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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

Does this situation count for forming a support bubble?

27 replies

BirdHedge · 21/02/2021 22:41

Looking for advice as to what the general consensus is.

Couple, A & B, no children. A has a disability and B works from home full time to be able to be their sole carer. A is on the CEV shielding list and they have both shielded since March. B has shielded totally with A to be able to look after them. They have not been to a supermarket/been to visit people/formed a previous support bubble/eaten out during the summer or had people in their house since March. They were advised to not stop shielding. When rules allowed, they had people to visit in their garden, using back entrance, sitting 3m apart, bringing their own drinks and not using the toilet.

They are coming up on 3 months now with no other human contact as they had no previous support bubble when people where still allowed one bubble, due to others understandably only wanting a bubble with people go inside houses. Unable to exercise with others under the new rules due to A’s disability and B for not wanting the risk of running next to someone. Sitting in an accessible park is ok for A. But visiting in a garden is safe and manageable but currently against the law in both England & Wales.

Welsh law states a single capable adult in a house with full caring responsibilities for another adult can bubble with another household in a support bubble. This would mean they could visit another couple in England (Live near North Welsh border so need to satisfy both laws). Wales allows travel to support bubble if nearby and on the border. 5miles away.

English law states “ you are the only adult in your household who does not need continuous care as a result of a disability”.

A uses an electric wheelchair and needs accompanying out the house. But A has full mental capacity and understanding/communication. Does the English law read that you have to be mentally incapacitated to form this bubble? Does the English law read that B can join with another family but they have to go alone and leave A behind? Or can A go with B? What counts as continuous care? Is it someone who needs full manual handling/feeding/toilet ting/communication only? Or if A is independent in the house this does not count?

The bubble is only seeing people outside in the two houses, due to being CEV A is still at risk so it’s to be able to have some contact.

Photo’s Red - English government law, Yellow - Welsh law.

Voting - Do A&B qualify for a support bubble in both countries?
YABU - Yes they can form a support bubble
YANBU - No they cannot form a support bubble

Does this situation count for forming a support bubble?
Does this situation count for forming a support bubble?
OP posts:
WhatWouldPhyllisCraneDo · 21/02/2021 22:43

The way I understand the rules is yes, a support bubble is allowed.

Hamsandwich2 · 21/02/2021 22:46

Yes, bubble allowed!

LouiseTrees · 21/02/2021 22:46

Yes, you can form a support bubble

BrilliantBetty · 21/02/2021 22:48

Allowed.
Does person A want to form a support bubble? And B?

If yes, then do it. You're only talking outside, anyway. And it's only on MN that everyone sticks 100% to the letter of the rules at all times and thinks the police are going to come issuing criminal records for a 3m outdoor chat.

CastleCrasher · 21/02/2021 22:55

Allowed. I suspect a number of the yanbu probably also agree but have misread your labelling. While reading your post I expected yanbu to be the "allowed" option

Original poster
BirdHedge · 21/02/2021 23:25

Thanks, I couldn’t work out which way to word the voting!

OP posts:
Original poster
BirdHedge · 22/02/2021 09:58

Bumping for the day crowd

OP posts:
Racoonworld · 22/02/2021 10:01

Yes, if A needs continuous care (cannot be left alone) then yes they can form a support bubble. Doesn’t matter if it’s physical or mental disability.

NewScone · 22/02/2021 10:08

Yes, bubble up!

rainylake · 22/02/2021 10:48

Yes it is allowed.
We have formed a support bubble with my parents on a similar basis (my dad has full mental capacity but cannot be left alone at all and can do nothing for himself). The support bubble has been a lifeline for both of them.

Original poster
BirdHedge · 22/02/2021 14:44

@Racoonworld A can be left alone indoors/unsupervised so figured didn’t qualify to form a bubble.

OP posts:
Racoonworld · 22/02/2021 14:49

[quote BirdHedge]@Racoonworld A can be left alone indoors/unsupervised so figured didn’t qualify to form a bubble.[/quote]
That may not be allowed then. The wording is if “continuous care” is needed, if they can be left alone inside then they don’t need continuous care and therefore can’t bubble.

Original poster
BirdHedge · 23/02/2021 15:24

I wish they would expand on it. A simple sentence like “a definition of continuous care is xyz”

OP posts:
Racoonworld · 23/02/2021 15:32

I think it’s worded like that so people can use judgement slightly. The support bubble is allowed so the person giving the care can have some other interaction, as support and a break from giving the continuous care. If the person giving the care feels like they need it then they can form a support bubble.

Original poster
BirdHedge · 23/02/2021 19:32

Thank you, the people in the support bubble work in a government type role so any covid rule breach could mean loss of job.

OP posts:
Original poster
BirdHedge · 26/02/2021 19:43

Bumping for more views

OP posts:
MeadowHay · 26/02/2021 19:47

I understand 'continous care' to mean 24/7 care i.e. disabled person cannot be left alone. If that doesn't apply to A then no, not eligible for a support bubble. I believe it's like this on purpose as huge swathes of the population have a disability and if every household with a disabled person had a bubble, well, you can imagine.

Original poster
BirdHedge · 26/02/2021 19:58

Thanks, that’s what I understood it to be. But then it says to allow the carer to go see others, but then phrases it as the carer can only go alone to the bubble but then who is looking after the 24/7 person!

OP posts:
MeadowHay · 26/02/2021 20:47

Yes, but disabled person may be in respite care some of the time or have other e.g. paid carers looking them some of them time. So this would enable the carer some social contact during these times.

TingTastic · 27/02/2021 01:33

Just because it’s allowed doesn’t make it any safer. COVID doesn’t know if you are acting legally or not

StarCat2020 · 27/02/2021 02:32

I wish I had someone to "bubble" with.

Apart from going to the pharmacy once a month I see no-one and go nowhere.

Sciurus83 · 27/02/2021 04:42

I think it is fine to bubble in this situation, they should go ahead. Is the CEV person vaccinated/getting vaccinated? I would worry about this more.

Spikeyball · 27/02/2021 07:01

"Just because it’s allowed doesn’t make it any safer. COVID doesn’t know if you are acting legally or not"

I hope you have not left your house for 3 months then.

Changesorter · 27/02/2021 08:11

Christ. We have formed a support bubble with my best friend's and her family because she has cancer and we look after her kid when she goes into hospital. Everyone has mental capacity but the kid needs looking after when she needs her husband to drive her to treatment
Just do what you need to do within safe parameters and quietly go about your business

ChasingRainbows19 · 27/02/2021 08:28

I’m a rule follower: I go to work (in a hospital) and I come home, I go shopping. I visit my dad with shopping but leave it outside. We go fo walks. That’s it. But there’s only two of us so we can without need for bubbles etc.

However in this situation surely this is fine? We have people making ‘bubbles’ all over the show for no real reason and often several different ‘bubbles.’ All not allowed so I can’t see why this wouldn’t be ok. People need support. Also by the 29th March people can be in gardens again anyway.