Page 3 | to be utterly shocked and heartbroken at how many intelligent, lovely friends and acquaintances have totally bought in to the radical global conspiracy theories...

fuschia2000 · 2021-02-07T18:58:43+00:00

Seeing so much conspiracy stuff on Facebook threads, its totally alarming.... the folks can really make a good argument, with pseudo science, lots of data etc but we are looking at radical q'anon right wing conspiracy theories breaking through into the normal discussion groups and online groups.....

shouldreallynamechangemore · 07/02/2021 21:50

I think what sets these believers aside is that they never say "I don't know". I am fully aware that there is corruption, powerful groups, nefarious people, selfish interests etc. but I would never be arrogant enough to say I know exactly how the world works. It would take a lifetime of research to have any kind of theory. It took me months to research a dissertation on a very specific period in the history of one country! I am just not won over people who have definite answers to everything and no self doubt. The world is complex.

MrsToadlike · 07/02/2021 21:50

Yeah as previous poster said about anger...

The few people I 'know' who have gone down the conspiracy route path seem to be really angry. It's really sad to see.

mymadpuppy · 07/02/2021 21:58

Tbh though the "great reset" isn't really a conspiracy because they talk about it openly?

ChestnutStuffing · 07/02/2021 21:59

Functionally I think a lot of it comes from too much information. It's actually impossible to have much sense of the whole on any subject.

And yet experts are also a problem, because since the 1960s it's been increasingly clear that they are not always reliable. There really are conspiracies, people giving bad science for money, etc.

At the moment, many political types are attempting to hide behind science too, so they can claim they are doing what since says rather than making political decisions about weighing outcomes. People sense that it is untrue and it undermines what information there is.

As soon as you see the media - not crazy stuff but mainstream things like BBC - really spin a narrative, you realise that they could be doing the same about anything.

So where does that leave you? Right in the middle of crazy.

But these people who go around claiming that science on things like covid is clear and undisputed are making it worse rather than better. They are reacting against what they see as real science being undermined, but they go outside what science can say, or how it works, and end up undermining people's confidence more.

ChestnutStuffing · 07/02/2021 22:02

@mymadpuppy

Tbh though the "great reset" isn't really a conspiracy because they talk about it openly?

Right, that's just it.

There are people, often the ones into the idea of international government, and transhumanism, and such, many from the tech world, who are quite taken with this idea.

And in places like China there has been a massive increase in the state overseeing people's daily life, when it was already pretty bad. And you have idiots here saying we should do the same thing.

It's not strange people would see these ideas as connected.

HandlebarLadyTash · 07/02/2021 22:14

Give them time they will become normal again. are they people who are not working and spending more time than usual on the interweb?

mymadpuppy · 07/02/2021 22:22

ChestnutStuffing All based on the idea "you'll have nothing and be happy" hmm like to see how they'd implement that.

Kendodd · 07/02/2021 22:28

The great reset is just a catch phrase though, it's like build back better.

lazylinguist · 07/02/2021 22:29

Wow. Nobody I know in rl thinks those conspiracy theories are anything other than hilariously crazy, fortunately. The only time I see opinions from people who actually believe in them is in comments sections from random people. YANBU to be horrified OP. Time to take stock of who your friends are.

Lovely1a2b3c · 07/02/2021 22:32

YABU to think that people who believe that stuff are intelligent!

SpaceOp · 07/02/2021 22:40

I dont buy the "grain of truth' arguments . And actually a lot of this stuff when you look at it rationally is totally incomprehensible. But they stick a few doctors titles on or whatever and suddenly all these people who have no ability to actually think are all "ooh, yes, wellthat does make sense.

I read that long letter about the Chinese lockdown blah blah. And honestly, what shocked me is that you dont have to be an expert in anything to spot the huge holes in the argument. And yet, people I always thought of as I intelligent sensible people are reading it like it's the definitive "gotcha" argument.

LadyMayoGoodway · 07/02/2021 22:49

I worry there there’s a ticking time bomb of a mental health crisis.

My brother has severe mental health problems, current diagnosis is Schizophrenia. He is very well and has been for some time, we were chatting about all this the other night and he was asking if remembered when he was sectioned (how can I forget), the main symptoms were him stopping eating and (and this is pre Facebook), believing in Government conspiracy theories, I don’t think anything in particular, just things that he’d imagined in his head, but he was very convinced the US Government were tracking him. For this he was sectioned. He was saying can you believe the amount of people walking around in society, going into work etc. then coming home and spouting this absolute lunacy, yet he was sectioned for less. Which turned out to be quite right as he did and still does have a serious mental illness. It was 12 years ago but really have things changed so much. Concerning isn’t it.

Stripesnomore · 07/02/2021 22:51

The social media issue isn’t going to happen to everyone, only people who follow news links. If you go straight to the newspapers and just read them you are only getting the bias in the papers.

Stripesnomore · 07/02/2021 22:53

We seem to know little about social media induced mental illness, but there must be a great deal of it right now.

tara66 · 07/02/2021 23:09

Well - now not so sure about the one about Bill Gates since trying myself to restore Windows 10 after it was wiped off HP lap top thanks to an HP's ''helper''.

ElephantsNest · 07/02/2021 23:25

@LadyMayoGoodway

I worry there there’s a ticking time bomb of a mental health crisis.

My brother has severe mental health problems, current diagnosis is Schizophrenia. He is very well and has been for some time, we were chatting about all this the other night and he was asking if remembered when he was sectioned (how can I forget), the main symptoms were him stopping eating and (and this is pre Facebook), believing in Government conspiracy theories, I don’t think anything in particular, just things that he’d imagined in his head, but he was very convinced the US Government were tracking him. For this he was sectioned. He was saying can you believe the amount of people walking around in society, going into work etc. then coming home and spouting this absolute lunacy, yet he was sectioned for less. Which turned out to be quite right as he did and still does have a serious mental illness. It was 12 years ago but really have things changed so much. Concerning isn’t it.

Yes I agree there are indicators of a mental health crisis. The whole conspiracy thing reminds me of the behavior of a family member when they were seriously mentally unwell. Although I have stepped back from daily contact with family who believe these conspiracies (to protect my own well-being), I am still there for them. In the fullness of time I believe they may feel very foolish or guilty, they will struggle. They will need support when their beliefs are no longer sustainable.

EmbarrassingAdmissions · 07/02/2021 23:28

It is like having a family member who has joined a cult. It is not just what she believes but that that is all she ever wants to talk about. We feel like we have lost her and there is no advice anywhere on what to do. It is heart-breaking.

That feels like something that's distinctive and can be seen even on MN. The people with a bee in their bonnet are monomaniacal on particular themes and insert it into unrelated threads/conversations and persist with it whilst displaying no good faith in their engagement with others.

There are several disinformation reporters who have advice on how to talk to affected family members and some of them highlight the role of cult deprogrammers in influencing their thinking. There was a very interesting project recently in which 2 men set-up and interacted with QAnon (or similar) in a FB group and over time interacted with them until people got to the point where they were questioning their own beliefs and 'de-programming' themselves.

hassan-4414.medium.com/the-qanon-media-ecosystem-is-not-helping-people-to-exit-1045e0c8c8ee

www.forbes.com/sites/lisettevoytko/2020/08/26/how-to-talk-with-and-maybe-help-someone-who-believes-in-qanon-and-other-conspiracy-theories/?sh=5d3b9fd6412d

www.salon.com/2018/09/16/how-to-pull-a-friend-out-of-the-conspiracy-theory-rabbit-hole/

goldenlilliesdaffodillies · 07/02/2021 23:28

A family has gone down this route-it is really worrying to see. He's an educated young man with so much to offer, but has become obsessed with all sorts of conspiracy theory stuff, refuses to wear a mask in shops or socially distance and has been sending really nasty brainwashing e-mails about the vaccine to other family members. He's involved in a dodgy group who seem intent on spreading their message in a cult like way. It is dangerous and he seems completely brainwashed. He's dropped out of university and lost his lovely girlfriend because of this. I know a few other people like this and they all seem to be health/fitness fanatics.

tatutata · 07/02/2021 23:35

@lunar1 someone's opinions on the restrictions is not a theory, it's an opinion. There is no "truth" to how they feel about the restrictions. It's a silly comparison when we're talking about people making stuff up.

Lastfreakinglegs · 07/02/2021 23:35

www.lrb.co.uk/the-paper/v28/n07/slavoj-zizek/nobody-has-to-be-vile%3E

Have a read of this OP. Explains a bit where people are coming from to be afraid of a few global elites with too much power.

By the way the great resent build back better theme was the topic at Davos the other week. That's fact no fiction. It's fact that globalisation is now more powerful than many nations and that has implications.

Lastfreakinglegs · 07/02/2021 23:36

Reset I mean!

ElephantsNest · 07/02/2021 23:38

@Mulletonyourhead

I know a girl from my high school who’s very into it all, she’s highly intelligent though and studied law 🤷🏻‍♀️She’s convinced by the great reset angle and if you do look at lockdowns being implemented and our economies crumbling, I can see some sense in it. She’s fallen out with so many friends, separated from her husband and her family aren’t happy with her, it’s almost taken over her life now. She says it’s all an intelligence test now and the people ‘Going along with all this’ are the thick ones. She’s so angry all the time, scary times.

So sad, it reminds me of a friend. Not academic but sharp witted. She has fallen hard for the Qanon stuff and has lost her job because she refuses to wear a mask, socially distance, use hand gel, etc. She even tried to bring a discrimination case against her employer after she lost her job but it failed, unsurprisingly.

She constantly antagonized her child’s teachers, arguing that the hand washing and class bubbles were cruel and not needed because the virus isn’t real.

I know her well and I can see she is not coping, but at the same time it is hard to help when she’s so angry all the time and won’t listen to reason. It’s hard to help her with her attitude, she thinks people like me who are following the restrictions are thick. It is hard to bring myself to help when I have had to spend all my spare time so far this year arranging care for my dear Grandfather, who almost died of COVID and will never live independently again.

Lastfreakinglegs · 07/02/2021 23:38

www.google.com/amp/s/zizek.uk/nobody-has-to-be-vile/amp/