To be conflicted over this decision

[lemonss]

I manage a small team of about 6 people. All the team are part time and as such their hours are specifically chosen to cover me at all times (not a choice of mine I inherited the team like this).

We had a new starter in January who agreed to work specific hours. A couple of weeks in he asked if he could change hours so that he could finish earlier. In January I was told that this could be done so offered for him to start and finish earlier.

He has now come back to me and asked if he could split his hours over more days and work about 3-4 hours a day.

Now I really like this person. They are a fantastic worker and have fitted in with the team really well. They are good at their job and have a lot of experience.

However I'm worried about whether I should grant this request. Personally I'm a bit put out that they agreed to hours then asked to change them, then when changed have asked to change them again. Will this become a pattern? I also as stated above have very specific hours to make sure I'm covered and this is going to potentially cause some issues with that but nothing major.

On the flip side I understand the reasons that he is asking for a change is to cover school hours and a partner getting a new job.

My manager has said it is my decision and I'm finding it really tough.

AIBU to find it hard to come to a decision? Is it clear cut situation?

It has been a shit year indeed. There will be a lot more flexibility as a result for people and it is honorable that you want to go out of your way to help people. We need more managers like you. That being said, this request does not meet the needs of the business and is not sustainable if you are unable to take Thursday and Friday off - what if you get sick or have a family emergency on these days?

if I accommodate it would mean, unless I am given budget to recruit, that I could never take holidays on Thursdays and Fridays

And what happens when you book a 2 week break abroad?

OP you’re a considerate manager which is probably the reason he asked - but YABU. It’s a clear no.
In addition the employee’s experience presumably means that he knows the impact shorter hours will have on his ability to do the job.
What you can do is to lay out all your very legitimate reasons for the rejection and see if he can counter them. Either via a reduction in salary (if he can only do back office tasks) or getting someone else to cover etc etc.
If not then the no will have proven itself. Don’t let the fear of being seen as the ‘bad guy’ hold you back from making tough calls

I agree that I would set a time limit on this to be reviewed. Whenever I have had an employee who wants a drastic change I need to review it to see if it’s working out and it’s best to be up front about that early on. Do not change his contract hours but say you will trial with review periods and if it isn’t working (meeting needs of business and department) then it will have to revert back. If you set really clear expectations from the outset this isn’t giving in, it’s showing willing to give it a go but with a get out clause that you will have to fall back on if you find it’s a disaster

I pride myself as being as flexible as I can be and want to support my team as best I can

I'm all for this, but there's a difference between being supportive and a walkover - especially when you've mentioned about 5 reasons why it would make things difficult
You'll get no thanks if you roll over quite so readily, OP, and in the nicest possible way it might be time to stiffen your management backbone

Oh, and I'd also be wondering if they really did lose their last job "because of Covid" or if there was more to it than that

I'd have no problem with him asking. His wife has just got a bee job, it's not like he's asking just because he fancies not getting up so early. Childcare/homeschooling is such a nightmare right now.

However, if it stops you doing your job properly (not being able to get out & about) then it's really not going to work
Is it?

That's without you. It being able to take Thur/Fri off, ever. Though I think there are ways around that

3 rather than 7 hours wouldn't bother me.

If it was me, I'd have a chat with him
& see what you can come up with between you.

Not knowing all the details makes it difficult to make suggestions.but maybe once kids are back at school &'ASC is available reassess his well it's working, or not and it's your decision if he keeps the new hours or reverts to what he's doing now?

But I think not to have a talk & see what you can do, would be a bit unkind given then situation right now (wife might not have had many options but to take this job & childcare is almost impossible for most people).

I also wouldn't ban him from making other requests- life is very difficult right now & I think we need to be as kind & flexible as we can be.

I think 3 things

1. I always try to accommodate my staff, if they’re happy then they’ll work hard for me.

1. There’s a pandemic and the normal rules about being reasonable are out the window.

1. Technically by law employees are only entitled to submit 1 flexible working application in a 12 month period. Also you can agree flexible working on a trial basis so you could try it for 3 months and revert back if it didn’t work?

Surely it's about business needs? If the business can cope with it, then yes. If it leaves gaps that will be difficult for the business to fill, then no. If you agree, make it clear that each request is based on it's own merits and it is not setting a precedent

How long until his wife’s job comes first again and he requests another change or his wife’s job goes so well that he quits?

He isn’t committed and he can’t achieve anything in 3 hours.

He’s taking advantage of your kindness.

[quote lemonss]@LittleOwl153 if I accommodate it would mean, unless I am given budget to recruit, that I could never take holidays on Thursdays and Fridays or do anything away from the office (my role travels a fair bit). Although obviously not ideal I appreciate that I am the manager and therefore would have to make some sacrifices.

@Dalooah I like the idea of a trial basis I think I've been hung up on this for so many days now that I didn't even think of that!

I find the idea of better for 3 hours interesting. The job itself is based on projects with tight deadlines. As such it would mean that I could never assign him a project anymore as it just wouldn't be achievable in the times he would work. He would have to become a more back office role doing the day to day bits of the job[/quote]
From what you say about your leave and project assignments, it sounds like it wont work.

Based on what you have told us it sounds like you have good business reasons to refuse the request.

I manage 8 people and I have bent over backwards during the last year to accommodate them and help them through homeschooling and all the upheaval, but I would never approve a request that meant I could never take a Thursday and Friday off. Also the no travel, what happens if your boss says you need to be out of the office? It's sounds like you'd have to say no? Then you'd not be doing your job properly. Is there any chance it's just a temporary change while schools are closed?

As long as his output is as you would wish, what does it matter a jot to the business when he does this?

The world will be a better place when people are able to fit their hours in when convenient and at no detriment to the business they work for.

Would definitely encourage more mothers back into the workplace.

@Babymamaroon

As long as his output is as you would wish, what does it matter a jot to the business when he does this?

The world will be a better place when people are able to fit their hours in when convenient and at no detriment to the business they work for.

Would definitely encourage more mothers back into the workplace.

Because the op has said their output would NOT be the same. In fact they can't do the job they're hired for. They wouldn't be able to work on any projects due to the time constraints so would have to only be assigned back office stuff.

It also means she can't ever leave the office on a Thursday or Friday. Which directly impacts her work which involves travel. as well as not being able to have any week long holidays etc.

Op- does the Thursday and Friday thing effect others in the office too or just you?

As long as his output is as you would wish, what does it matter a jot to the business when he does this?

Since OP said the requested hours would mean she'd no longer be able to give them projects - that in fact they'd become more of a back room worker - this doesn't seem to be the case

FWIW I also back flexibility in the workplace, but post Covid when companies are building back from the ashes, I'm expecting it will become a lot harder. As I said on another thread, seen in the rearview mirror expectations prior to 2020 may seem like just a dream ... especially when so many will be after the available jobs

@Babymamaroon

As long as his output is as you would wish, what does it matter a jot to the business when he does this?

The world will be a better place when people are able to fit their hours in when convenient and at no detriment to the business they work for.

Would definitely encourage more mothers back into the workplace.

Brilliant. I look forward to undertaking my HR role overnight whilst there are no staff to disturb me.

Hope my accountant doesn’t decide he’s only going to work on Tuesdays between 8pm and 9:30pm from now on.

I’m sure dental appointments at 3am are going to be an absolute blast.

Can't you just say, yes you can work those hours but if I ever need to work away or take leave on Thurs or Fri then you agree to flex your hours and cover them for me? Assume you give him a weeks notice or whatever to sort out plans?

The reason given by your employee is to cover home and school.
Just say yes whenever possible is my view. It's a shame you have to set such rigid hours/ patterns. I know it's dependent on role but it would be much less of a ball ache if you could say to the whole team that they just need to meet their outputs, and can flex their hours as long as they stay on top of the job. I absolutely hate rigid hours and it's especially unrealistic in the pandemic

@Babymamaroon

As long as his output is as you would wish, what does it matter a jot to the business when he does this?

The world will be a better place when people are able to fit their hours in when convenient and at no detriment to the business they work for.

Would definitely encourage more mothers back into the workplace.

Did you miss the bit where it meant that the OP would never be able to be away on Thursdays or Fridays? Or she couldn't give him any project work?

Well a main reason for declining change of hours/flexible working is that it would have a detrimental effect on the business.Not being able to give him project work to do and a staff member not being able to take a full weeks holiday, sound like fairly concrete reasons to me.

I would go back and ask him if he can change the request so that he still works in some capacity on Thu/Fri, if you think there's a way of him doing that. If there isn't then decline it.

This guy sounds a bit cheeky to me. Not many people would be so forward as to ask for 2 changes in the first few weeks of a new job. Is he still on probation as l have a feeling this won't be the last request and that there's always going to be something with this guy.
If he can't do the projects he was hired to do then it's a No and he should be aware of this himself.

I would say no tbh , you have good enough reason . This would be raising red flags to me .

It might have been really difficult for him to ask for a second change and perhaps he is really struggling to cope at home with juggling it all? Could you arrange a meeting to discuss the first and second requests to get some more understanding instead of doing it via email? I know many people who are scared of requesting a change to their hours as they are scared of losing sacred jobs during this pandemic and everyone is under so much pressure from all angles :(

However, obviously it has to work for the business too!

I find the idea of better for 3 hours interesting. The job itself is based on projects with tight deadlines. As such it would mean that I could never assign him a project anymore as it just wouldn't be achievable in the times he would work. He would have to become a more back office role doing the day to day bits of the job

Surely this alone is a cast-iron reason to say no. He was recruited for one job for which he was needed, now he wants to do a different job which doesn't fit your needs. Presumably his girlfriend was job-hunting when he applied to you. They should both have worked on the basis that either she would have to take his working hours into account for job-hunting purposes, or they would have to find alternative childcare solutions.