To not tell the DWP???

[BoomBaBoom]

I'm on ESA, the new style contributions based ESA. In the work relatively activity group. I'm allowed to do permitted work of 16 hours a week and £140 a week maximum.

I'll only recieve the ESA until October and then it'll stop.

I have a job. In normal times it's 7.5 hours a week £65.40 so within the permitted work. But I'm on reduce hours at the moment because of Covid and Furloughed for the rest of the hours. I'm only actually working about three hours a week at the mo!

I've applied for another job which is ten hours a week and would be £87.20. If I get this job, I'll be doing 17.5 hours a week and I'll be over the £140 a week limit by £12.60. I don't really want to lose my ESA for the sake of £12.60 and 1 and half hours extra!

I'm half tempted to just not tell them if I get the job. But I'd feel awful. Would they find out? Would I have to pay the money back?

WIBU to not tell them?

Good luck with the job interview OP

• hope you get it and manage to sort your finances.

Deary me - don’t ever try to keep stuff like this to yourself! It’s never a good idea for a few quid potentially. Be honest.

What’s to gain from lying or not being forthcoming with the truth? A hefty fine and a label of fraudster. It’s really not worth it....

Isn't the whole point of the system that the more you earn the less you get in benefits? I'm sorry I'm confused as to why you're concerned about losing the benefits if you're earning more overall.
But whatever your situation, as other say, HMRC do have monthly payroll data from employers, linked to your NI Number, and DWP have a direct feed of this and can match it against your benefit information, which is also linked to your NI Number.

@BoomBaBoom

I get £297.40 ESA per month. That's a lot of money to lose.

But the second job would pay over £350 a month so you'd be better off?

@CornishTiger

Well done *@BoomBaBoom* for still working whilst managing your mental health. I do understand. I haven’t read the full thread tbh but can see a lot of ignorance on here.

Totally agree^^

Would you not then qualify for uc instead ?

@CornishTiger

For those of you not understanding it^^^

If OP earns that extra £12 she’ll also lose her allowance of ESA which is a minimum of £75 ish if not more.

OP will still be better off though.

No she won’t be. At present she gets

297.40 ESA per month ( actually OP isn’t that 4 weekly?)

She is also allowed to use the permitted work scheme and earn up to £140 a week without it affecting her allowance. Go over that and she’s lose her allowance entirely. It’s not a sliding scale with PW and contribution based ESA

@donewithitalltodayandxmas

Would you not then qualify for uc instead ?

Possibly depending on partners earnings and shy housing costs. However I can stick my neck out and say if they have a mortgage and no kids til Is unlikely to be a better off on UC.

The Permitted work scheme is generous and only a small number really benefit from it.

Yeah, so Job 1 is £257, ESA is £297 and Job 2 is £377. Based on that, if I get Job 2 I'd be better off getting rid of Job 1 and keeping the ESA. But I'll only get ESA until October so perhaps long term, it would be better to lose ESA than Job 1.

Benefit financially that is as in OPs case.

The social and health benefits of permitted work and the security of remaining on your allowance whilst you test out returning to work with your health condition are extremely beneficial

No UC. We have a mortgage and DH earns too much. We do have a child too.

Do the hours you are furloughed for definitely count? If not you would only be working for 13 hours.

If so, I would ask the current job to reduce your hours permanently, so you still have a job with them and could potentially increase your hours there again at a later date, but the total hours and pay from both jobs is still under the limit.

No she won’t be. At present she gets

297.40 ESA per month ( actually OP isn’t that 4 weekly?)

The earnings will be greater than the ESA though.

@CornishTiger

Benefit financially that is as in OPs case.

The social and health benefits of permitted work and the security of remaining on your allowance whilst you test out returning to work with your health condition are extremely beneficial

See this is why I worry about losing the ESA, I've only been back doing my job since January after being off sick for months with my illness. I worry that if my illness gets worse again like it has done, I won't have the safety of the ESA.

Sick and disabled people are punished with dehumanising forms and assessments and live in fear of reassessments because the public perception is that fraud is so high that claimants need to be scrutinised to within an inch of their life.

People who think they can play the system contribute to this state of distrust which in turn exacerbated the abuse of disabled people.

You are risking making other claimants lives miserable and justifying the tabloids demonisation of claimants for £12? Fuck that shit

£560 is 4 weekly Permitted work
297.40 is 4 weekly ESA.
Total. 857.49

Value of combined “employments” £634

No you will be worse off. You need to reduce one of the employments ( and look at it as weekly figure too and stick within the total £140)

@BoomBaBoom please don’t overstretch yourself to retake this second job mentally. You are at the beginning of your return to work. Build it up gradually abs make it sustainable.

Have you ever attempted to claim PIP?

[quote CornishTiger]@BoomBaBoom please don’t overstretch yourself to retake this second job mentally. You are at the beginning of your return to work. Build it up gradually abs make it sustainable.

Have you ever attempted to claim PIP?[/quote]
Thank you for all your comments. No I haven't applied for PIP, I was actually concerned it would make my mental health worse from everything I've heard about the process of claiming.

I've only actually applied for Job 2 because I'm unhappy in Job 1. I don't have the nicest of colleagues and yesterday I left work in tears and I'm worried if I stay there it'll cause my health to decline again. I think if I'm lucky enough to get Job 2, I'll keep claiming ESA as my security and safety net, and quit Job 1.

@BoomBaBoom

Ah. Thought it would be something like that. Can't see a way round it then. Both jobs are NMW and actually if I get the new job, I'd be better off quitting my current job as it actually pays me less than ESA, so if I have to lose one then it'll be my current job. Although, I'll only get ESA until October so perhaps it's better to lose that and keep both jobs? No option of increasing hours with either job.

If the ESA is stopping in October anyway then I'd stop claiming the ESA and keep both jobs

£560 is 4 weekly Permitted work
297.40 is 4 weekly ESA.
Total. 857.49

Value of combined “employments” £634

I can't work this out at all. Isn't the £560 what you are allowed to earn, rather than an actual earring? Adding the allowance to the ESA makes no sense, OP isn't being paid £560

That sounds like the best option for you. At least you have your ESA to fall back on if your mental health issues are making it difficult to work.
Best of luck OP 💐

@extentioncord

£560 is 4 weekly Permitted work 297.40 is 4 weekly ESA. Total. 857.49

Value of combined “employments” £634

I can't work this out at all. Isn't the £560 what you are allowed to earn, rather than an actual earring? Adding the allowance to the ESA makes no sense, OP isn't being paid £560

Makes total sense to me! As I’m sure it will others.

But you kept telling me I was wrong. Do you have extensive experience of the welfare system?

Makes total sense to me! As I’m sure it will others.

But you kept telling me I was wrong. Do you have extensive experience of the welfare system?

I was asking you to make sense of it to me for the very reason that I do not understand.

To me it looks like the £560 is what you are allowed to earn rather than what OP earns and you have added that to the ESA to show she will be better off.

You are entirely correct, I do not have extensive experience of the welfare system, but surely if you do you are able to explain to me what your figures are?

She is allowed to earn £140 a week on top of her weekly allowance.

OP is seeing them as monthly figures. They are actually 4 weekly.

The maximum income she could get from permitted work us £560. Plus she will then still keep her esa allowance in full too. Total maximum income that 4 weekly period would be £857 ish.

Her expected earnings might be £634. She will have lost her ESA allowance in full.

Therefore it makes sense to keep her earnings within the permitted work limit allowance and keep her ESA.

Permitted work and all this is explained up thread.