Horsey AIBU - replacement of something my horse destroyed

[TashieWoo]

I’ll try and keep this short!

My horse (M) is out in a little herd of 3. He is quite playful and likes to try and dominate one of them, but equally he comes in with bite marks etc too. Not a problem (unless it gets worse) - they are horses.

One of his field mates (A) has, since the warmer weather, had to wear a special rug as he’s affected by insect bites. It’s like a Lycra material and not very robust or waterproof. It comes in 2 parts - a body and a neck.

Yesterday he came in having had the body taken off him and left destroyed in a puddle. I’m pretty sure it would have been my horse who did that but there is no evidence. I have offered to the owner that I replace said rug with something that still offers the same protection from the insects, but is more robust and suitable for turnout (also more suitable for going out with my horse).

This is likely to cost me as much as replacing the original like for like, in fact it will be more than its value as it wasn’t brand new when she bought it. There are none of her actual rug in stock until April so even if I wanted to buy one I couldn’t, but I don’t want to have to keep replacing something, especially with no evidence.

I’ve asked that she think about it and find one more suitable, but she isn’t having any of it. Having done some research last night people don’t tend to turn horses out with others in the rug she has, so it’s common knowledge that they aren’t very robust.

YABU - I should replace it with the same thing
YANBU - I should replace it with something more suitable for turnout with my horse

Duck, water. Sounds like your YO is being sensible, and although it might feel right to compensate her if you suspect your horse is the secret rug ripper, it would be giving the proverbial inch to accept liability on his behalf. Your plan to give a one-time payment, on the understanding that it's a goodwill gesture only the once, is generous, and will hopefully not lead to feelings of entitlement on her side later on. This situation is a demonstration of why it's important that a YO or YM be willing and able to lay down a clear framework of rules, and take a stand in such situations. Hands-off is great if the people on the yard are few and mutually compatible, but when it's a business with multiple clients with potentially conflicting needs, then it needs a much firmer hand.

Another here thinking that your offer is very generous. I don't think I've ever known the owner of a rug ripper paying for replacements before, though there was a bit of muttering at the yard one year when two of the geldings collaborated in shredding everyone else's rugs. And I mean shredding - I went to fetch my lad in for a feed and found him wearing the rug equivalent of a necklace with the rest of it in little pieces (the largest piece wasn't much bigger than my hand) strewn around the field.

For those puzzled by the rug removal, merlin used to do that too. He used to manoeuvre so that the fillet string was hooked over anything convenient like a fence post or tree branch or his friend's teeth. He'd then reverse backwards past it so that the rug gradually peeled inside out. Once it was up to his neck, he'd then put his head to the floor, the rug would drop down and he'd step out of it leaving it inside out and folded into quarters. Obviously he might have used a different method from your s though 😊

Lots of horses on here who can remove their own rugs!

The yard owner is very experienced, has run part/full livery yards and has a high BHS qualification, she’s an in demand freelance instructor and very good at her job. This is the first DIY yard she has and from what I have observed it’s a labour of love and she has great plans for the place. Although it’s perfectly fine as it is now, there are always improvements that can be made to any yard. She is selective about who comes onto the yard as it’s small (currently 6 owners and 9 horses, capacity for maybe 3 more horses) and she wants everyone to get on. This person has caused a stink with others on a few occasions and the yard owner asks me for advice on how to deal with her as apparently I have got it right. Kind of puts me in a difficult position but I don’t mind, I’d just rather she wasn’t like that in the first place.

There is a yard nearby that her friends have moved to (well they were asked to leave and that is another story) and it wouldn’t surprise me if she moved there for next winter when turnout will likely be reduced slightly. I hack out with her quite often but I’d sacrifice that for less drama if she carries on like this.

From a purely selfish perspective it could be argued that I want to look good so that is why I’m giving her the money, but really the reason shouldn’t matter. If anyone was asked to leave over this I’d rather it was her than me.

Plus it’s not like there are no rules, we have all signed a comprehensive livery contract, there is a worming programme etc etc, all the things you’d expect on a professional yard. DIY yards are slightly different though and sometimes people have a sense of entitlement, however this is the first time I’ve come across people thinking that because it’s a DIY yard the owners can do whatever they like (re turnout/bring in times etc mainly), in my opinion DIY means you just do all the work alongside the rules!

I think you’ve been very fair. It’s not your fault your horse ripped her rug, but equally it’s not her fault either, and it’s upsetting to find a rug trashed, especially if it’s a needed sweet itch rug.

One thing that stopped two of my geldings from play fighting and grabbing each other’s rugs was putting grazing muzzles on them. If your horse doesn’t really need one you could make the hole bigger. Hopefully in a week or two they’d be out of the habit and also the spring grass will be growing properly and they’ll have other things to think about.

I would give her the money for the damaged rug but make it v clear that that’s the last time you’ll be forking out for it. Upto her what she buys with it.

This is exactly why I only do individual turn out and wouldn’t be on a yard that didn’t offer it. Too much risk and hassle with mixed TO.

Can they be split up?

This should be moved to the tack room sub.

Aside from that, you should not be replacing her rug!! You don’t even know your horse did it! This is just what happens when you have horses.

I’d say if there is the option there of individual turnout but she chooses to turn her horse out with others, than you owe her nothing and it’s very kind that you have offered anything. I have my pony turned out with others (DIY livery too) and he came in with a bite mark today, just one of those things. I wouldn’t dream of charging anyone else if something happened to his rugs whilst turned out.

My horse used to remove her own rugs.

I once spent a cold hour on a dark morning walking round a very large field looking for it.

If it's a sweetitch rug how can she be sure the horse didnt shred it itself rubbing on fences and trees? I've seen a horse suffering and was so itchy it shredded the rug it had on. If it's the lycra style I thought they were designed for indoor use so not to get wet, a warm horse in a damp rug is a recipe for itching! It certainly doesn't sound like it should be turned out in it. Absolutely agree offer to pay for it once whilst making it very clear you wont again, and I would think hard about putting yours on individual turnout to stop this kind of worry in the future. Horses are expensive enough without paying for someone elses

If I was a horse I'd be a rug ripper - it sounds fun.

Is there no other way of keeping insects off him?

Personally I think £60 is too generous. I’d offer £50 max, with the expectation of giving less. You only need to replace like for like, so the cost of a 2nd hand item max - she isnt entitled to betterment with a brand new one

Her horse could easily have rolled and escaped out of the rug that way, especially as he's an itchy type , may not have been your horse at all

Thank you all, today I’m just going to give her £60 cash in an envelope, have settled on that and if she makes a fuss, so be it!

Honestly every week for the last few weeks there’s been a different drama with her and I’m sick of it. And everything she says is barbed, it’s like she always has an agenda. Can’t bear the woman.

@Cakeandponies it is a Lycra sweet itch rug and on the snuggy hoods website it says that they can be turned out in them. But common sense says they aren’t as tough as a normal turnout rug and so they could get ripped, also they aren’t properly waterproof.

The funny thing is, she has 3 of these rug sets so has spares, and her horse MUST wear them, yet yesterday he went out naked. It seems she’s only really affected by things she has to pay for and she is always contradicting herself like this.

Why are you giving a woman you despise money? Especially as you legally don’t have to as you weren’t at fault. She’s winning here. You’re being a mug.

I would rather just refuse to engage with her going forward and distance myself. Cut ties, you don’t need such theatrics in your life. It seems like the rest of your group have sussed her out too.

You know the solution don’t you - you need a second horse, so your first has a friend to go out with but there’s no dealing with the awkward other owners.....

Yabu because you shouldn't be replacing it at all.

You shouldn't have offered. Horses are horses, they destroy things. Mine destroys his own rugs, he takes them off. She needs to either accept that or put her horse into a field on its own if she's going to be precious.

I’d be loathe to replace it. You’re setting a precedent, surely? The minute the next one is destroyed, she’ll be back asking for another replacement. She definitely ought to consider individual turn out.

And btw, I emailed Snuggyhoods the other day to ask them to start producing the 🐑 print again. They’re thinking about it!

I wouldn’t have paid a penny.

She either needs to get her own individual field, have some more robust and less chance of being damaged or accept shit happens.

A long time ago my sons horse was in with one of those. Even when we moved him to a seperate paddock "he must ge grabbing it over the fence" . Then he died and the drugs carried on getting ripped . We reckoned she would blame his ghost.

It’s lovely of you to offer to contribute, but I do worry you’re setting a slightly dangerous precedent for the future. Most owners are fairly aware that if you turn your horse out with others these things can and will happen, horses will be horses at the end of the day! What happens, god forbid, if her horse comes in with an injury? Will she expect you to cover the vet bills too?

@ShesMadeATwatOfMePam

She should put her horse on individual turnout if she doesn't like the fact that sometimes horses cause damage to stuff. Why should your horse be moved if he's happy? I bet she would still find her precious rug gets ripped or otherwise damaged.

I think you've been incredibly reasonable offering to pay for it and i certainly wouldn't be paying anymore.

This. I've owned rug rippers and been the victim of rug rippers, and took the attitude horses will be horses. If I put a rug I don't want damaged on one of mine, then they are turned out only with others I own or alone to avoid this exact situation.

I've never known the owner of a rug ripper to pay for damaged rugs so I think you've been very generous!

Make sure it's the first and last time you hand over any cash. You don't even know if it was your horse that did it.

Sweet itch rugs are notoriously easy to rip. If she's that concerned then she probably needs to have individual turnout.