggestion they would upset your children.

Also can’t believe they told an elderly woman whose laptop had been stolen to report her burglary online!

This is years ago but a friend who finished a night shift and went to her car to find all of the windows were smashed was offered... a window sticker.

OP, I would be seething in yours and your Mum’s position.

@CatherineCawood

If all the police do is dish out crime numbers for burglary doesn't that rather encourage people to make dodgy insurance claims? You don't get a visit so have to prove nothing? 🤔

That's a good point. I know they are notoriously slow at coming out, but to not come out at all? How does the victim claim forced entry etc rather than leaving a door/window open through negligence, invalidating their insurance? Any broken window or lock would have been cleaned up and repaired after 8 days+, and nothing to say they didnt break their own window and take photos and just say they had a break in.

As a child we were burgled (20+ years ago). They ended up catching him from our one from fingerprints as hed done a number in the area. Obviously evidence like that deteriorates.

I get they're busy, and I get they're hot on covid right now, but it really seems their priorities are totally wrong. I hope your mum is ok

I’m going to fill in one of the complaint forms today. I’m not going to go to the local paper with (yet anyway), mostly because I don’t want to advertise the fact I have an empty building in the garden while also making it clear police don’t attend burglaries. It seems like it’s setting up trouble for myself.

WRT ‘grockle’ - it’s a word I’ve used my entire life. It’s a word people in this area use pretty much exclusively to refer to tourists. Sometimes locals complain about tourists for various reasons but there’s rarely any genuine resentment behind it, unlike the feelings for second home owners. I live in one of the most deprived areas in Europe. Using language to describe people who are almost always much more privileged than the local community is not derogatory. It really does just show up the contempt some tourists have for the locals of the places they visit when they discover they aren’t all a bunch of forelock tugging peasants who do get irritated with some of the behaviour from some of the tourists.

I would definitely report both incidents. Not attending a burglary of an elderly and likely vulnerable woman who lives on her own should not be considered acceptable.

We were burgled a few years back and the police were out within 3 hours and had someone dusting for prints a few hours after that.

Also, they're supposed to be accessible- how the hell is only accepting online reports accessible? Never mind when your laptop has been stolen. I'd go as far as saying that is indirect discrimination against older people (less likely to have tech) and those with learning difficulties (less likely to be able to submit online reports).

To be fair to whoever reported OP - they may have genuinely though that this was another break in.

To be fair to the police, they were absolute rseholes, and you should certainly complain OP, if only to pss them off.

@Ihatemyseleffordoingthis

Sorry YABU The issues are separate And you were breaking lockdown rules thoughI don't think they should have spoken to you in that way or frightened you or your children.

How were lockdown rules being broken when the OP was on her own property, where she lives?

@TheLostDiadem

I totally agree op
You really need to complain about the way this handled by the police for future reference for them to learn from their mistakes.

The police should have checked your mother was ok and given her advice/a leaflet on how to be extra security' devices for at home and out and about.

Are you under the same police department? Like living in the same area. Definitely complain, their priorities are screwed.

Police are, for the most part, shite. We've had a few personal instances where they've been useless and we work in a field where we work with them fairly often. Utterly useless, couldn't organise a piss up in a brewery.

We've recently found one decent police officer it would seem, and two shit ones. Caught a police officer texting while driving, in a heavily pedestrianised area, following another vehicle closely, on an icy road. Reported it and got the police officer who's name we knew from all the publicity he's been getting over his war against mobile phone use when driving. Turns out, this guy deliberately delayed the process until it was too late for most types of disciplinary action and claimed he didn't know the driver. New police officer takes it on, one of those specifically about police officer offences, knows the driver within a couple of hours, is furious with both and both will be facing heavier disciplinary action because he's been blocked from the lower stuff due to the delay.

mylittleorangutan yes, under the same police department. The only thing that I can think may have made a bit of difference is that the police station is about 200m from my house so super easy to just come and have a check. My DM’s house is still less than a mile from the police station though so not exactly the other side of the country!

@FixTheBone

Disgusted. But not surprised.

Our neighbours fired a gun through our conservatory, they sent a pcso 2 days later. A few months after one was taken out of the house dead, another arrested for firearms offences (letting off a shotgun) in a local pub.

3 years later nobody has ever taken any kind of formal statement from us.

Two days to respond to a firearms incident is disgraceful.

If they'd acted promptly, the incident in the pub might never have happened. And that could easily have ended in a fatality.

Unfortunately it's not widely known that police don't all do the same job, there are different sections of the police doing different roles. For example those police who attended regarding you staying in your 'garage' won't be working in the neighbourhood section that deal with burglaries that have already happened - they will most likely be response bobbies who attend any acts of crime that are happening there and then.
Unfortunately your mother didn't have someone come round the same day or the day after as the crime had happened and the likelihood of them being able to catch the burglars isn't as high as it would be if they caught them in the act or round the corner as they were leaving. So to give you a crime number (yes it isn't how you'd ideally like it to be dealt with) is helping you in the long run as you're then able to start insurance proceedings. They may have done a welfare check as they may have the impression she doesn't need one with a family helping her and setting up somewhere else for her to live in the long run. Welfare checks are usually only done on those extremely vulnerable. Ie disabilities, a previous victim of crime or targeted crime. Unless you or someone concerned has requested one they may not have seen a need for this.

The reason police attended so quickly to yourselves in the garage is likely because someone in your community has reported you for whatever reason but would have stated it as a crime that was happening at the time of being reported. Yes it's shit for you to have the police turn up in such a manner and yes the way your mothers situation was dealt with wasn't the best and has probably left her scared. But on the other hand those police have been sent to a job where they've been told that there's a crime being committed and when they attended were probably frustrated that it's actually not someone flouting covid rules and being absolute idiots - as probably reported to be - its just a mother and her children having a sleepover and they've been sent to a pointless job that they didn't need to be sent too, they probably wanted to get out of there as quick as you wanted them to leave. So asked for the information needed for them to do this. They have to log every job so asking for you to prove your address will be for them to state they gained the information needed and left.-Job done.

I do hope your mum is safe and well and you are able to possibly get some of her things back and onto property ASAP.
I can only imagine how you must all be feeling. ❤️

I'm all for enforcing the legislation - but the police should read it...

The Health Protection (Coronavirus, Restrictions) (England) Regulations 2020 state...

"No person may leave or be outside of the place where they are living without reasonable excuse..."

BUT

"...the place where a person is living includes the premises where they live together with any garden, yard, passage, stair, garage, outhouse or other appurtenance of such premises."

So it's none of their business why you want to sleep in your converted garage or outhouse.

I'm glad you're going to complain, TheLostDiadem. I can see why the police called - presumably someone telephoned to report a breach of lockdown or concerned about a possible burglary but their attitude when you explained what had happened seems rather threatening.

Also for your mum. The police weren't to know that you lived in the same town and were able to support her. I know actually investigating a burglary is not a priority but shouldn't they at least have checked she was ok or referred her to Victim Support?

I would definitely complain not about them coming out but their intimidating and threatening tone.

If they have a report they turn up. But when they realised the situation they should have dialled it down not been more aggressive.

Much of my complaint to the police was along the same lines. The threatening 'we'll be back' well great I still won't talk to you. It honestly left me feeling more distressed than the actual assault.

@smellingofroses - I feel outraged on your behalf after reading that. Your post really brought back horrible memories. I used to have a next door neighbour who used to bring back unpleasant characters for noisy all-night drug sessions. One night it all got on top of me and I ended up going around (not thinking straight!) and after words were exchanged two guests had phones shining in my face, videoing me and smirkingly saying that I’d threatened them and they were calling the police. I was terrified because I realised that they had nothing to lose, but I very much did. I didn’t trust the police to do the right thing either, because I’ve heard so many stories like yours.

Thankfully, it ended up being the council who got involved and it triggered the process that saw that neighbour ultimately evicted.

It’s chilling to read how badly things went wrong in your case. I hope you and your husband have managed to get over the experience.

I’ve had mixed experiences of actual encounters with the police. Some great, but on one very significant occasion appalling.

@saywha

YANBU

The first part is bad enough but it now seems to be the norm that break ins and burglary aren't followed up. I can't even understand the second part as you were on your own property? I hope you can make a complaint and at least get an explanation. IMHO they were in the wrong.

It's not just burglaries that aren't followed up.

A couple of years ago, I got a series of very threatening and disturbing texts and voicemails from a client with MH problems. She had disengaged from MH services and I had to report it to the police.

They didn't want to know, and refused to even log it as an incident. Thankfully, our organisation takes threats to staff very seriously and the CEO is on good terms with both the local MP and the police and crime commissioner. Forty-eight hours later, they came and took a statement, picked the client up and detained her under the MH act. She was subsequently sectioned, and it later came out that she had a history of violence and stalking-type behaviours when unwell.

A couple of months later, I had to ask them to do a welfare check on another MH client, who was very unwell, had not been responding to calls and texts and whose property was left open but didn't appear to be home. They refused and got proper arsey, asking why I hadn't gone in to check on them.

When I explained that our H&S procedures expressly forbid this (and I've been bollocked for doing it), the guy on the phone was positively sarcastic and asked me why I thought it was ok to ask a police officer to do something I wasn't prepared to do myself. Ffs - they're trained for it, and paid for it!

To give them credit, they were prompt and brilliant when my abusive ex got physical with me one morning, though.

I think I would flag up the 'threat' abotu upsetting your DCs.