How is the expression ‘an Indian’ not offensive?

[Yellownotblue]

As in, an Indian take away or delivery meal.

I find it quite odd to hear one specific type of cuisine referred to like this. Would you say “ we’re going for a French tonight” or “he invited me to his place for an Italian”? Somehow it seems dismissive and disrespectful.

For full disclosure, I’m not Indian but my husband is of Asian ancestry and our children have dual heritage. I’m British (first generation migrant). I was born and brought up in North America and can’t remember the expression ‘an Indian’ ever being used as short for Indian food before I moved to Britain.

Careful there snowflake. Dont want you melting.

Don't know about anyone else but I really fancy an Italian now!

@saraclara hear hear

Seriously, let it go. I’m not trying to trick anyone, I’m just exploring a language issue. Why the need to paint me in a corner as a racist?

Why try and paint terms used by most of the country as racist?

Still trying to figure out why putting an article in front is offensive. Is it because it implies that we are literally going to eat an Indian/Italian/Chinese/Mexican/Lebanese person?

I'd say "we're having a curry".
For full disclosure, I'm half Indian and have never worried or spent time worried about the phrase "I'm having an Indian tonight". 1. Coz no one here had ever said that. And 2. If they did, I'd say "crack on and enjoy l!"

People may not say 'going for an Italian' as much as they say 'going for an Indian' but people definitely refer to 'the local Italian'.

You've never heard of it? It's everywhere. Look on Deliveroo or just eat as examples - cuisine broken down into American, Chinese, Italian, Mexican, Indian, Thai, Lebanese, Japanese/Asian, Spanish, Greek. It's how you name cuisines all over the world. In every country in fact.
If your interested in linguistics try looking up the definition "A cuisine is specific set of cooking traditions and practices, often associated with a specific culture or region."

I live at the intersection of many cultures - my birth country’s, my husband’s, the country where we live (U.K.), the country where we used to live (China). It’s FINE to ask questions about cultures. Shooting people down as “woke” does everyone a disservice.

Great! I love cultural interchange So.... Now could you answer my question my question about widespread US use of “retard” and “handicapped” and why they are considered acceptable?

@bitheby

Do you fancy Italian? Yeah, let's go to the Italian.

Maybe British people just can't be bothered to speak in full sentences.

Do you fancy Italian what? Shoes? Architecture? Swimsuit models?

Go to the Italian what?
Cinema? Apiary? Massage parlour?

I'm not going to pretend that the average linguistic skill in this country is particularly stellar, but what you've written is no better than "We're going for an Italian."

@saraclara

You're doing a lot of back pedalling, OP. First your OP is about racism then you claim you're only interested in linguistics. Then you refer to Chinese and Indian being lesser cuisines, but later say you don't think they're lesser.

Why not just say, "okay, looks like I was wrong"?

I never said Indian and Chinese are lesser cuisines. Honestly, did you not notice the quotation marks, or are you ignoring them on purpose?

Why don’t you just say “looks like I’ve got it wrong”?

Christ on a bike.

The insinuation that the British at large view Asian/ethnic food as "lesser" is frankly offensive.

Indian food is the most popular cuisine in the UK.

I think the distinction between eating in and taking away food being the deciding factor in who gets referred to as an/a food is correct. It's not a racial thing.

You're coming off as one of the professionally offended, OP. And an internalised racist.

Good look.

@RickiTarr

I live at the intersection of many cultures - my birth country’s, my husband’s, the country where we live (U.K.), the country where we used to live (China). It’s FINE to ask questions about cultures. Shooting people down as “woke” does everyone a disservice.

Great! I love cultural interchange So.... Now could you answer my question my question about widespread US use of “retard” and “handicapped” and why they are considered acceptable?

I’m not American so will let Americans answer for themselves.

These are not terms I use personally. And I genuinely don’t see why you are trying to make this into a debate here. But a bit of whataboutsim never hurt anyone, eh?

Whatever you do @Yellownotblue, don't even ask about Scouse - it will make your brain explode.

It's an accent, a dialect, a particular dish and a person from a particular city in England.👍

@FFSAllTheGoodOnesArereadyTaken

I do sometimes think it's odd that a massive country with different regional cuisines is condensed down to one word...but then these restaurants market themselves as say a Chinese takeaway rather than a Szechuan takeaway. Round us the 'Indian' restaurants that market themselves as such are actually mainly Pakistani. If they feel they have to market themselves as something they're not because it goes down better with white British customers then no that's not great...but on the other hand I've heard people say they are going out for an Italian, Thai, a Mexican, and yes a French (restaurant not takeaway if that makes a difference).

Ok but in the U.K., we have takeaways that specialise in Szechuan cuisine, cantonese cuisine, Sicilian cuisine, etc etc.

It's also well known that well known dishes such as chicken tikka masala were created in the U.K. from Bangladeshi chefs new to the U.K., when this country had very little in the way of international cuisine to use as a benchmark.

Maybe it's ok to acknowledge that as people migrated to the U.K., they brought with them some properly tasty food that went down well with the people on their settled country, and meant they could earn a good living, even if it's not how it would actually be made if you were in your home country?

So now, several generations in, we've got a bit of hybrid cuisine that funds livelihoods and tickles tastebuds. That's how things evolve.

No food that is brought from one culture to another can ever be truly authentic.

I mean have you seen the YouTube video of the American woman demonstrating how to make 'British Tea'?

"Why don’t you just say “looks like I’ve got it wrong”?"

Oh the irony of that statement 🤣

Seriously, let it go. I’m not trying to trick anyone, I’m just exploring a language issue. Why the need to paint me in a corner as a racist?

says the person who has literally started a thread, accusing eveyone who uses everyday UK terminology, as being racist........

I can't believe you can't see the irony of your posts

Pinkfreesias what's a full Scottish?

Phal is from Birmingham. 😁

Americans say "spaz" and it's not considered offensive as it is in Britain. You can read the historical and cultural reasons as to why this is the case online. It's really interesting.

From Wikipedia:

The difference in appreciation of the term between British and American audiences was highlighted by an incident with the golfer Tiger Woods; after losing the US Masters Tournament in 2006, he said, "I was so in control from tee to green, the best I've played for years ... But as soon as I got on the green I was a spaz." His remarks were broadcast and drew no attention in America. But they were widely reported in the United Kingdom, where they caused offence and were condemned by a representative of Scope and Tanni Grey-Thompson, a prominent paralympian. On learning of the furore over his comments, Woods' representative promptly apologized.

Soo... what's your point OP?

@MissingLinker

We, that's their point? That "Do you fancy Italian?" is not a complete sentence!

You're both being facetious, though. Both of you know exactly what is meant by "an Italian" in the context of food, and pretending otherwise is ignoring the fact that language evolves. In modern British English, the phrase "an Italian" is broadly accepted as meaning "an Italian meal" or "an Italian restaurant" in the right context, and as it is broadly accepted, it is correct!

Been mulling this over and my only linguistic interpretation is that "an Indian" or a Chinese feels in my head like a complete dining experience from starter to dessert, so it's a thing. Whereas Italian or other cuisines might include other European dishes so is a little more generic. Maybe cos I am old Indian or Chinese seems like more of a special, exotic event, especially if authentic - as in food prepared and eaten by the ethnicities themselves. It feels a bit magical and a bit of a privilege if I'm honest.

So from my POV the absolute opposite of "lesser" .

Full Scottish is lush.

Adding quotation marks doesn’t negate the term lesser. I think it’s you who doesn’t understand how they work.