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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Abolishing the Monarcy.

880 replies

Helendee · 17/02/2021 12:45

Good or bad idea and reasons for your opinion?
I don’t feel strongly either way but I am curious about what aspects of becoming a Republic are more beneficial than the UK’s stable current system.

OP posts:
Anyoneelsewilldo · 18/02/2021 11:11

@AnitaB888 I’m embarrassed for you. You seem to have the inability to distinguish between a ruling monarchy and a figurehead monarchy which is what the U.K. have. And between a president who rules and a figurehead president.

Roussette · 18/02/2021 11:15

CountessFrog I didn't say that you do. I talked of the threads that end up like that.

carcarbinks · 18/02/2021 11:15

Abolish it. I think this country to too stuck in the past and we won't make progress until we move on.

Bangable · 18/02/2021 11:17

@WoolieLiberal

Some of the world’s most stable and progressive countries are monarchies...

Norway
Sweden
Netherlands
Denmark
Belgium
Spain
Canada
Australia
New Zealand

Some of its less stable and progressive are republics...

North Korea
Myanmar
Iran etc etc

Easy to cherry pick.

Some more countries with monarchies:

Saudi Arabia
Bahrain
Brunei
Cambodia
Qatar
UAE
Lesotho

I don't think anyone would describe any of those countries as 'progressive'

Conversely, there are plenty of stable and progressive republican countries

Germany
Switzerland
Portugal
Iceland
Chile
France
Austria
Finland

Bangable · 18/02/2021 11:19

@AnitaB888

Oh dear, Have non of the anti-monarchists on this thread ever heard the expression 'nature abhors a vacuum'?

If monarchy ceases to be - for whatever reason - then something needs to replace it. This may not be a better deal.

The Russian Royal Family were all shot at the beginning of the October Revolution in 1917, which then installed Lenin as a leader of a communist government. If you think communism improves the rights of the 'man in the street' and makes everyone equal - forget it.
People were still starving while Lenin had a Rolls Royce ( I've seen it in the Lenin museum in Moscow).
They had pseudo-democracy with elections with only one candidate standing.
For years Communist Party Members had 'perks' right up until the USSR was disbanded.

So all of those who whinge about the privileges of the monarchy, suck it up, the alternative could be far worse. Hmm

Oh dear Confused
Bangable · 18/02/2021 11:20

@MsTSwift

That is such an ill informed post from Anita I am embarrassed for whoever posted that
Same!
GeordieGreigsButtButtZoom · 18/02/2021 11:23

@CountessFrog

I agree. Kate is no different in theory, but she is at least respectful of the idea of monarchy.

The two are miles apart, and if you can’t see that, I’m astonished.

Oh, they're certainly miles apart.

Very different, aren't they? I wonder why it's only Meghan who gets the shit, since their relationship began and long before they left the Royal Family, which of course Harry never had any intention to do because he has always clearly loved being a royal and it hasn't cost him anything in his life. All Meghan's fault, that.

Bangable · 18/02/2021 11:24

ABOLISH!!!!!

Puzzledandpissedoff · 18/02/2021 11:25

The royal duchy is worth billions, it all goes to the state (it’s effectively an 80% tax). The royal family then get some of their money to keep themselves going - roughly 20%

The slight problem here are the reports that Charles would rather like to keep ALL of it (though I doubt he'd be keen to pay the public costs which were originally part of the arrangement before surrender in 1760)

Of course it's easy to say this would never happen, but given the RF's lobbying power and the inclination of politicians to roll over, that's not something I'd want to assume - in fact they'd probably do it just to get a pettish whining Charles off their backs

AnitaB888 · 18/02/2021 11:27

@Anyoneelsewilldo

"I'm embarrassed for you" - your embarrassment is not my concern, you are responsible for your own reactions. If my posts are so triggering then look to yourself.

I am quite aware of the differences you cite, so what is your point?

Please give me a reasoned argument instead of resorting to thinly veiled put-downs to cover up your problem with rational debate.

AnitaB888 · 18/02/2021 11:28

@Bangable

^^^ that response applies to you too.

TheLaughingGenome · 18/02/2021 11:28

There is a fixed line of succession

I find that a bit boring. I think there should be a Hunger Games style battle for succession between the House of York and the Cambridge-Windsor-Waleses or whatever they're called these days.

Like the War of the Roses meets It's A Royal Knockout. I'd pay good money for that.

silverstrawberry · 18/02/2021 11:31

I used to feel it should be abolished then I changed my mind. Friends always take me to visit Buckingham when I'm staying in London I think it's so ingrained in English heritage more than we realise and now I don't think it will ever be abolished it brings tourism to uk and has been there so long no one would have a chance to change it

Anyoneelsewilldo · 18/02/2021 11:31

@AnitaB888 ok here is a reasoned argument. The Russian royal family ruled Russia. They were deposed and Lenin and communism took over to rule Russia.

The U.K. have a ceremonial monarchy with no power who do not rule. If the monarchy were removed the country woikd continue to be ruled by its elected government.

So how on earth do you make the link between removal of a ceremonial monarchy and the potential for a communist dictator to take over the U.K.!

And that’s only picking one aspect of your frankly bonkers post. Never mind the geo political and economic landscape of Russian after the Tzar was deposed!

Puzzledandpissedoff · 18/02/2021 11:32

VisitBritain reckons that tourism linked to royal residences such as Buckingham Palace and Windsor Castle adds up to 2.7 million visitors a year

No doubt, but why would they stop coming if the RF themselves were no longer there?
Except for the deranged type who nurse the hope they'll get to meet them and be asked for tea of course, but there's no helping people like that

FingersXssd83 · 18/02/2021 11:34

Abolish. It's unfair for anyone to be born into that type of privilege and prower. Also very undemocratic. Also, aren't they just celebs now anyway? We shouldn't have to pay for that...

KeflavikAirport · 18/02/2021 11:39

So does the Tower of London, Stonehenge, Hadrians Wall, and The Cutty Sark - your point is?

Are you really so obtuse that you can't see you're making my point for me here?

KeflavikAirport · 18/02/2021 11:43

Who else would represent Britain around the globe

Here's an idea - I'll do it for the bargain basement price of a million quid a year, saving you £61 million. I'm intelligent and personable not on MN I realise, I'm an argumentative bugger on here and polite. A much better global advert for Britain all round. What do you think?

AnitaB888 · 18/02/2021 11:45

@Bangable,
You cite Chile as a 'stable and progressive republic' - are you having a laugh?

Chile closed 2019 with the worst human rights crisis since General Augusto Pinochet´s regime. Massive demonstrations began in mid-October in response to an increase on public transport fares. Given the context of the high levels of inequality in the country, the protests (most of them peaceful) expanded to include demands for a more just society in which the state guarantees rights such as health, water, education and social security. Nevertheless, demonstrations were faced with severe levels of repression by state forces that attempted to justify their use of violence against protesters by claiming that these measures were necessary to protect infrastructure and private property from being damaged or vandalised.
After the social outburst, President Sebastián Piñera declared on October 18 a state of emergency in some areas of the country. For ten days, certain rights and freedoms were suspended, and the army was deployed on the streets to carry out citizen control and public security. By the end of 2019, protests continued and the number of victims of human rights violations, mainly by National Police (Carabineros), reached into the thousands

Development projects continued to go ahead without the free, prior and informed consent of affected Indigenous peoples and the so-called "sacrifice zone" communities continued to face environmental devastation due to industrial activity. The government proposed reforms to the Indigenous Law and initiated a process of consultation with Indigenous peoples throughout Chile. Nevertheless, this process was criticized for not being conducted in good faith or respecting Indigenous cultures, which led to a suspension of the process.

I could write more but I think I've made my point.

Puzzledandpissedoff · 18/02/2021 11:46

If Charles carks it before Elizabeth, things would get interesting

I sometimes wonder if a lot of staff (and the recipients of his endless meddling) wouldn't find that quite convenient
Yes it would be interesting, but at least they've got William on hand for those who like that kind of thing

From all accounts, (the Queen's) also very frugal and manages to keep costs down

Ah yes, the old dear switching off lights and eating out of tupperware gambit
Probably she was also trying to be "frugal" in trying to dip into a poverty fund for palace heating ...

www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/home-news/queen-tried-use-state-poverty-fund-heat-buckingham-palace-2088179.html

KeflavikAirport · 18/02/2021 11:47

Anita I see your Chile in 2019 and raise you... Brexit. Britain is the least stable it's been in a century if not more.

VinylDetective · 18/02/2021 11:48

@TheLaughingGenome

The curtseying is a bit shit.
When did you last do it?
DdraigGoch · 18/02/2021 11:54

@jasjas1973

And we would have to rewrite the entire British constitution and then pay the same amount for a President to be head of state. Every country has one

We haven't got a written constitution, so having one would be a good thing.

At least a President would have some aspect of accountability, the Royalty have none.

All the monarchy provide is some sort of weird reality show.

A written constitution you say? Like in America where theirs has outdated clauses granting nutters the right to own lethal weapons and where it's incredibly difficult to get these bits removed? No thanks, I'll stick with the unwritten one which allows flexibility when times change.
KeflavikAirport · 18/02/2021 11:56

You know that other countries have written constitutions that move with the times, right?

DdraigGoch · 18/02/2021 12:12

How is Kate any different?
@GeordieGreigsButtButtZoom she's not a preachy American.

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