If you come from a normal/non abusive background..

[heylol]

I come from a not great background where lots of abusive and downright strange things went on. I always knew something was wrong...but over the years, especially with talking to others about their backgrounds it became clear to me that I have no idea what normal actually is.

As I try and process and move on from everything I worry that I'm blowing it out of proportion and making it harder for myself. Surely even happy, well adjusted, supportive families have things go wrong?

So my question is, if you would say you come from a great family and had a good upbringing, get on well with your family etc. what is the worst thing that has happened within that rosy picture?

I'd also be interested to know what dynamics you have if you have a happy family.

Our dynamic was that my dad was an extremely angry alcoholic and my mum roped me into trying to manage that and at the same time pretend it wasn't happening. I am guessing that isn't most people's experience?

I love my parents to pieces but I grew up around a lot of alcohol so I'd describe my childhood as dysfunctional.

I’m from a healthy home, the adults around me were great and even when they weren’t, I know they were doing the best they could (my mum was certainly depressed for a patch).

The worst things that happened to me as a kid were when I was a toddler, knowing I was chubby/porky/built for rugby. Wasn’t allowed to do ballet because I was the wrong shape. Compared to my sister and cousins. I vividly remember being in nursery and being embarrassed about my size. I wasn’t supported to be confident, my mum always went on about how small her waist used to be. Things like that.

Then to compound that, we moved around a lot over a short period of time and what I now know was a stress response, I started sneaking food and eating in the loo. Thus I got addicted to sugar and the fat thing became a reality! Just unpicking all this now in my 30s.

Not to hijack the thread OP but those of you who grew up in homes that were not dysfunctional or abusive, did people shout at one another? Is that normal or always abusive?

I had a really lovely childhood with siblings I got on well with, well off parents that cared for us and treated us well.
But my dad had an affair, my mum used to shout at him all the time. It was horrible. She also had a drink problem which killed her at 68 a couple of years ago.
She was never drunken abusive, we never went without, very nice family but just beneath the surface things weren't as perfect as everyone might have thought.
I still, despite all that, consider my childhood to be a good one. I was and am very loved.

heylol

I have thought a lot about why my resentment landed more on my mother than on my father: I think a lot of it had to do with temperament: my dad (when he was alive) and I were very similar: extrovert, direct and confrontational, while my mum was quite passive aggressive and very repressed. Her solution to all these problems was always indirect and coded and I found it very frustrating as it struck me as rather dishonest.

That said I went through an abusive marriage with a (much more serious) alcoholic, which has since ended. I did have the strength to walk away from it, from which I'm grateful, but it did give me an insight into the dilemmas which you face on a daily basis when your partner has a problem with alcohol. I still ultimately think she should have had the guts to leave him but I now recognise that where children are concerned its not black and white.

To answer your question I don't think the feelings will every leave you altogether but I think as you get older you tend to develop more empathy towards your parents and realise how difficult it was for them.

I had a happy childhood and am close with my parents, siblings and wider family.

Dad did shout sometimes and they went through a bad patch when I was about 15 of lots of arguements.

Very happy memories of primary school, then DB was born and DM lost her DB was I was 12. That was the worst thing that happened DM was depressed for I think a couple of years. School wasn't great and they didn't pay me or DSis much attention.

I was much happier from year 10 and did well in my GCSEs which I remember them being very proud of. Later on DSis developed an eating disorder, but I was already at away at University by then so it affected me less.

We all have our issues DB is obese, Dsis is in a controlling relationship. I am a bit of a control freak myself. But we love each other and would do anything for each other.

I come from a stable, happy background. Parents still together, never seen either of them drunk. Never seen my dad angry or lose his temper.
My DB's ex (they have a child together) has a father prone to angry outbursts, I don't know if he's abusive though, he and DB's ex would often fight and fall out. My mum was telling me about this, she said all the men in her life have been quiet and gentle and respect women, she said 'I can't be doing with volatile men'.
When Attila says 'What did you learn about relationships growing up'? Well I learnt volatile men aren't to be tolerated. My relationships have only been with calm, respectful men who have a work ethic and aren't alcoholics.

Happy childhood and close family still now.

Some things which might be what you're looking for ...

• mum hitting me with a broom. The brush part. Can't remember why, I must have been naughty. Only happened a few times

• mum nipping or pinching my arms if I'd been naughty or talked back

• mum always comparing me to other kids (school kids or kids on tv) and saying "you should be more like that/why cant you be good at xyz"

• dad was a lazy alcoholic and mum would wait on him all the time. Us 4 kids did too.

• I'm the youngest of 4 and dont remember a lot. But my brother and dad had shouting matches. Dad hit my brother and he weed himself for example . (My brother told me this last year )

Dad died when I was 11. I think if he hadn't then my child hood could have been bad. I wonder what it was like for my siblings as there's an 8y age gap between me and my nearest sibling

Shouting is definitely "normal" in my Italian family :-/

Snap again on the angry alcoholic father - seems a pattern here! He didn't drink every day or anything, mostly the weekends until the end of the marriage when he started drinking more often. He always drank to excess though and he turned into a horrible, at times scary, man when drunk. Although he could be horrible sober too sometimes. He wasn't physically violent towards my mum but he would threaten it on occasion and he would hit us.

My mum divorced him but not until I was 17 or so. In hindsight she really should have done it sooner but her own family dysfunction meant she too didn't know what a healthy relationship should look like.

It's only since having my own DC that I've really unpacked it all, as if you'd asked me 10 years ago I would have said I had a happy childhood! In spite of the above dynamics there was a lot of happy times. My mum was incredibly loving and patient. We had nice holidays and days out. Despite not having much money we were given lots of opportunities and had tons of hobbies, lots of laughter, friends and family always around. My dad was actually really fun at times so it's a real shame he had that awful side to him which means we're NC with him now and he'll never know his grandchildren.

My sisters and I are all in stable marriages with no abuse whatsoever. We all have healthy boundaries and no mental health issues so in that sense it hasn't messed us up. In fact it's probably because of our parents marriage that we gravitated towards men who were nothing like our father. Who knows. It's really not all black and white is it?

I don't think its quite as binary as "abusive vs non-abusive", though. Obviously an abusive family is traumatic and damaging in a way that a more well-adjusted and loving family isn't. But there are lots of shades of grey and its possible to grow up with warped views and boundaries even if you have a "normal" family.

Exactly what @thepeopleversuswork said.

I would certainly never describe my upbringing as 'abusive', but my parents were simply not very good at life, had far too many children for what they could afford (both emotionally and financially), and as the eldest, the first life lesson I learned was that not only could my parents not protect me from bad stuff, but that if I told them about it, all they did was worry, dither and not act, which actually made things worse, not better, because the fundamental situation hadn't changed, but I had my mother awake all night worrying about whatever it was, but apparently unable to act.

This was not their fault they were both from very poor, dysfunctional backgrounds themselves (though both would be shocked if someone told them so!), and I now believe my father is not neurotypical, and neither had any idea that anything other than food and clothes were needed for children but no eight year old should have to feel protective about her parents, and to keep being bullied and sexually assaulted to herself because she knows they aren't equipped to deal with it.

I think there are probably a lot of other children out there who are like I was -- under the radar because their family background is not abusive, they're clean and fed and housed and clothed, but unprotected and quietly getting on with being bullied or something else because the grown-ups in their house don't have the bandwidth to deal.

And yes, @HitchFlix -- having children makes you revisit a lot of things. I have made absolutely certain to have a very different life to that of my parents, and to make sure that my eight year old understands that I have his back and am absolutely prepared to act to resolve situations.

@Bananalanacake you know it's interesting you say that. I think some people have these euphemisms to describe volatile men that romanticize something that's actually bad. In many ways I think my mum consciously picked my dad because of these romanticized ideas.

So you know the angry, volatile, alcoholic bully is the life of the party, complicated, intense and "a real man" who "puts food on the table". The person who is rude and cruel becomes outspoken and direct.

My relationship now is with someone who works and earns a living, like I do. He just doesn't expect the whole world to fall at his feet on account of it. I think that sort of threw a spanner in the works of my relationship with my dad because he and my mum have always maintained that he was the way he was because he had to have a job and earn money.

I get that work/money can cause stress and worry. I do have sympathy for that but there was certainly an attitude of "I work so I get to act how I want and treat people any way I see fit." When I grew up and started working they stopped saying that. It's just an excuse.

I would have to really scrape around the find truly bad things about my childhood..... My dad was a bit shouty when angry but this was reserved for when we had done something pretty naughty tbh.

@HitchFlix Absolutely it's not black and white. Are you NC with your dad because he won't adjust his behavior around your DC?

I would say I had both a happy and unhappy childhood. Came from a huge family, so lots of people to love and look out for me. There was no neglect, sahm, holidays etc.

However I would describe my dad as emotionally abusive towards me. I was an incredibly sensitive child who needed parenting differently to my siblings. I never got that and my mum never stood up for me. I think she was a bit scared of my dad. I have had very poor mental health in the past and attempted suicide multiple times.

I am in recovery and feel better than I ever have. It has definitely impacted how I parent my own children. Also relations with both parents. They are good now but ironically it is my mum I have struggled with the most as an adult. My therapist says it is feelings of adandonement and deep disappointment at the one person supposed to be protecting you, not.

My parents split when I was a teenager. Although upsetting at the time it was an amicable split and my parents would attend parents evenings together, celebrate mine and my siblings birthdays together...and now me and my siblings are grown with families of our own they celebrate Christmas and New Years with us together too (except for during Covid times, obviously). They get on with my each others partners etc.

Their separation was hands down the worst thing that happened in my life. And although amicable and knowing both my parents love and support me, I still would say it had an impact on me at the time. And I am absolutely determined I will never put my DC through that.

I can't imagine what it would have been like if I'd also had abuse or parental addiction or neglect as well.

You know that famous Larkin poem, This Be The Verse? For most people I think there's some truth to it. No family is perfect, no parenting is always wonderful, no childhood is entirely idyllic. We're all just humans, we make mistakes, we have different needs and wants and ways of being. I am probably somewhat biased- I work in mental health, I see many, many families who have done everything the general MN consensus would be is "right", but certainly haven't got the outcomes they want. Lots of families who can't get their heads around the fact that they are financially secure, no addiction issues, no history of major mental illnesses, no DV, stable partner relationship, kids attend 'good' schools and have always been sent to a plethora of activities, parents pride themselves on not shouting, etc, and yet at least one member of the family is in crisis and pain and feels that a lot is lacking.

Our dynamic was that my dad was an extremely angry alcoholic and my mum roped me into trying to manage that and at the same time pretend it wasn't happening

I think that’s very widespread in families with an alcoholic member/members and it’s part of the ‘family illness’, eg alcoholism affects the whole family.
My mother spent her life walking in egg shells and insisting we did too. If anyone said anything that she thought might upset my father she would frown at them and shake her head to warn them to be quiet.
Of course none of this made any difference - alcohol made my father rude and abusive and unreasonable whatever anyone said or did.

Goodness, alcoholism is such a bugger and the circumference of its blast field is enormous. Everyone in our family was damaged by it and many others besides.

But yes to answer your question, worst (and ironocally best) thing to happen to me in childhood was parents divorce. They did not have a happy marriage and I have very few fond memories of them together. Sp was happy when they announced the divorce.

However, it was not remotely amicable. Custody battles, moving from family home and moving area altogether, my siblings and I being used as go betweens and delivering bad news to parents who didnt take it well. Textbook how not to divorce really.

I’d say my upbringing and background was fairly normal. I did hear my mam shouting in the early hours once “don’t you say that to me you drunken bastard” to my dad and that has stayed with me, but otherwise all been normal, mother slightly bonkers, been SAHM since she had kids and my dad always worked and retired now. Seem to like each other more now than when I was young.
She used to have the bath run for me when I come home from school and it was raining or have a cuppa and digestives waiting. I always loved that.

@Stonehopper I can relate to what you're saying. Both my parents were from pretty bad backgrounds but wouldn't say that themselves. I get the impression they thought as long as they did better than that it was fine.

In my parents backgrounds very little focus was put on discussing or even acknowledging emotions, even though everyone has them. So you had all these adults in charge of families and problems and every time they felt anything bad they went supernova and made it all ten times worse. Both their wider families are full of people who lived terrible, miserable lives. I always thought it was so tragic that they all stuck to these rules and ideas of how to live life when literally everyone they knew who had done that was a disaster. I suppose in a round about way that has produced a positive for me in that I'm quite open minded and I won't keep doing something for the sake of it.

Are you NC with your dad because he won't adjust his behavior around your DC?

No heylol he was actually lovely to my eldest. He's surprisingly great with babies and young DC, always was apparently. I was pregnant with DD2 when I started reflecting on my childhood and realized I couldn't forgive him for all the shitty things he'd done and decide to cut him out because of it.

The last time I saw him I had to drop some paperwork to him and he'd been drinking. My mum was in the car with me. They have always been amicable since the divorce (about 14 years previously) but this was probably the first time since their marriage that they'd seen each other while he'd been drinking. When he saw her it was like a switch flipped. He was really sneery and disrespectful towards her and it was shocking to see. He'd always been on his best behaviour with us since the split so I had forgotten what it was like. Horrible man. It gave me the rage and brought everything to the fore and so that was that. A switch flipped for me too and I haven't seen him since and blocked his number so he can't contact me.

So he's never met my second child and DD1 doesn't remember him as she only 1 when I went NC. It's a relief really. I'll be honest with them when they ask and hopefully they'll see that they don't have to keep abusive people in their life regardless of the family ties.

My friends would have said that I came from a very happy, middle class home. But at home it was really different - my mum and dad would have rows about something stupid, and then stop speaking, sometimes for months at a time. We'd have conversations like, "ask your Dad for the chequebook", or "tell your mum I'm going out". The stonewalling was always started by my dad, but my mum rose to it and did it back. There was always a simmering tension or resentment and I couldn't quite put my finger on it. They never split up (catholic) and both died by the time I was 34.

Later on at a family wake, my godmother (mum's friend, dad's cousin, who had introduced them both), tipsily told me that after my younger brother was born, my mum just stopped having sex - didn't see the point, etc. My dad felt that she'd married him just to get two kids. My parents were in their very early 30s at this point. And that's really when the problems started.

I've never married or had kids, although in my late 40's I now have a partner. I decided that I had to keep communicating - no going to bed on a row, no saying no to sex without a reason, and I'd invest into my relationships on an ongoing basis. I know my parents loved me, and probably that was probably the main reason they stayed together, but I have sworn I'll learn from their mistakes and won't have a relationship like they had.

@Andante57 yes the "blast field" of alcohol abuse is a good way of putting it. I'm an alcoholic myself now. That's created a lot of resentment in me because I kind of feel like I was fed to the disease but at the same time, the only person picking the glass up is me and only I can put it down.

My dad liked to party but didn't really have any friends so we would have parties at home where me and my mum were supposed to sit and drink nothing or just have one while my dad got wasted and ranted and lectured and we had to act like this was great because otherwise "he wouldn't like it" as my mum would say.

So kind of like you were saying there is this need to manage the emotional state of the alcoholic that everyone gets involved in but it doesn't stop them, if anything it makes them so much worse because they experience this fake reality where they get kid glove treatment and embrace the illusion that they're normal/right.